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Old 08-01-2014, 07:34 PM
 
28,575 posts, read 18,614,411 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smommaof3 View Post
My children are still small, so I might be premature in saying this but I don't think you (general you) raised your children right if they're still living off of you as adults. You're just enabling them.
I didn't say they were living off me. But stuff happens to both children and elderly parents.

Of course, one can save more money by cutting off contact with children and parents.

And remember that since we're talking about the population as a whole we're talking about people--all three generations--with the modal income of only $30k.
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:48 PM
 
Location: Seattle Area
1,716 posts, read 2,026,803 times
Reputation: 4146
Quote:
Originally Posted by smommaof3 View Post
(Yes, I know you "pay" into ss, and I have paid more than my fair share into ss. You can't get blood from a stone as the saying goes.)
You haven't even begun to pay your fair share yet! You are far to young to get it, but one day you will understand.

Look this is part of a little thing we are trying to do here called society. Everyone gives a little and the system keeps going so that any one individual can have the freedom and infrastructure to pursue whatever they want.
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:52 PM
 
24,488 posts, read 41,023,198 times
Reputation: 12919
Quote:
Originally Posted by hartford_renter View Post
Why do people feel that it is necessary to control or force rules on others?
People like smommaof3 who call for these big government rules want the government to grow so powerful and restrict freedom. In this particular case, smommaof3 has shown her utter disregard for the Constitution and America as a whole. The reality is that these anti-Americans exist.
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:54 PM
 
19,045 posts, read 25,132,369 times
Reputation: 13485
Quote:
Originally Posted by smommaof3 View Post
I'm employed (I make over 100k) and so is my husband. I am tired of paying for their benefits.
For Pete's sake. You're tired of paying for their benefits? New Flash Lady- You're not an Island and this society you reside in, and completely depend on for EVERYTHING in your life, is provided by everyone else-including people older than you. If you're tired of paying your share for western privilege then take your husband and kids and go live off the grid.
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Old 08-01-2014, 08:31 PM
 
26,165 posts, read 21,418,528 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnywhereElse View Post
Exactly! And, it goes beyond minimum wage. In the city where we live, the average household yearly income is about $35,000.



People that start at minimum wage often don't move up. Think about the waitress that cooks your meal, the person watching your children at daycare, the woman that cleans your house............



Are you talking about social security. They have been taking that out of our checks for 42 years and we are still working and will have to continue to work.



So, why don't you take the average household income of $35,000 in our city and show me how a family of 4 can pay their bills and save for retirement. For families that don't have a down payment, rent runs about $700.00 to $800.00 a month and don't forget car payments because we don't have a public transit system to get them to work. You'll have to figure in some child care cost since many here work 10 or 12 hour days so parents trading off shifts to care for the children is pretty much impossible. And, of course, the cost of healthcare since that is required and many employers stay under the required hours or provide very limited benefits unless you can pay a great deal - think the land that has no use for unions. Also, that average figures in the salaries of those teaching at the college and those medical professionals at the hospital so $35,000 is a dream figure for many.

A lot of places prefer to hire older workers because they have a much better work ethic. They actually show up to work and many like their jobs. Many of the younger workers would not have the experience because they think they should just go to the top. People should retire when they can no longer do their jobs or when they have the financial means to leave the job. Many people cannot live on what social security provides and many, many more lost a great deal in the stock market and have put their dreams on permanent hold.

Seriously, I often wonder about all of these financial minds that post that anyone can save money out of their income. Then, when presented with the fact that it wouldn't be possible, the next thing we get is, "Well, they should have went to college and got a degree." Not everyone can go to college and we have college graduates working retail IF they can find any work at all. So, if you think that we would all be financially set if we just didn't have 300 channels of cable, etc., you need to expand your horizons. I'm betting those that feel that way are the same ones that don't want to see a living wage because they will have to pay the "help" more, more for their meals, more to have their dirty work done!!!


1. Household income isn't the same as two earner household

2. Move
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Old 08-01-2014, 08:32 PM
 
26,165 posts, read 21,418,528 times
Reputation: 22761
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph_Kirk View Post
The modal individual annual income in the US is less than 25K. Work that math out for me, please.

And remember that if everyone lives like that, the US economy collapses.


What modal income are you talking about and where are your sources? Median hh income is in the 50ks and dual earner hh push it in the 60ks
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Old 08-01-2014, 08:51 PM
 
1,679 posts, read 3,006,698 times
Reputation: 1296
Quote:
Originally Posted by smommaof3 View Post
Let's live in a society where there are no rules and everyone can do what they want. So, it's ok (according to you) if your next door neighbor wants to rape you, kill you, or steal from you? Why shouldn't we let him/her do what what they want? You know, the majority of people have good intentions. Those good people aren't just out for themselves.
Rules that protect people's rights like the right not to be raped or robbed is vastly different then a rule requiring people to retire.

Whose rights are you protecting?

Whose rights are you protecting when you force people to pay more taxes and participate in programs people would rather forgoe?

You aren't protecting anyone's rights you are trying to create a utopia in the image of your own personal interests
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Old 08-01-2014, 09:24 PM
 
Location: mancos
7,786 posts, read 7,998,800 times
Reputation: 6650
This thread is funny to me.I am not just Parfleche I am a Carpenter in my 60's and can never retire.The next generation only loves expected money and will not follow my love and my life.I am known around town as the Carpenter.All us real pros now have grey hair and skills honed over 40 years that would blow your mind not to mention 10's of thousands in tools Go to the big box and get a young illegal to do what I do,forget it I will fix it for you at a cost. So you really want me to retire? you could never replace me,So who you gonna call if not Me some kid with a IT degree or a Mexican? your call
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Old 08-01-2014, 09:45 PM
 
Location: Ft. Myers
19,719 posts, read 16,729,413 times
Reputation: 41862
I'm 69 and have retired twice and am currently working 40 hours per week.........not so much for the money but for my mental and physical well being. But I have said it before, if some younger person wants to work as hard as I do and will show up every day like I do, then they can have my job. But the reason I get so many hours is because they are not willing to do those things.

I don't feel I am taking a younger person's job, I am doing a job they are not able or willing to do.

Don
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Old 08-01-2014, 10:13 PM
 
Location: Pacific Northwest
56 posts, read 35,653 times
Reputation: 60
I'm wondering how the heck this mandatory retirement thing would work, anyway.

For W-2 employees, it might be relatively easy to accomplish. The company would just take you off the payroll at the specified age. But what about all of us self-employed folks? What about people who set up little online businesses, via their own websites or on E-Bay? What about artists and craftsmen/women, and other people who create things, and sell them at farmer's markets, crafts fairs, on etsy and other online marketplaces? There's a 60-something retired man in my neighborhood who picks up extra cash by doing carpentry work and home repairs for his neighbors. How would the "no income for people at his age" thing work for people like him?

In order to enforce "mandatory retirement", you'd need to have a mechanism in place that would prevent people over the retirement age from receiving any money for their work. How the heck could you possibly enforce something like that? Would people have to present their birth certificate every time they wanted to sell their goods or services? If I bought something off Craigslist and it turned out the seller was 70 years old, would I be fined or sent to jail if I didn't ask for proof of age? Would people be encouraged to report their older friends, family members and neighbors who still work for money? Shades of Animal Farm and Stalinist Russia.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Braunwyn View Post
For Pete's sake. You're tired of paying for their benefits? New Flash Lady- You're not an Island and this society you reside in, and completely depend on for EVERYTHING in your life, is provided by everyone else-including people older than you. If you're tired of paying your share for western privilege then take your husband and kids and go live off the grid.
Yep. I've paid into Social Security for 40 years now, and expect to for several more years, at least. As a self-employed person, I've paid double the amount of FICA tax that a W-2 employee would have paid. The amount I've paid into SS is well into the 6 figures now. That money was used by the federal government to fund other people's benefits, with the explicit understanding that when my time came, I would get some of it back. Do I expect the government to honor that obligation to me? Yes, I do. If that makes me a lazy, "entitled" bum who just didn't save enough in addition to paying all that money into SS, so be it.

With respect to the argument that people should just plan and save better: this idea that you can start out in your 20s, plan your life trajectory ("if I do A and B and C, then at age X this particular thing will happen, and then I will do Z), and have it all work according to that plan ... that's an illusion. Life doesn't work that way.
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