U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Pets > Dogs
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 12-05-2009, 07:11 PM
 
167 posts, read 522,027 times
Reputation: 160

Advertisements

It is true Grannynancy that there are alot of people who are very responsible and I know of many who have made the decision not to spay, not because they want to have litters, in fact, they have no intention of having litters. They just don't see the need to put their dog through the surgery because they are responsible and have always been successful at managing the heat cycle without incident. I take my hat off to them because I went through a heat cycle only once when I picked up a dog who I caught being dumped. She went into heat the next day so it was not possible to have her spayed until the cycle was complete. Not only was it a mess because she would figure out a way to take off whatever I put on her, but her cycle was 6 weeks long. Not that I was worried about her getting pregnant, but her personality was so aggresive during the heat, and my poor male, she cornered him so many times, poor guy would just look at me as if he was saying 'mommy, why won't she leave me alone, please help me'. She got spayed as soon as it was possible and I would never want to go through that again.

Even when I was growing up, back then spaying and neutering was not very popular. We always had male dogs and none of them were neutered. But we were responsible, they were kept in the house or yard and when taken out were always leashed. We did not allow them to roam so none of them ever fathered a litter. Maybe Europeans are just more diligent about keeping their pets from roaming?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 12-05-2009, 07:30 PM
 
167 posts, read 522,027 times
Reputation: 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by Viralmd View Post
You could have an effective spay, but you'd still have the risk of mammary cancer if you leave the ovaries. The only concern I'd have would be if the surgery was imperfect, you could potentially risk an ectopic pregnancy, which would have to be terminated or end up killing the dog.
Thank you Viralmd. This is very interesting. I really enjoy reading your posts - so very informative. This convinces me even more that for me and my situation, a complete spay is the way to go.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-05-2009, 08:27 PM
 
Location: Living on 10 acres in Oklahoma
1,188 posts, read 4,970,273 times
Reputation: 1191
Quote:
Originally Posted by Viralmd View Post
Leaving a dog unspayed puts her at HUGE risk for mammary cancer, too.
Agreed! Every heat cycle a female cat/dog goes through it significantly increases their chances at mammory cancer.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-05-2009, 08:28 PM
 
4,628 posts, read 9,285,767 times
Reputation: 4238
Quote:
Originally Posted by jj68 View Post
This convinces me even more that for me and my situation, a complete spay is the way to go.
I had the same conversation with my vet when I had a female rescue dog. He echoed everything that's been advised in some of the posts here. If I ever get another female dog, I'd do the same as you.

A while ago I read something about a non-surgical method of sterilization being worked on. Anyone know about that? It seems that would be much more acceptable (like a shot or pill) in areas where there's opposition to sterilization, especially with male dogs.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-05-2009, 09:23 PM
 
3,593 posts, read 10,703,473 times
Reputation: 5207
Quote:
Originally Posted by grannynancy View Post
The Europeans don't have the same kind of problems we have with pet overpopulation
You are very much mistaken. Have you ever actually been to Europe? Overpopulation of stray dogs and cats is a huge problem on the Continent but they do not address it as we do in the US. Just because it isn't addressed does not mean that it does not exist. For the most part, strays in Paris and in Rome are left to suffer, live & die on the streets. Thankfully, especially in the UK, there has been an effort by rescue and breed groups to promote spay and neuter programs to control the stray populations. Attached is a link to one of the best known of the NFP rescue websites for the UK. You may notice, there are quite a few dogs available.

Dog Rescue Pages - UK dog rescue homes, centres and shelters guide
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-05-2009, 09:51 PM
 
Location: San Diego
5,027 posts, read 13,435,741 times
Reputation: 4849
Quote:
Originally Posted by grannynancy View Post
The situation with cancer is that it can usually be caught and managed quickly in intact females. The Europeans don't have the same kind of problems we have with pet overpopulation and spaying and neutring is not at all common over there.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Va-Cat View Post
You are very much mistaken. Have you ever actually been to Europe? Overpopulation of stray dogs and cats is a huge problem on the Continent but they do not address it as we do in the US. Just because it isn't addressed does not mean that it does not exist. For the most part, strays in Paris and in Rome are left to suffer, live & die on the streets.
What Va-Cat said. Pet overpopulation is a huge problem in Europe. I was born and raised there and let me tell you, there are hundreds of homeless dogs roaming the streets and people don't even bat an eye because it's just so common. The Europeans also don't treat pets like members of the family and many don't let them sleep in the house. You also won't find many of them walking their dogs down the street on a leash because pets are just pets to them and they let them roam as they please. My sister was bit so many times by the stray dogs there when she was a kid that my mother lost count. Unlike in the US, no animal control is called and no one comes to get the dog. They also beat their dogs if the dog does something wrong and no one cares because that's ok by their standards. The Europeans are right in many of their ways of living, but pet care is not one of them. They are not the people I want to be compared to when it comes to pets.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-06-2009, 03:33 AM
 
3,627 posts, read 12,840,288 times
Reputation: 2698
I will have to defer on those who have been to and lived in Europe as my information is from those I have talked to from Germany

I have carried my females through heats [the first ones pre-spay as young adults] and it is not for the weak hearted. But why not be up and open about all the research on both sides so people can make informed decisions?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-06-2009, 03:35 AM
 
3,627 posts, read 12,840,288 times
Reputation: 2698
Quote:
Originally Posted by simetime View Post
I was also told that by a vet. My rotty lived 15 years until she died of cancer and the vet said that I should had her spayed. Personally I think that it would not have made a difference anyway since that is the normal life span for rotties anyway
I thought 15 was an exceptional age for a Rottie?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-06-2009, 05:22 AM
 
Location: on an island
13,382 posts, read 40,953,225 times
Reputation: 13245
Quote:
Originally Posted by MAK802 View Post
What Va-Cat said. Pet overpopulation is a huge problem in Europe. I was born and raised there and let me tell you, there are hundreds of homeless dogs roaming the streets and people don't even bat an eye because it's just so common. The Europeans also don't treat pets like members of the family and many don't let them sleep in the house. You also won't find many of them walking their dogs down the street on a leash because pets are just pets to them and they let them roam as they please. My sister was bit so many times by the stray dogs there when she was a kid that my mother lost count. Unlike in the US, no animal control is called and no one comes to get the dog. They also beat their dogs if the dog does something wrong and no one cares because that's ok by their standards. The Europeans are right in many of their ways of living, but pet care is not one of them. They are not the people I want to be compared to when it comes to pets.
Another opinion on pet treatment in Europe: Pet ownership in Europe reminds me of pet ownership in the States:
There is the letter of the law, and then there is what actually happens.
I would think that in both geographical areas, the spay/neuter trend follows socio-economic patterns, and of course there are cultural differences within all regions.

I've seen hungry feral kitties in Italy and I see them here. Probably the roaming packs of stray dogs such as I see in New Mexico exist somewhere in Europe, but I have not seen them. The same with rooster-fighting, let alone dog-fighting. People own and fight their roosters in Colorado. We all know about the dogfights here in the States.

There are plenty of people here in my neck of the woods who treat dogs just exactly the same as your description of Europeans--neglectfully.
We see and deal with the results all the time.

I was not born and raised in Europe, but I've visited regularly since 1971 and my son, who lives in France, has been there for several years now.
I stayed a couple months in England with friends. The average British pet-owner seems very loving indeed.

The Société Protectrice Animaux was formed in 1845.
In France last spring: In urban areas, we saw lots of purebred dogs on leashes, including almost all of the popular French breeds. I think it's a nice custom to allow them at cafés. We saw no strays in cities or rural areas, but they must exist or the SPA would not exist.

I've lived through one cat heat (not my cat) and one dog heat (when we were kids). Never again!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-06-2009, 06:04 AM
 
4,541 posts, read 13,143,701 times
Reputation: 2287
They are spaying dogs too young these days.

When I was looking to adopt my last dog from the Humane Society there was an adorable female German Shepherd puppy... I don't remember how old she was for sure but it seems like she was 8 weeks old... a tiny little puppy. She could not leave the shelter without being spayed. I asked if I could bring her back in a few months to be spayed but that could not be done.

Spaying female dogs too young can cause many health problems. I know of an 8 month old dog that had to be given female hormones for life because she couldn't control her bladder...

The only reason that I didn't adopt that little Shepherd puppy was because I disagreed with spaying her that young.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Pets > Dogs
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top