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Old 01-23-2015, 06:57 PM
 
Location: Phoenix, AZ
519 posts, read 626,179 times
Reputation: 675

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Quote:
Originally Posted by RecentGrad1 View Post
While I'm perfectly fine with drugs that don't cause harm to others (destroying your life is your own decision), if there's one drug that should be banned, it's alcohol.

The only reason alcohol isn't banned entirely (and why prohibition failed) is that it is an incredibly popular drug, making enforcement nigh impossible.
I can agree with this. I think many of us take for granted how dangerous alcohol is.... and the country would be a much safer place without. I personally stopped drinking it recently. But respect others rights to do so.

Quote:
Originally Posted by melissapla12 View Post
My dad is actually going to court for his 3rd dwi. I have no sympathy for him whatsoever. My friend recently got a dwi as well & wrecked his car. Luckily no one was hurt. (He had a few cuts & bruises)
Locally, I've noticed when there's a dwi related deadly accident to no surprise the drunk driver survives oh & what do u know... It's not his first dwi either.
I've been the DD before & I've had my share of drinks but I've never driven drunk. I always get a ride or have a DD with me.
There are so many options to prevent drunk driving. Free cab rides & what not & ppl refuse to use their services. That's why I have a hard time feeling bad for anyone who gets a DWI.
I don't blame you for having no sympathy if he screwed up 3 times. He hasn't learned his lesson but I would hope you would have some sympathy after the 1st DUI (assuming no injury to others)

People screw up sometimes. We're humans. If nobody was hurt, people deserve a second chance without having their record tarnished and bank account emptied. A more reasonable punishment and education/prevention. But of course DUI legislation is propelled by MADD and welcomed by money hungry government. It doesn't seem like it's about safety and prevention. More about money and self-righteousness and that's what I have a problem with.

 
Old 01-23-2015, 07:00 PM
 
11,780 posts, read 8,207,985 times
Reputation: 3425
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce Jackpot View Post
Yep you can count on the self-righteous types to pop up in a thread like this. If they or a close family member/friend gets popped for this maybe they'll understand how unfair and harsh the punishment is in many states. Unless, of course, you're fortunate enough to live in states like Pennsylvania and Wisconsin that believe in a more reasonable punishment (for first offenders) and these states try not to ruin peoples lives for one poor decision (assuming no injury/accident caused or extreme BAC content)

I wonder how many people ITT have texted while driving? I have a few times, admittedly. It is extremely dangerous. Yet these same people who do these various distracting habits regularly have no problem crucifying a first time DUI offender. Go figure.

The DUI punishments in this country have crossed the line. It's no longer a fair punishment like most crimes-it is a huge money making and feel good propaganda scheme. Educating and giving people the opportunity to redeem themselves should be the goal.... so people never make the decision to drive intoxicated again. Instead, the system tries to destroy your life.... and does a pretty good job of it.
How have the punishments crossed the line? Just because you say so doesn't make it so.

Quote:
Originally Posted by melissapla12 View Post
My dad is actually going to court for his 3rd dwi. I have no sympathy for him whatsoever. My friend recently got a dwi as well & wrecked his car. Luckily no one was hurt. (He had a few cuts & bruises)
Locally, I've noticed when there's a dwi related deadly accident to no surprise the drunk driver survives oh & what do u know... It's not his first dwi either.
I've been the DD before & I've had my share of drinks but I've never driven drunk. I always get a ride or have a DD with me.
There are so many options to prevent drunk driving. Free cab rides & what not & ppl refuse to use their services. That's why I have a hard time feeling bad for anyone who gets a DWI.
The free cabs aren't all that common actually. Usually what happens is some cities and some companies will sponsor a free ride weekend, but the promotion will have some limitations. In Chicago we have a program that will take you and your car home, but it isn't advertised that often.
 
Old 01-23-2015, 07:08 PM
 
Location: Central IL
13,340 posts, read 7,115,490 times
Reputation: 31024
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce Jackpot View Post
Interesting. If you ever made this poor choice and got caught, I'd bet you'd disagree with that statement. Thousands in fines, possible jail time, loss of license, classes etc. That's no slap on the wrist for most people. Maybe for Justin Bieber and celebrities but most Americans, no.

States like Pennsylvania and Wisconsin appear to have more empathy then most. They actually "gasp" give people a more reasonable punishment. They want people to learn from their mistakes whereas other states seem to just want to shake you down for money and turn your life upside down.



Totally forgot about the interlock device, that's a requirement now here in AZ. For a first time offender, c'mon. And I hear it's expensive. Just another money grubbing requirement that makes peoples lives harder. I used to live in California, and agree it is just super expensive. Here in AZ it is cheap living and still close to CA.... check it out if you haven't.
I definitely agree that most DUI laws are NOT a slap on the wrist. It is true that theoretically a single mistake can quickly grow into something much larger - fines that if not paid on time can double and triple, many hours of classes, etc. that are next to impossible to get to since you've lost your license (public transportation in many places is non-existent).

There is a HUGE industry built around making money on "making restitution". There is often an impact on employment, at least in terms of getting there without driving, but future job opportunities can be limited too.

That said, the typical offender who is caught has driven drunk not just once or twice but MANY times, they just now happened to get caught. I'd be in favor of slightly moderating punishment for first offenses, at least monetarily and concentrate on education and community service. Second offenses I would throw the book at.
 
Old 01-23-2015, 07:13 PM
 
Location: Phoenix, AZ
519 posts, read 626,179 times
Reputation: 675
Quote:
Originally Posted by lycos679 View Post
How have the punishments crossed the line? Just because you say so doesn't make it so.
Sure, it's only my opinion. But where do we draw the line? It's easy for people who aren't dealing with this/or don't know someone who is to say it's "not harsh enough". Very easy. But I see this as an unreasonable for a first-time misdemeanor DUI arrest.

Here in Arizona I find the punishment excessive:

First-time DUI with a BAC of at least 0.08, but less than 0.150
CLASS OF CRIME Class 1 Misdemeanor MAXIMUM JAIL Six (6) months MINIMUM JAIL One (1) day [10 days, 9 suspended] COUNSELING A drug/alcohol screening will be performed. The results of the screening can affect the duration of counseling. MINIMUM FINE $250 + surcharge ADDITIONAL FINANCIAL PENALTY $500 to State Prison Fund PROBATION 5 years (maximum) Driver’s License Consequences
SUSPENSION 90 days (work permit after 30 days) INTERLOCK DEVICE Required

Quote:
Originally Posted by reneeh63 View Post
I definitely agree that most DUI laws are NOT a slap on the wrist. It is true that theoretically a single mistake can quickly grow into something much larger - fines that if not paid on time can double and triple, many hours of classes, etc. that are next to impossible to get to since you've lost your license (public transportation in many places is non-existent).

There is a HUGE industry built around making money on "making restitution". There is often an impact on employment, at least in terms of getting there without driving, but future job opportunities can be limited too.

That said, the typical offender who is caught has driven drunk not just once or twice but MANY times, they just now happened to get caught. I'd be in favor of slightly moderating punishment for first offenses, at least monetarily and concentrate on education and community service. Second offenses I would throw the book at.
Great post, I agree. I just don't like the idea of people's lives being turned completely upside down for this one bad decision to drive drunk (assuming no injury to others. If you injure or kill an innocent person, then you deserve whatever punishment you get)

I can't imagine a struggling single Mom or something having to deal with this too. Like you said, throw the book at second offenders, but let's give regular people a second chance. Instead of burying them with thousands in fees and making their life difficult (if not impossible) without a vehicle. Enough is enough.

Last edited by Bruce Jackpot; 01-23-2015 at 07:22 PM..
 
Old 01-23-2015, 07:17 PM
 
11,780 posts, read 8,207,985 times
Reputation: 3425
Quote:
Originally Posted by reneeh63 View Post
I definitely agree that most DUI laws are NOT a slap on the wrist. It is true that theoretically a single mistake can quickly grow into something much larger - fines that if not paid on time can double and triple, many hours of classes, etc. that are next to impossible to get to since you've lost your license (public transportation in many places is non-existent).

There is a HUGE industry built around making money on "making restitution". There is often an impact on employment, at least in terms of getting there without driving, but future job opportunities can be limited too.

That said, the typical offender who is caught has driven drunk not just once or twice but MANY times, they just now happened to get caught. I'd be in favor of slightly moderating punishment for first offenses, at least monetarily and concentrate on education and community service. Second offenses I would throw the book at.
This sounds pretty reasonable to me.

Harold L. Wallin | Illinois DUI Lawyer | Chicago Drunk Driving | Chicago Criminal Lawyer | Drunk Driving Law | Illinois DUI Attorney | Illinois DWI Attorney | Chicago DUI Lawyer | Chicago DWI Lawyer | Drunk Driving Defense | Drunk Driving Defense Att

Quote:
If you are charged with misdemeanor DUI, and have never been found guilty of a DUI before, or have had a DUI reduced to reckless driving, then you are eligible for court supervision. A sentence of court supervision does not appear on your public driving record, is not a conviction, nor does it affect your driving privileges.
They basically give you a warning.
 
Old 01-23-2015, 07:25 PM
 
Location: Vermont, New England
75 posts, read 83,355 times
Reputation: 130
Well the Arizona law does seem excessive to me. Jail time for a first offence is too much. I don't like how in many states, you get taken straight to jail for any possible offence other than say, speeding. In New England people are released on appearance tickets. That's a fairer system, because you don't sit in jail for weeks on say, an open container charge. (This happens in Florida)

However, I really don't have too much sympathy for DUI offenders. They still get punished relatively lightly considering the massive death toll from drinking related crashes! Back before MADD, before the laws got strict, a cop might tell a drunk driver to "drive straight home" or sometimes even offer a lift. No lessons learned that way, and people used to drop like flies from DUI crashes. Now that enforcement is severe, far fewer road deaths occur!

In my state, drunk drivers have to pay for and attend alcohol counseling to see if there's a substance abuse problem, and must complete courses that address the many factors involved with a DUI. This is all very expensive but it helps people get a reality check so they might not do it again!

In VT, a second DUI conviction in 10 years is a felony, and I think in that way you could say the law does give people "a second chance".

Tlr Jailing first offenders is way too much, but the strict laws and enforcement have saved lives.
 
Old 01-23-2015, 07:25 PM
 
11,780 posts, read 8,207,985 times
Reputation: 3425
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce Jackpot View Post
Sure, it's only my opinion. But where do we draw the line? It's easy for people who aren't dealing with this/or don't know someone who is to say it's "not harsh enough". Very easy. But I see this as an unreasonable for a first-time misdemeanor DUI arrest.
All I was asking for was some justification for your opinion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce Jackpot View Post
Here in Arizona I find the punishment excessive:
AZ is a backwards state. They still think a joint possession should be a felony. Bunch of rednecks and cowboys imo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce Jackpot View Post

First-time DUI with a BAC of at least 0.08, but less than 0.150
CLASS OF CRIME Class 1 Misdemeanor MAXIMUM JAIL Six (6) months MINIMUM JAIL One (1) day [10 days, 9 suspended] COUNSELING A drug/alcohol screening will be performed. The results of the screening can affect the duration of counseling. MINIMUM FINE $250 + surcharge ADDITIONAL FINANCIAL PENALTY $500 to State Prison Fund PROBATION 5 years (maximum) Driverís License Consequences
SUSPENSION 90 days (work permit after 30 days) INTERLOCK DEVICE Required
That doesn't sound excessive. 90 day suspension, $250 fine, and a day in jail (which you would probably spend anyway since you would go to jail after the arrest)
 
Old 01-23-2015, 07:34 PM
MJ7
 
6,221 posts, read 8,191,806 times
Reputation: 6487
DUI laws aren't that terrible compared to other countries. They are meant to be harsh, but every year 1.2 million people are arrested for DUI, millions more drive drunk and just are never caught.

The problem that many DA prosecutors are facing is that many people would rather serve their time in jail and not take probation. 1st and even 2nd charges of DUI come with probation attached, about 70% of those charged are instead saying they would rather sit in jail for 2 months and then move on. The problem is that the 70% gets out and have no programs to do. Probation acts to help deter the act of drunk driving, for a reason.

The fact that most people think one will lose their employment over a DUI is absurd. Most people do not lose their jobs because most employers never find out about it, not unless you are a truck driver or you are arrested on the job driving a company vehicle. If you are busted for DUI (and many people have been and still are) you take your probation, complete the requirements, pay the fines, pee in a cup once a month, do 24-80 hrs community service, take a DWI class and do a little amount of counseling and you'll be fine. Occupational licenses are available to get to and from work. Just follow the rules of your probation, be a normal citizen and get on with it.
 
Old 01-23-2015, 07:36 PM
 
16,785 posts, read 19,628,561 times
Reputation: 33226
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dollydo View Post
If one is under the influence of drink or drugs and drives, it is a choice, and I would guess that it was not the first occurrence, they were just lucky and didn't get caught...if they get pulled over, there is a price to be paid, and, I am all for it, infact, I think the laws and punishments are too lenient.

Well they are in the state of Florida where you live. It's a joke there. There were two incidents in the Tampa area where drunk drivers killed people, one case was a young mother, the other the driver hit and killed two college students walking. One driver got 13yrs, the other 12.

For killing people.

Other states have much harsher penalties.
 
Old 01-23-2015, 07:40 PM
MJ7
 
6,221 posts, read 8,191,806 times
Reputation: 6487
Quote:
Originally Posted by seain dublin View Post
Well they are in the state of Florida where you live. It's a joke there. There were two incidents in the Tampa area where drunk drivers killed people, one case was a young mother, the other the driver hit and killed two college students walking. One driver got 13yrs, the other 12.

For killing people.

Other states have much harsher penalties.
I believe California has the hardest penalties for DUI Manslaughter, simply because they argue that you were aware of the effects alcohol has and the sever consequences it can have once impaired and behind the wheel, I believe they can turn a DUI Manslaughter (typically 5 yrs state jail for good behavior) into a murder charge (claiming intent).
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