25% of american children now living in poverty (bankruptcy, credit, buying)

[SoCalCroozer]

Originally Posted by Rich_CD

I'm fairly sure they would need to be able to think so that they could learn to think. I guess they are just plain stuck.

Let me rephrase that..........acquire the necessary skills and cognitive ability to THINK CRITiCALLY! Critical thinking is a skill and not something all too easily "learned". Happy now "rich"? LOL.

[plaidmom]

Originally Posted by Rich_CD

That's true. I don't know why so many people think when someone acknowledges something exists, that the person is engaging in what they are acknowledging?

Originally Posted by Rich_CD

Does anyone know of something we can do to get started changing that?

Oh I agree. And yes, we as a society need to work on single-parenting. It's not "bad" (let's drop that lablel) it's just TOUGH. I had money(widowed) and it was still hard.. I don't think it has to mean marriage, per se, but we need to keep MEN involved in their children's lives whenever possible.

If there are no MEN willing (or able) to step up to the plate(such as my case), we need to start looking at more innovative options. My personal belief is that 2 or 3 (or more) single mothers co-housing and sharing resources and responsibilites are better off than the single mom going alone. It would be really wonderful to bring some of the older generation into this as well. Let's also stop "warehouseing" our old. Grandma Power!

Also, let's stop this silly political play-acting. GOP? Listen UP: The war on Planned Parenthood? KNOCK IT OFF. PP does more to prevent both unwanted children and abortion, single-handedly, than any other group.

In fact, if you are against your tax-dollars being used to support poor children, you should pull out your check-book, or log onto Paypal, and send than organization a contribution today.

We need to look long and hard at our prison system. Too many daddies locked up for stupid crap. Violent criminals, I get it. Possession of a couple of ounces of pot? Stoooooopid. Those are people who could be out working. And we are spending wayyyy too much keeping them locked up.

Finally, we, as a country, just gave the super-wealthy an extension of their tax breaks. The idea was that they would then create more jobs! Awesome! NOW we need to hold them (and our elected officials) accountable for that. No more jobs=no more tax breaks.

[Rich_CD]

Originally Posted by SoCalCroozer

Happy now "rich"?

Oh... Maybe. If you were to have a pizza delivered to me then I would be happy.

[nightbird47]

Originally Posted by Mircea

They can rent an apartment. If they can't then that raises the issue that one or both parents have felony convictions for violence or drug abuse including possession and sale with intent to distribute, which might preclude them from renting some apartments, and that would mostly be in large apartment complexes, or apartments that are owned by property management companies.

Did CBS check their criminal histories? It don't cost nothing to do that. If CBS didn't, then that is typical of the sloppy reporting CBS does.

What about family? The parents have mothers and fathers right? So that is at least two alternative places to stay, and being America, it's likely that one (or both) parents have a mother/step-father and father/step-mother. They can move in with them. Or with their siblings, aunts/uncles, cousins. If they're in another State, then they can sell some of their belongings for Greyhound Bus tickets to get there.

Yes, it's called a "community;" something you destroyed (but probably don't regret it -- at least not yet).

Why must they rent a house? Why can't they rent a cheap apartment?

They could probably find a trailer in a trailer park somewhere.

What about CraigsList?

"Family of four seeks to share apartment with family of four"

My parents grew up during the depression, and because they knew deprivation and hardship, they instilled in me the value of money and material things, and more importantly, how to make good financial choices and the discipline to not buy every single thing I see on a credit card like a 2 year old does.

How do you know those involved spent money like a two-year old? You don't. If you lose your job today even if you did make good decisions you could still end up homeless. Don't make assumptions.

You can't rent an apartment anywhere I've lived without a good credit check. That was in southern California and I assume it to be the same in any suburban/developed area. Here where I live now you could, but there are few jobs too so coming here isn't going to help. And it has nothing to do with criminal backgrounds. Even if you can show the income the apartments which are well kept want good credit or a co-signer. They also want a chunk of money for a deposit, cleaning and other fees likely never to be seen again. I know. That was the very first thing they checked and I had to have a cosigner. Also many who go to motels have been evicted. Apartments won't rent to you if you've been evicted even if you have the income now. There may be some which will, but where I lived there were none, at least in a part of town you'd want to live in.

And who says they have parents who can take the kids? We don't know. Lots of times parents have their relatives take care of the kids while things get worked out but it isn't always possible. This is by no means a given. Maybe the grandparents couldn't afford it either. Or are not in good health. Many who are older are suffering even more.

And just how did I personally destroy this community? No clue here.

That family of four will have a tough time finding an apartment they can *legally* share with someone else. Not only do cities have limits, but their hosts can often be evicted if they overcrowd the place. Most rental agreements define how long a "guest" is defined. Longer than that they have to go on the agreement.

Mobile home parks are just as picky and have fewer controls. Usually you have to *buy* the mobile home. And on top of that pay space rent. If the state defines how often it can be raised a few words hidden in the contract you sign can negate it. I ended up homeless because of a mobile home park. They are better off renting a motel by the month than that.

And my parents BOTH grew up during the Great Depression. My grandfather left my grandmother with two kids to raise herself and no child support. She worked serving samples at the grocery store and there was NO extra money in that household. My dad left the farm at 16 to join the navy. They did instill values in me which are important and have served me. I do not see why those who have fallen victum to the current mess of an economy have to be villified as if they deserved it. My grandmother didn't. She was lucky that the house was paid for or maybe it would have been worse. But she would never have vilified those who were less lucky than them, and infact fed those who didn't have any food on her own dime. She didn't make comparisons.

She would be the first to say you have to learn and grow but she would not say being hungry was good for kids either.

[newenglandgirl]

Originally Posted by nightbird47

We're talking apples and oranges here. The great rise in poverty has not been because there are more poor people who were poor before, but from the collapsing economy and people who had jobs and things and still have the things but no job. As a previous poster said, its hard to sell 'stuff'. The newly poor do not go out and buy toys for the kids, they try to keep the lights on, buy food, and deal in necessities. They juggle bills. Toys are the bottom of the list.

When I was married, we lived on my husband's disability and the dribble from our home business. You would not have known it from the toys my son had, (not electronics, but kid toys) because we shopped thrift shops and used sales. He didn't care. So even if you see lots of toys it doesn't mean they broke the bank to buy them.

We need to stop *assuming* that because someone has a phone they are spendtrift. Or if they have a nice car they bought it instead of food. Nobody can look and tell if the family was poor five years ago or just had the bottom fall out yesterday. When the money isn't there for food, morgage/rent (shelter), and basic utilities, what you have left over is immaterial. If you have to decide what not to pay its a condition of poverty even if a month ago it wasn't like that.

We need to start recognizing that *people* are hurting and lose the kneejerk reactions. Especially in this time, I still wonder just how much of that is fear fueled given that most of the middle class people trying to get food stamps and assistance did not ever think it could happen to them. Guess what? It can. So how much of that is deflected/can't possibly happen to me fear?

Nightbird, thanks for this post. It tells it like it really is. It is ridiculous to assume that everyone now in poverty is in a single parent home, is into "entitlements," should own absolutely nothing not even a phone, etc. Last year I saw kids in dire poverty somewhere in South America holding up cell phones in the rubble of where they lived. Others got laptops from some agency or foundation. Actual money for the roof over one's head and the food in one's mouth (and childrens' mouths) is the real measure of poverty. In America, the "haves" are stuck with the stereotyped image of parents on the dole who are lazy and stupid. It's a changing America, folks. Get used to it (and therefore but by the grace of God....)...

[newenglandgirl]

Originally Posted by Rich_CD

That's true. I don't know why so many people think when someone acknowledges something exists, that the person is engaging in what they are acknowledging?

You don't get it. It is not that there are or are not plenty of single parent homes that are in the poverty zone. Nobody disputes that there are. It's the cavalier flippant statement that "single parent homes (across the board, everywhere) are the culprit." These kinds of comments show the intelligence level of those who make them.

[newenglandgirl]

Originally Posted by SoCalCroozer

Let me rephrase that..........acquire the necessary skills and cognitive ability to THINK CRITiCALLY! Critical thinking is a skill and not something all too easily "learned". Happy now "rich"? LOL.

And "critical thinking" does exactly what for the middle (and yes, upper) class folks unemployed and unable to find decent paying work?

Maybe I'm misreading his post (hope so), but it sounds like he is now equating intelligence and ability to think with having a job - LOL

[Rich_CD]

Originally Posted by newenglandgirl

It's the cavalier flippant statement that "single parent homes (across the board, everywhere) are the culprit."

You would need to look at each home individualy to know for sure.

But, I wasn't commenting on that.

[plaidmom]

Originally Posted by newenglandgirl

Nightbird, thanks for this post. It tells it like it really is. It is ridiculous to assume that everyone now in poverty is in a single parent home, is into "entitlements," should own absolutely nothing not even a phone, etc.
.

Hellloo, upper-bracket taxpayers: want the poor to "get a job"?

Guess what they need? Yep a PHONE NUMBER. Also sometimes, clean professional clothing.



Next time you feel like whining and complaining about your taxes, put a jobless/homeless person on your cell-phone plan instead. It's like what? $5 bucks per month??? Your morning latte cost's more than that! Think of the money you'll save long-term if they find a job. You don't have to enable texting or web access if you cannot afford it.

Or does it just feel better to whine and complain and do nothing
and feel sanctimonious, superior, and entitled?

[newenglandgirl]

Originally Posted by Mircea

There's no poverty in Appalachia. Those people can move their asses anywhere they want in the US. They just have to want to, but they don't, so excuse me if I don't get all bleary eyed about self-inflicted, um, "poverty."

The above statement shows a sad lack of facts.




From the Appalachia Service Project website

"...Automation in the mining industry coupled with competition from the outside, cost more than 84,028 miners their jobs between 1980 and 1990.

Real unemployment in some areas rose to 50%. Between 1940 and 1970, over seven million people left the region to find work in southern and northern cities. 26% of West Virginia's population aged 18 to 25 left during the 1980's. The loss of jobs and the out migration has resulted in less revenue to support a faltering infrastructure that is vital to attracting new businesses to the area.

Economic development is seriously hindered by inadequate school systems, roads, and public utilities, lack of good accessible land, and insufficient medical care.

In the 24 county area served by ASP...

26% of the population live at or below the poverty line.
55,541 households have an annual income of less than $10,000.
4,341 housing units lack complete plumbing.
2,382 homes do not have complete kitchens.
31,236 households do not have a vehicle
19,254 households cannot afford a telephone.
Absence of telephones and vehicles, compounded by physical isolation, create serious accessibility problems for health care and emergency situations.

Hunger and malnutrition are a hidden disaster for many of the region's poor. Rural residents pay up to 30% more for their food from local merchants who cannot offer the prices found in most major supermarkets. Pride and physical isolation coupled with lack of public transportation keep many people from applying for food stamps. In a ten-county area in southwestern Virginia, 90,197 families qualified for food stamps in February 1992; however only 51,649 received food stamp assistance...."

Yes, the difference is several hundred thousand federal employees in the US Department of Health & Human Services whose very jobs depends on playing word games, semantics, and numbers games to ensure they continue to have a job (with outrageously ridiculous pay and benefits).

And you do what, for what, and definitely deserve it?

My function on this Planet is not to subsidize other people's life-styles. The so-called "poverty" thing is a life-style issue, not one of meeting basic needs.

Yes, people without money for housing and food just love making that choice. It's a cool lifestyle to see your kids without enough food. Parents love to blog about it.

Recognition? You can't get past that because there is no poverty, and fortunately millions of people like me recognize that there is no poverty.

Yes self-important people love believing this.

Basic needs, food, clothing and shelter are being met. So long as that is the case, there is no poverty. In the few exceptions where those conditions are not being met, it is self-inflicted poverty.

The statements continue to become more ignorant and arrogant. How does one stand living with her/himself after saying this?

As far as "will" I don't care. It's about reality, and the reality is that if you give an idiotic moron $1 Million in a few months you'll have a bankrupt idiotic moron in, um, "poverty" again.

You want me to hold people's hands through every second of their life? Then you need to start paying me. A lot of money. A lot.

Wow man, you're over the top. And so cool.

Well fortunately for your there's another 1.6 Million in projected foreclosures this year.

As I have said repeatedly, the world is changing (for the better) and your way of life is over and your standard of living is going to continue to decline....

What are you, some martian sending messages to earth? So you admit our standard of living is declining....hmmmnnn....


....CBS also refuses to report things that people really need to know. A bogus claim that 25% of children are living in "poverty" is not something that people need to know.

Of course not, because mainstream media should not be telling any truths, shame on them.

That Raymond Davies is Blackwater/XE employee under contract with the CIA and assassinated two Pakistani ISI operatives, and that your government is violating the Vienna Protocols by claiming he has diplomatic immunity is something you need to know.

If that is true, it is yet another thing that should be reported. Your source?

There are 50 States in the United States plus another 190+ States in the world. They can do what Neanderthals had the common sense to do and that is hump it to another location where they can thrive and prosper.

And that other location would be...?? a third world country where they will have the privilege of working for a lousy tax evading corporation paying 50 cents an hour?

You need to plan for "job loss" and that means if you don't have 6 months of savings in the bank to cover every single one of your expenses, then you don't do it.

Then you don't do what? Continue to live?


If that means you need $32,000 to cover 6 months of expenses, then guess, what? You put $32,000 in the bank.

And that means if you have to quit eating out 38 times per week and quit paying $300/month to rent or buy DVDs or go to the cinema show, then that is what you do.

And the person or household making $32,000 a year to meet those exact expenses gets that amount in savings from where?

It's part and parcel of a concept called "making a short-term sacrifice to obtain a long term benefit."

Oh.

Those people refused to make any sacrifices whatsoever, and that's why they are screwed every which way but loose. Hopefully, they will learn something, but I seriously doubt it.

Why don't you write a book?

But they weren't hunting out-of-state or out-of-country. Got to look at the big picture and think outside the box.

And that country would be....? And those jobs would be....?

No, they are suffering because they REFUSED to make short-term sacrifices.

Like you did.

Well then child protective services should remove those children from the families. There is no excuse whatsoever to not have food. They're eligible for food stamps. There are food pantries and other private groups that provide food assistance.

Yes, and the rise in the use of food pantries and shelters and survival centers is pretty impressive. There's only so much to go around. But since you made the right choices, you don't know what too little food feels like to a kid these days

There is no "new poverty."

Ahem. Listen up, everyone.

They can rent an apartment. If they can't then that raises the issue that one or both parents have felony convictions for violence or drug abuse including possession and sale with intent to distribute

Wild imagination you have, nice try!

Did CBS check their criminal histories? It don't cost nothing to do that. If CBS didn't, then that is typical of the sloppy reporting CBS does.

OMG, now everyone is poverty is a CRIMINAL. That explains everything!

What about family? The parents have mothers and fathers right? If they're in another State, then they can sell some of their belongings for Greyhound Bus tickets to get there.

Very creative suggestions. No one has thought of that.

Yes, it's called a "community;" something you destroyed (but probably don't regret it -- at least not yet).

Again, the prophetic voice from another planet.
What you've personally done for "community" would be an interesting topic.




Those children need to know real hardship and deprivation.

Of course, since they are at fault for the stupidity and greed of their politicians.


I mean let's face it, before the event of a few years ago, a hardship to the majority of Americans was someone not responding to their e-mail or text message within 3.287 seconds.

I do have to ask myself why I am responding to this post

My parents grew up during the depression, and because they knew deprivation and hardship, they instilled in me the value of money and material things...

Aw, shucks, wish I and others had the same values instilled in us. But being the bums that we are, we missed the boat...


So tell us again how impoverished they are. The simple fact is that to refuse to include the non-cash benefits (and cash assistance in the case of single mothers who have men living with them) is nothing but a lie.

Depends on the cash value of the benefits in relation to the number of people in one household receiving them. $30-40K in benefits? Where is that, Ohio?

You might want to seriously consider "pulling a Castro," revoke the citizenship of 3 time felony offenders and kick their ass out of the country to free up some money to help those who are trying to help themselves.

I thought, according to your ideas, we're not supposed to help those who are trying to help themselves?

And the perennial welfare pukes, give them a passport and a one-way plane ticket to the country of their choice.

We are not for the most part talking about perennial anything. Your views of the welfare state are stuck in the past.

No kidding. I live in Over-the-Rhine about 200 feet from what was until 6 months ago the deadliest street in the USA. I see those kids nearly every day walking to the market or riding the bus to the VA hospital. They're all decked out in the latest hip-hop fashions, $200 Nike shoes, iPods, cell-phones and tons of gold "gangsta" chains.

That may be one profile that you observe. There are many other profiles that you insist on glumping in with this one. You are obviously petrified with and disgusted with crime and criminals. The profile today of a family in poverty is not criminal....they are not lined up on a wall with their mugshots posted for "Wanted."

The price of those hip-hop pants alone is my clothing budget for 3 years, so again, excuse me if I don't get all misty-eyed about the plight of the so-called "impoverished."

You don't know that they think they are impoverished. And please get out more around the country and see how poverty manifests in many, many ways, not just the stereotype of the welfare family owning great cars and electronic gadgets. While some of your views are justified, you do injustice to your own thinking and to the society's problems at large by one-dimensional perspectives. Maybe do some reading

Some responses.