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Some people put themselves in that position by leaving a perfectly supportive home at 18 so they can be "independent". For those people I have no sympathy. You're stuck paying rent without having a full time job and you have the rising costs of college to deal with.
We shouldn't have to deal with the rising costs of college. That's whats burdening the recent new workers to the workforce. They're graduating with basically mortgages, slowing their ability to buy a home, further depressing the economy.
The cost of college has greatly outpaced inflation, and it has nothing to do with teacher salaries. Much like my local public school district, and many across the country, it's administration. Even the local town office has excessive administration. But nobody ever looks at administration for cuts.
My personal experience with administration at all levels of education, is that they employ some of the most inept people. They also tend to have redundant positions (local high school has fewer kids then when I graduated, but hired another vice principle. Attendance is largely automated, still two people in the attendance office). Last year of college, the school cut half a million in student services, teachers had been without a raise for 2 years, but they hired more administration and they got their 3% raise yearly.
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Originally Posted by rh71
If you plan it right, and conditions allow it, you move out AFTER you find your first full time job and have decent savings to get your own place.
We can't help the situation we're born into but don't make it any worse for yourself on purpose. The urge to become independent earlier is not worth this "vicious cycle".
If I stayed at my parents till I found a full time job, I wouldn't have found a decent full time job. The area is dying/dead.
Some people put themselves in that position by leaving a perfectly supportive home at 18 so they can be "independent". For those people I have no sympathy. You're stuck paying rent without having a full time job and you have the rising costs of college to deal with.
If you plan it right, and conditions allow it, you move out AFTER you find your first full time job and have decent savings to get your own place.
We can't help the situation we're born into but don't make it any worse for yourself on purpose. The urge to become independent earlier is not worth this "vicious cycle".
Sadly, there's that hindsight/foresight scenario, isn't it? So many of these kids can't wait to get out on their own, have their independence, be in a situation where "no one can tell them what to do, anymore". What these young people don't realize is this, "Independence can be quite costly....and as long as they're having to work for a living, they will always have to "do what someone tells them to do".
Sadly, there's that hindsight/foresight scenario, isn't it? So many of these kids can't wait to get out on their own, have their independence, be in a situation where "no one can tell them what to do, anymore". What these young people don't realize is this, "Independence can be quite costly....and as long as they're having to work for a living, they will always have to "do what someone tells them to do".
It wouldn't be if the wages kept up with inflation over the last several decades.
Some of you older folks probably came from families of 5-6 children living off one parents salary, not college educated.
To be fair... any discussion/comparison of the cost of college today and past has to include the GI Bill.
The GI Bill was singly the most significant path to college for those without means and it still exists.
One of the nurses I work with joined the military at age 18 to get out of the house and escape the drama... after her enlistment, she used her benefits to earn a nursing degree and at age 26 has her degree without the burden of debt.
In the book the Millionare Next Door the most common thread of those that had made it is a Good First Marriage.
I think it is really profound and simple at the same time... it is much harder to go it alone and many times harder when you spend your time and resources in conflict.
I agree with this 100%. My failed marriage cost me at least 150K and it only lasted three years and we didn't have kids. Fortunately I am at a point in my life where I can handle it. Had it happened before I had a job or ten years later with kids I might have been royally hosed.
It wouldn't be if the wages kept up with inflation over the last several decades.
Some of you older folks probably came from families of 5-6 children living off one parents salary, not college educated.
Don't see much of that anymore.
I don't believe that for one second. As long as people need money to survive, there will be those who simply can not or will not learn to "live within their means". I don't care how much money they make, they will always be broke, in debt and feeling as if they deserve more.
Where do you think the money comes from, that is paying people's wages? In many cases, it's from the sale of goods. If you continue to raise the "cost of production", the purchase price is going to increase as well. If only it were that easy.
Personally, I came from parents who didn't graduate high school. My father started his own business while in his 20s and my mother worked at various "physical labor/production" jobs, before becoming a "bulk mail carrier", a job she held for about 30 years. Two parents working-9 kids. We also had a nice, self-sufficient farm as well, where we raised our own pork, beef (and milk), chicken/eggs, grew our own produce, and put up 90% of the food we consumed.
Because of the gardens and farm, my parents always had ample "disposable income" to invest AND put away for their futures as well. Many of their adult children were quite fortunate to have had hardworking parents, as they turned out to be worthless, entitled human beings who couldn't manage to live within their means. Ironically, their attitudes were, "There's no way in hell I'm going to work as hard as my parents did. They never just enjoyed their money. Screw that, I'm going to enjoy mine!" Needless to say, they'd come crawling back home with yet another sob story..."It's not my fault! Things just fell through! I was supposed to have $$$? coming in. If you'll help me out, just this one last time.....I promise........"
Meanwhile, their lifestyles never changed. They continued to put on a front with their reckless spending, like it made them look like big shots. Yeah, I'd say learning to live within your means and doing everything you can to continue your education, to increase your marketable skills is about the only way to guarantee your success in this world. Luck on your side can certainly be a bonus, but if you're careless, entitled and reckless in your spending habits, that luck is only going to carry you just so far.
I see that Obozo's Free S**t Army is well represented in this thread, the usual whining pukes who think that they are "entitled" to the proceeds of someone else's hard work. They're too lazy or stupid to go out and get things for themselves so they vote for those who will steal from the productive and transfer it to them in return for that vote. The sad thing is that these pathetic losers see nothing wrong with what they do.
I see there are planty of people here who are slapping their grandfathers in the face. Your parents and grandparents really DID work hard and make sacrifices to create an economy that was fabulously wealthy and an environment in which you could grow up healthy and enjoy benefits and pleasures and luxuries that they couldn't even dream of, and they built it all, not for their own selfish selves, but so you could come after them and enjoy the miracle of prosperity that they built with sheer determination and hard work. And you reply to them No Thanks, buzz off, all you left me was an internet forum where I could pee and moan about how hard we work in our Gucci shoes in an airconditioned cubicle, riding the crest of the advantages that you worked so hard right through the Great Depression to give us.
And to hell with the people whose grandparents worked themselves to death and had nothing to pass down to them, not even all the advantages of being white and educated and well-nourished and having influential friends, who are meekly holding their hats in the hands and begging Please Sir, a few crumbs for us, whose hard work doing roofing work in the hot sun or cutting the grass in your country club suburb doesn't pay enugh for a BMW like the one you gloatingly drive to an expense-account dinner that costs more than my family's entire monthly food budget. Which you imagine you so richly deserve.
If I were your grandfather and you slapped me in the face like that for all I did for you and then took all the credit for doing it yourself, and refused to share any of what I worked so hard for with those who were less lucky than yourself, I would cut off my pathetic loser grandchildren without a dime and throw you out of my house long before y ou got into an Ivy League school.
This nation is rich enough to afford everything needed for a dignified life by every citizen, and let me assure, it was absolutely NOT your generation (that made it that way with hard work and diligent effort and working yourselves to a bent back and an early grave. And the rich and lucky whiners are, as you put it so graciously, too stupid to see that for themselves.
I don't believe that for one second. As long as people need money to survive, there will be those who simply can not or will not learn to "live within their means". I don't care how much money they make, they will always be broke, in debt and feeling as if they deserve more.
Where do you think the money comes from, that is paying people's wages? In many cases, it's from the sale of goods. If you continue to raise the "cost of production", the purchase price is going to increase as well. If only it were that easy.
I'm not talking about stupid people. I'm talking about people in general. Your wages, everyone's wages basically, have been stagnant to declining for several decades.
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The national minimum wage has existed since the 1930s, but it reached its peak of about $9 per hour in today’s dollars in the late 1960s. It’s not adjusted for inflation, so unless Congress (or state legislatures—18 states have set their own minimums above the federal level) raises the minimum, its buying power declines. During the Reagan years, the minimum went from about $8 to about $6 in 2011 dollars.
Our country has a demand problem, because wages haven't kept up.
You cannot afford anything you you like, even though you work harder than most and deserve more!
{snip}
Do you? Are you sure? Why don't you ask the people around you if they agree that you work harder than them. If your co-workers and acquaintances all say, "Yes, you work much harder than me!", I'd like to hear it.
Everyone thinks they're the hardest worker, the best employee, make the best decisions in any given scenario, etc. But you have to look for objective evidence...
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