Next stage for Duluth"s growth........

[Camden Northsider]

Originally Posted by Clifford63

If you want a good idea what gambling might do, the city to look at is Sioux Falls. This all started with video poker somewhere around 1980. It has evolved over the years. Now what you have is little craphole "casinos" with a pawnshop and check cashing joint right next door. You see these in little clusters all over the place. I think it really pops out at you when you see it. In that creepy way where you know people are being exploited. As a whole Sioux Falls is doing well these day, so I don't want to come off like I am bashing the city. Personal opinion is that the gambling brings an entire element or sub economy with it becasue for many gambling is an addiction. In Sioux Falls, you can see it so very clearly with how the stuff is all clustered together.

Cliff, I'm glad you see this - as someone that grew up on the east side of Sioux Falls (arguably has and/or had the largest concentration of craphole casinos, pawnshops, and check cashing places), for a while I thought I was the only one that realized how detrimental vid lot is to neighborhoods - it's a horrible game with horrible odds yet people (often times poor people) feed their entire paychecks into these machines. The fact that free beer and appetizers are often offered doesn't help out the situation either. It's just another way to tax already poor people creating more poverty in what is already a very poor state. The proceeds were supposed to have been going to the schools, but ask a teacher that's worked in the district over the past 80 years if schools have seen any of the money and they'll tell you no.

However, I do think that casinos "proper" can be a great economic developer - grand casino mille lacs has completely revitalized its local if not regional economy. As is the case with SD, I am not a fan of state-sponsored or implemented gambling as it gets out of hand, but keeping casinos confined to specific geographic areas, and to the jurisdiction of local tribes can be a good thing (not to say that some of the 'ills' that come with casinos aren't there, they're just not on every corner). I could be wrong, but I believe the city of Detroit sectioned off some land in their downtown to give to a local tribe to build and operate a casino - I don't think this would be a bad thing for Duluth to do, but I'm not sure local tribes (e.g. Mille Lacs, etc.) would be too eager to support competition to the major tourist destinations they have built in close-by areas of the state.

However, I think a hub for entertainment, e.g. the Branson Missouri of the Midwest, could really work in a place like Duluth. And I think that it's already a major tourist destination regionally.

Personally, I kind of like Duluth just the way it is - I like the blue collar industrial feel that parts of it have - it's a beautiful city surrounded by beautiful scenery, but I like that it is not so polished that it feels artificial.

[aluminumpork]

Originally Posted by Camden Northsider

Personally, I kind of like Duluth just the way it is - I like the blue collar industrial feel that parts of it have - it's a beautiful city surrounded by beautiful scenery, but I like that it is not so polished that it feels artificial.

In my opinion Duluth would need a LOT of polishing currently to feel artificial, and honestly I don't think this is anything Duluth really has to worry about. With the type of revitalization happening downtown and the focus that different groups have on rehabbing old building, I'm sure the area will retain it's "industrial" charm. However, there's nothing wrong with the industrial charm being clean, safe and useful. Rotting old, unused building should not be kept in their current state for the sake of charm.

I feel Duluth would still have it's unique feel with updated roads, sidewalks and more businesses. There's a lot of work to be done.

[Clifford63]

Originally Posted by Camden Northsider

Cliff, I'm glad you see this - as someone that grew up on the east side of Sioux Falls (arguably has and/or had the largest concentration of craphole casinos, pawnshops, and check cashing places), for a while I thought I was the only one that realized how detrimental vid lot is to neighborhoods - it's a horrible game with horrible odds yet people (often times poor people) feed their entire paychecks into these machines. The fact that free beer and appetizers are often offered doesn't help out the situation either. It's just another way to tax already poor people creating more poverty in what is already a very poor state. The proceeds were supposed to have been going to the schools, but ask a teacher that's worked in the district over the past 80 years if schools have seen any of the money and they'll tell you no.

However, I do think that casinos "proper" can be a great economic developer - grand casino mille lacs has completely revitalized its local if not regional economy. As is the case with SD, I am not a fan of state-sponsored or implemented gambling as it gets out of hand, but keeping casinos confined to specific geographic areas, and to the jurisdiction of local tribes can be a good thing (not to say that some of the 'ills' that come with casinos aren't there, they're just not on every corner). I could be wrong, but I believe the city of Detroit sectioned off some land in their downtown to give to a local tribe to build and operate a casino - I don't think this would be a bad thing for Duluth to do, but I'm not sure local tribes (e.g. Mille Lacs, etc.) would be too eager to support competition to the major tourist destinations they have built in close-by areas of the state.

However, I think a hub for entertainment, e.g. the Branson Missouri of the Midwest, could really work in a place like Duluth. And I think that it's already a major tourist destination regionally.

Personally, I kind of like Duluth just the way it is - I like the blue collar industrial feel that parts of it have - it's a beautiful city surrounded by beautiful scenery, but I like that it is not so polished that it feels artificial.

There is a big difference between the little crappy casino and the big high end casinos that do draw people for entertainment. Realistically it is a wishfull thought that the state would buy into the idea. Even if they did give the green light, the investment dollars needed to put something like black bear or grand up in Duluth would be a tough thing to come across.

I agree that Duluth has an appeal as it is. That said, it sure seems like there is a lot of government in the way of progress on realistic projects. If the city can get these more modest projects done, they start adding up over time into something significant.

[fromupthere]

Originally Posted by Camden Northsider

However, I think a hub for entertainment, e.g. the Branson Missouri of the Midwest, could really work in a place like Duluth. And I think that it's already a major tourist destination regionally.

I love this idea. It'd be great to see Duluth take this route.

[skipast75]

Personally, I like Duluth the Way it is too. But the truth is that it is has a crumbling infrastructure. It has a high unemployment rate. It NEEDS to build off of it's strengths in order to overcome its weaknesses. And frankly, it has many. Like I said, the city has a charm that is sometimes overcome by its dirty, crumbling feel. Many of my friends that have visited have said Duluth is a strange place. Completely beautiful, but wow what a ghetto for how nice the city could be. Im not trying to trash talk, but its gets more apperent every time I visit. So lets move forward and continue the progress made already, by multiplying the tourism to a new level.

[brandy77]

Liquor in Lakeside would be a start. It's ridiculous that restaurants cannot offer beer and wine in Lakeside. We need to continue investing in trails and parks. We need to turn the lakewalk into a walk only and add a path for bikers and runners. Duluth's strength is the recreation and beauty. Invest in that AND be progressive about business and Duluth would take off. But I've lived here 2.5 years now and have learned people like Duluth the way it is. They don't want the development and the crap that comes along with it . They don't want change. I can understand that because I don't really want Walmart in Lakeside either.

[newcastle]

Originally Posted by brandy77

Liquor in Lakeside would be a start. It's ridiculous that restaurants cannot offer beer and wine in Lakeside. We need to continue investing in trails and parks. We need to turn the lakewalk into a walk only and add a path for bikers and runners. Duluth's strength is the recreation and beauty. Invest in that AND be progressive about business and Duluth would take off. But I've lived here 2.5 years now and have learned people like Duluth the way it is. They don't want the development and the crap that comes along with it . They don't want change. I can understand that because I don't really want Walmart in Lakeside either.

I agree. I do not want a super walmart in Lakeside either. It is just fine to build that up by the other big box retailors. The mayor announced a new plan for rebuilding the streets. Woodland Ave will be rebuilt between St. Marie and Kent Road. New streets have bene rebuilt and added to a neighborhhod feel in Spirit Valley. Good things are happening, but it is a long slow process.

Start with encouraging a business friendly atmosphere in Duluth. Lower the taxes and you will see growth. Minnesota has such high business taxes compared to other states. Duluth is so pro union it scares business away.

[SUPERPRIME]

Duluth has lots of great opportunity and little need to bcome a casino resort town.I believe there are some severe structural oversites at times i.e., no I-35 off ramps into Lincoln park,poor cennection from east downtown to the tourism of canal park,and not to knock our rich industrial heritage but the south side of I-35 between Garfield Ave and Bayfront park looks awefull as you are arriving to a supposedly picturesque city.
These are my ideas,tell me if u think im crazy:

Lincoln park- Add on/off ramps from I-35 to Michigan St., at 20th or 21st w.,also an off ramp to the Garfield Ave overpass.This would allow traffic and commerce to flow into a crime ridden dying neighborhood.With prosperity from better access the small business owners will have a better chance at success and push out the crime because it will finally pay them to do so.When I-35 came thru it isolated this area leaving it to die.

Tourism access to east downtown- It is key for tourism to mix well with the locals and creates opportunities from our influences with one another.Currently, only 20% of the Canal park touists cross over I-35 into downtown and locals do not go into the Canal park area do to parking problems and congestion.1st,2nd & 3rd Ave e., should be vacated and made into parking surfaces with large open access to Lake Walk park.These avenues have limitted value in accessing Michigan St.,and would also create pedestrian patios while adding parking beneath and accessing tourism from Canal park on top.The reason only 20% of tourists come into downtown is because they are exposed to high winds and a dangerous feeling of crossing at the unprotected and unfriendly Lake Ave overpass.East downtown Duluth is the fastest developing area of the city when you consider the $85M cancer research center,$33M Sheraton hotel,$6M theater redevelopment at former Red Lion bldg,$8M puchase & redevelopment of Greysolon Plaza,$15M redevelopment of Weiland block and the extension of the Skywalk from the Pizza Luce bldg to the Sheraton at $15M.The investment in properly conncting east downtown to the Lake Walk park and Canal park would be well worth it especially at Lake Ave & 3rd Ave e.

Garfield area- Superwood and Cutler Magner should be relocated and this area converted entirely into an ecopark.This is dificult but big picture cool and right on.To begin it should have a thick white pine forrest and the deep water slips between Bay Front park and Cutler Magner would become natural swimming ponds with water pumped from the lake over giant composting tanks to keep the water a constant 72 degree fahrenheit.This water will eventually go back into the lake much cleaner than it came out after being filtered thru natural rain gardens.There is more to this idea and it would definately need to be supported by some retail such as low lighted mini golf and casaul cafes mabey limitted camping,disc golf etc.

Well there you have it,my theories for the city that i love so much.This place is nowhere near dead and with a little vision and some structural enhancements things can be even better.Oh yeah, check out Barton Springs in Austin Tx.,which is where i began dreaming of the ecopark swimming idea at Google Earth.

[SUPERPRIME]

Duluth has lots of great opportunity and little need to bcome a casino resort town.I believe there are some severe structural oversites at times i.e., no I-35 off ramps into Lincoln park,poor cennection from east downtown to the tourism of canal park,and not to knock our rich industrial heritage but the south side of I-35 between Garfield Ave and Bayfront park looks awefull as you are arriving to a supposedly picturesque city.
These are my ideas,tell me if u think im crazy:

Lincoln park- Add on/off ramps from I-35 to Michigan St., at 20th or 21st w.,also an off ramp to the Garfield Ave overpass.This would allow traffic and commerce to flow into a crime ridden dying neighborhood.With prosperity from better access the small business owners will have a better chance at success and push out the crime because it will finally pay them to do so.When I-35 came thru it isolated this area leaving it to die.

Tourism access to east downtown- It is key for tourism to mix well with the locals and creates opportunities from our influences with one another.Currently, only 20% of the Canal park touists cross over I-35 into downtown and locals do not go into the Canal park area do to parking problems and congestion.1st,2nd & 3rd Ave e., should be vacated and made into parking surfaces with large open access to Lake Walk park.These avenues have limitted value in accessing Michigan St.,and would also create pedestrian patios while adding parking beneath and accessing tourism from Canal park on top.The reason only 20% of tourists come into downtown is because they are exposed to high winds and a dangerous feeling of crossing at the unprotected and unfriendly Lake Ave overpass.East downtown Duluth is the fastest developing area of the city when you consider the $85M cancer research center,$33M Sheraton hotel,$6M theater redevelopment at former Red Lion bldg,$8M puchase & redevelopment of Greysolon Plaza,$15M redevelopment of Weiland block and the extension of the Skywalk from the Pizza Luce bldg to the Sheraton at $15M.The investment in properly conncting east downtown to the Lake Walk park and Canal park would be well worth it especially at Lake Ave & 3rd Ave e.

Garfield area- Superwood and Cutler Magner should be relocated and this area converted entirely into an ecopark.This is dificult but big picture cool and right on.To begin it should have a thick white pine forrest and the deep water slips between Bay Front park and Cutler Magner would become natural swimming ponds with water pumped from the lake over giant composting tanks to keep the water a constant 72 degree fahrenheit.This water will eventually go back into the lake much cleaner than it came out after being filtered thru natural rain gardens.There is more to this idea and it would definately need to be supported by some retail such as low lighted mini golf and casaul cafes mabey limitted camping,disc golf etc.

Well there you have it,my theories for the city that i love so much.This place is nowhere near dead and with a little vision and some structural enhancements things can be even better.Oh yeah, check out Barton Springs in Austin Tx.,which is where i began dreaming of the ecopark swimming idea at Google Earth.

[SUPERPRIME]

Duluth has lots of great opportunity and little need to become a casino resort town.I believe there are some severe structural oversites at times i.e., no I-35 off ramps into Lincoln park,poor cennection from east downtown to the tourism of canal park,and not to knock our rich industrial heritage but the south side of I-35 between Garfield Ave and Bayfront park looks aweful as you are arriving to a supposedly picturesque city.

These are my ideas,tell me if u think im crazy:

Lincoln park- Add on/off ramps from I-35 to Michigan St., at 20th or 21st w.,also an off ramp to the Garfield Ave overpass.This would allow traffic and commerce to flow into a crime ridden dying neighborhood.With prosperity from better access the small business owners will have a better chance at success and push out the crime because it will finally pay them to do so.When I-35 came thru it isolated this area leaving it to die.

Tourism access to east downtown- It is key for tourism to mix well with the locals and creates opportunities from our influences with one another.Currently, only 20% of the Canal park touists cross over I-35 into downtown and locals do not go into the Canal park area do to parking problems and congestion.1st,2nd & 3rd Ave e., should be vacated and made into parking surfaces with large open access to Lake Walk park.These avenues have limitted value in accessing Michigan St.,and would also create pedestrian patios while adding parking beneath and accessing tourism from Canal park on top.The reason only 20% of tourists come into downtown is because they are exposed to high winds and a dangerous feeling of crossing at the unprotected and unfriendly Lake Ave overpass.East downtown Duluth is the fastest developing area of the city when you consider the $85M cancer research center,$33M Sheraton hotel,$6M theater redevelopment at former Red Lion bldg,$8M puchase & redevelopment of Greysolon Plaza,$15M redevelopment of Weiland block and the extension of the Skywalk from the Pizza Luce bldg to the Sheraton at $15M.The investment in properly conncting east downtown to the Lake Walk park and Canal park would be well worth it especially at Lake Ave & 3rd Ave e.

Garfield area- Superwood and Cutler Magner should be relocated and this area converted entirely into an ecopark.This is dificult but big picture cool and right on.To begin it should have a thick white pine forrest and the deep water slips between Bay Front park and Cutler Magner would become natural swimming ponds with water pumped from the lake over giant composting tanks to keep the water a constant 72 degree fahrenheit.This water will eventually go back into the lake much cleaner than it came out after being filtered thru natural rain gardens.There is more to this idea and it would definately need to be supported by some retail such as low lighted mini golf and casaul cafes mabey limitted camping,disc golf etc.

Well there you have it, my theories for the city that I love so much.This place is nowhere near dead and with a little vision and some structural enhancements things can be even better.Oh yeah, check out Barton Springs in Austin Tx.,which is where I began dreaming of the ecopark swimming idea at Google Earth.