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As I keep saying you can not call a mixed breed dog a certain breed by the looks of it nor can you predict behavior by the breeds in it as it is a MIX. She said her dog is a pit mix well that is no doubt based on looks so unless she has done a DNA test on him we do not know how much pit is in there many of the pit looking dogs are coming back less then 20% pit! Nor does knowing the breed is in there make his behavior any more known then that of any mixed breed dog . Here is an article written about that subject. Take good look at the photo of the 6 siblings and how different they look because while they had the same parents their genetic picture is different just as you and your siblings are different despite having the same parents and that can also be reflected in behavior being different. You just can not say because this dog has X breed in it will behave a certain way or be a dangerous dog.
If her dog had been say a Border collie or poodle this conversation would not even be an issue and more people would be in agreement that dog fights can happen anytime you have 2 or more dogs together It does not mean either is a dangerous dog they just did not like one another for a reason none of us will ever know. I have seen little dogs get into a fight and not let go as people grabbed them. No one makes any one go to a dog park so if anyone does not like the fact there are certain breeds in the park them simply do not go and if you do just keep a close eye on your dog and call your dog if you see body language shifting from play to aggression. If your dog will not come when you call maybe it does not belong at the dog park.
As I keep saying you can not call a mixed breed dog a certain breed by the looks of it nor can you predict behavior by the breeds in it as it is a MIX. She said her dog is a pit mix well that is no doubt based on looks so unless she has done a DNA test on him we do not know how much pit is in there many of the pit looking dogs are coming back less then 20% pit! Nor does knowing the breed is in there make his behavior any more known then that of any mixed breed dog . Here is an article written about that subject. Take good look at the photo of the 6 siblings and how different they look because while they had the same parents their genetic picture is different just as you and your siblings are different despite having the same parents and that can also be reflected in behavior being different. You just can not say because this dog has X breed in it will behave a certain way or be a dangerous dog.
If her dog had been say a Border collie or poodle this conversation would not even be an issue and more people would be in agreement that dog fights can happen anytime you have 2 or more dogs together It does not mean either is a dangerous dog they just did not like one another for a reason none of us will ever know. I have seen little dogs get into a fight and not let go as people grabbed them. No one makes any one go to a dog park so if anyone does not like the fact there are certain breeds in the park them simply do not go and if you do just keep a close eye on your dog and call your dog if you see body language shifting from play to aggression. If your dog will not come when you call maybe it does not belong at the dog park.
Well, then you should start another thread on this topic. (not being sarcastic) Apparently, we are going here: Mixes = No Breed. Due to advances in DNA testing known breed characteristics that heretofore helped dog adoption agencies place animals with the appropriate families no longer apply. OK. Well, I feel knowing breeds and their mixes is important. There is no such thing as a "generic dog". I would however be curious about people's opinions on this if someone starts a thread.
It doesn’t matter what percentage pit bull the OP’s dog is, in terms of damage control.
Any 7-month dog that latches onto and drags a dog twice its weight is a menace. If its jaws and persistence even remotely resemble that of the pit bull stereotype, that is “enough percentage” to be kept from circulating among unknown dogs.
. . . say no dog parks and this is an example: PBRC does not recommend dog parks or dog daycares. There are a number of reasons why:Pit Bull Rescue Central
This info would have been helpful to the OP and it could have prevented her problem if she knew. She is also the one who identified her dog as a mix. She would know. It's too bad that others feel this topic should be censored. I see some posts were removed so I am not going to address any comments. Maybe it will help someone if they read what experts regarding PB's say.
I agree that the info would be helpful. It is also applicable to almost all dogs. One small correction - that site does NOT say "NO dog parks". Their response is MUCH more nuanced than that. I realize it would be TLDR to include everything they say - but it isn't a black and white recommendation. Every regular dog-person on C-D would probably benefit from reading that Pit Bull Rescue Central page you linked to. Because it is applicable to all dogs. And it is well and thoughtfully written.
I'm also going to quote from one of those posts in that thread you linked, because it states, very clearly, a rational and reasonable approach and understanding:
Quote:
"In a perfect world people should be able to bring Pit Bulls into dog parks, the issue is most owner of bull breeds are ignorant to their dogs potential, how to prevent an incident and how to handle an incident should it occur."
Agreed!!! Let's educate people and not tell them to keep their dogs locked up like prisoners when they haven't done anything wrong. Let's not discriminate against our own breed... Ever dog needs to be properly socialised. That means going places with your dog and properly supervising them at all times (most people don't). I think that keeping your dog away from othe dogs and people is an even biger recipe for disaster. We must train our dogs to be outstanding citizens. The only way to do that is exposure to everything.... Even dog parks.
There are many breeds that are bred for dog aggression. My herding farm collies are not friendly towards strange dogs, nor should they be. When you are working a farm, managing and protecting livestock, a strange dog is a likely threat. It is in UNDERSTANDING my dog's tendencies and instincts, and actively managing them that I become a successful dog owner. I don't take them to dog parks. There would be trouble, eventually, if I did. Most of the eastern varieties of livestock guardian dogs have a very healthy dose of dog aggression in their genes, and the size to make it stick, should it come to that. Most of the mastiff breeds are right up there, as well. All of which I mention because what is important is understanding your dog's nature and capacity.
I also wish that everyone who reads this would also read and study Rugaas' little book about dog body language*, and McConnell's books, The Other End of the Leash and For the Love of a Dog. I think the body language section in For the Love of a Dog is the better of the two books. If you understand something about what dog's are saying to each other, you can spot potential problems before they escalate and get out of control.
*(Calming Signals, or On Talking Terms with Dogs. I think they are the same book, just different editions, but not positive of that.)
You know what's odd? Taking the OP description of events and twisting it to say that they, the OP, just stood there. Please, go back and re-read the very first post, and tell me if you still think the OP just stood there and didn't do anything.
As for not calling - OP provided contact info immediately after it happened. It is probably NOT a good idea for the OP to contact the Newfie owner. A lot of people would thing that was rude and aggressive on the part of OP, and it could create MORE difficulty. I think a lawyer would probably tell OP not to go NEAR contacting the Newfie owner.
Ok.
"It lasted what seemed like 10 minutes. They were both biting each other and wrestling, and wouldn't separate. The other owner (a man) was able to get my dog fully in HIS arms, off the ground, and my dog latched onto the other dog. The OWNER was trying to pull him off of his dog, and my dog wasn't letting go. The Newfoundland was being dragged along the ground. "
The other people did ALL of the work. Then her dog latched onto another dog.
And it would be RUDE to call the person, whom helped save you and other animals and was bit by YOUR dog, to see if they are ok???? ???? Lol.
A lawyer might not like it because of admitting responsibility but any decent human would have contacted them. My dog, my responsibility. If they were to hurt someone, I would not hide out waiting...
It doesn’t matter what percentage pit bull the OP’s dog is, in terms of damage control.
Any 7-month dog that latches onto and drags a dog twice its weight is a menace. If its jaws and persistence even remotely resemble that of the pit bull stereotype, that is “enough percentage†to be kept from circulating among unknown dogs.
I think the puppy is 11 months had been going to the park for 7 months.
I asked did the other dog have any injuries? Or was the other owner the only one that had punctures? As to me that is the most important thing when there is a dog fight the bite to fight ratio some call it. I say this as my Jazz BC X cattle dog got into fights several times when strange dogs got in her face. she also picked on my deaf vision limited BC Phoenix as being vision limited she would stare at Jazz thus get jumped as Queen Jazz did not like that. I would go pull Jazz off and she would not let go of Phoenix yet she never injured Phoenix or any other dog.
Most times I have seen a fight where there were injuries they happened in an instance meaning at least one of those dogs was out to cause injury or possible kill the other but most fights at dog parks are really just scuffles and there are no injuries. If my dog were to get in a fight I would remove it from the park as once those chemicals are released in their brain it takes less to set them off again until the levels come down. I also would watch that dog carefully around other dogs and the minute I see a shift in body language call or go get my dog.
Jazz and another similar dog got into a fight one night at agility practice when we had two courses set up and they were the dogs running and at one point they were running at each other and the other dog flew onto our course and grabbed Jazz and a fight erupted. As we pulled them apart they too were not letting go of one another but in the end when we did get them apart not a mark on either dog. Dogs have fantastic control of their mouths and both of these dogs had great bite inhibition. To me that is one of the most important things you can teach a dog. Both of these dogs were dogs that loved to play tug too and I am not sure if that has anything to do with the not letting go part but it could.
So let me ask if the Ops dog looked like say a Golden retriever and the same fight happened would you be so "it should not be around other dogs"? I am not saying OP take your dog back to the park but rather if you do pay attention and step in when it begins to pay too much attention to a dog or the minute you see a change in body language. One fight does not make it a fighter or a killer dog especially being none of us know what dog started it and in groups of dogs you will have fights just as you will in groups of people.
. . . There is no such thing as a "generic dog". I would however be curious about people's opinions on this if someone starts a thread.
I strongly suggest you read Coppinger's first book: Dogs.* There ARE generic dogs. They are called village dogs.
Mixing dilutes the instinct patterns, and unpredictably so - just like coloration. Generally, tho, the instinct patterns are weaker.
*(If you read Coppinger, sooner or later you will run into Mark Derr's books or articles. Derr is broadly dismissive of Coppinger, but for all the wrong reasons. Coppinger's work was groundbreaking and fundamentally changed how we look at the evolution of dogs, and what dogs are. Derr is part of the counterswing which happens when you get any breakthrough. Ultimately, in a decade or five, science will know more, and will tell us the correct answer was somewhere in the middle all along.)
Too lazy to read every reply but you (Everyone, really) need to be alert when your dog is at the dog park. It could have been a one off fight, or as he is getting older may be less tolerant in that environment.
I can't take my dog to dog parks anymore, but when I did I carried around a squeaker from a toy. Anytime my dog was getting picked on or another dog, posturing, group chases etc., I did a few squeaks which helped to get dogs redirected. At least you gave the guy your number. 99% of the time the owner of the menace dog leaves the scene as fast as possible without so much as a sorry, are you all ok.
"It lasted what seemed like 10 minutes. They were both biting each other and wrestling, and wouldn't separate. The other owner (a man) was able to get my dog fully in HIS arms, off the ground, and my dog latched onto the other dog. The OWNER was trying to pull him off of his dog, and my dog wasn't letting go. The Newfoundland was being dragged along the ground. "
The other people did ALL of the work. Then her dog latched onto another dog.
And it would be RUDE to call the person, whom helped save you and other animals and was bit by YOUR dog, to see if they are ok???? ???? Lol.
A lawyer might not like it because of admitting responsibility but any decent human would have contacted them. My dog, my responsibility. If they were to hurt someone, I would not hide out waiting...
Insanity.
Let's go for the FULL quote, shall we? You have nothing to back your claim that the Newfie's man did all the work.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lochness
. . .
Then very quickly, my puppy and the Newfoundland started growling at each other (they were standing side by side, head to rear) and were in a real fight within a second. I and the other owner ran to them and tried separating them. It lasted what seemed like 10 minutes. They were both biting each other and wrestling, and wouldn't separate. The other owner (a man) was able to get my dog fully in his arms, off the ground, and my dog latched onto the other dog. The owner was trying to pull him off of his dog, and my dog wasn't letting go. The Newfoundland was being dragged along the ground.
We finally got them separated, the other owner and his dog got out of the fenced in area, I leashed my dog and held him between my legs.
. . .
As for OP's dog doing the biting, it is pretty clear from the description of the video* that the Newfie was initiating the aggression with dominant moves. OP's dog was acting defensively. In human terms, OP's dog said "NO", but the Newfie didn't stop. And neither owner was aware enough of their dog's body language to stop it. Neither was aware of how to break up a dog fight, either.
I still say the OP is better off not calling. They weren't neighbors, they didn't know each other before - they are strangers. If the Newfie's family is upset, and that is more likely than not, in my experience, a call from OP will quite likely only escalate any tensions. OP has already done due diligence. OTOH, you may be right - the Newfie's family might appreciate the concern. But they are strangers. AFAIC, the Newfie family has OP's number if they want to be friendly. I don't think one should expect the OP to make that call. But, whatever.
OK, so the latcher was 11 months old, not 7 months. Mea culpa.
The point about latching and dragging a dog weighing twice as much still stands. The latcher is dangerous, no matter what it looks like.
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