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Old 01-23-2015, 03:42 PM
 
Location: Phoenix, AZ
519 posts, read 597,166 times
Reputation: 674

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Seriously. Financially ruined is just the start. There should absolutely be stiff consequences but I feel we have gone too far. Harsh feel good laws from MADD that don't stop the problem, just produce revenue and make peoples lives miserable. The punishment in many states (like here in AZ) does not fit the crime IMO.

In many states you are looking at losing thousands in fines and future insurance increases. Not to mention the cost if you choose to hire an attorney. Also, possible jail time, loss of license or months, and some other requirements. Many people lose their jobs. Or they can't get a job because of a background check. Their entire life is turned upside down... and these are often otherwise good normal people. Not alcoholics, just regular folks who may not even drink alcohol often.... just made one poor choice to drive after drinking.

A first time offender, run-of-the-mill DUI (no accident, injury) makes one bad decision and his/her life is in pieces. I have no sympathy for people who don't learn from their mistakes... but I do believe there should be a second chance and empathy barring no extreme injury or accident was caused.

 
Old 01-23-2015, 03:56 PM
 
12,323 posts, read 8,745,833 times
Reputation: 8659
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce Jackpot View Post
Seriously. Financially ruined is just the start. There should absolutely be stiff consequences but I feel we have gone too far. Harsh feel good laws from MADD that don't stop the problem, just produce revenue and make peoples lives miserable. The punishment in many states (like here in AZ) does not fit the crime IMO.

In many states you are looking at losing thousands in fines and future insurance increases. Not to mention the cost if you choose to hire an attorney. Also, possible jail time, loss of license or months, and some other requirements. Many people lose their jobs. Or they can't get a job because of a background check. Their entire life is turned upside down... and these are often otherwise good normal people. Not alcoholics, just regular folks who may not even drink alcohol often.... just made one poor choice to drive after drinking.

A first time offender, run-of-the-mill DUI (no accident, injury) makes one bad decision and his/her life is in pieces. I have no sympathy for people who don't learn from their mistakes... but I do believe there should be a second chance and empathy barring no extreme injury or accident was caused.
Most single-time DUI/DWI offenders do find employment. It is more difficult for some jobs to be sure, but it absolutely can be done and is. I'd venture to say that someone with no criminal record other than a single DUI/DWI 10 years ago can get a job (for most jobs) just about as easily as with no record. Time goes a long way.

I absolutely think the penalties are appropriate in most states, because they are empirically necessary to deter the act. If the penalties are too minor, people will tend to brush it off, and before you know it, more people will die in alcohol-related MV crashes. This is the real tragedy - temporarily having some difficulty finding some jobs is far, far less of a problem than being dead.
 
Old 01-23-2015, 03:58 PM
 
Location: Texas
41,871 posts, read 48,109,624 times
Reputation: 65762
DUI laws in this country are a joke.
A slap on the wrist.
 
Old 01-23-2015, 04:08 PM
 
1,825 posts, read 1,223,463 times
Reputation: 2228
Now, at least in CA they want to pass a law to ban drinking and eating in a car. LOL. Wait until they make the interlock device mandatory for all offenders. A friend of mine had to have one on as part of a pilot program in CA and it's a nightmare...doesn't work...have to blow into it for 20 seconds just right, etc...have to take it in all the time....and it gives false readings very often so they either try to extend your time on it or even charge you again.....

I don't like what this country has become, but at least when I move out of Ca they won't get the exhorbitant state income tax or the other high costs associated with providing for the increasing welfare class that loves it here because they have life just a notch below folks who work and sometimes not even that.

"The trouble with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money." Margaret was right.
 
Old 01-23-2015, 04:15 PM
 
Location: Phoenix, AZ
519 posts, read 597,166 times
Reputation: 674
Quote:
Originally Posted by stan4 View Post
DUI laws in this country are a joke.
A slap on the wrist.
Interesting. If you ever made this poor choice and got caught, I'd bet you'd disagree with that statement. Thousands in fines, possible jail time, loss of license, classes etc. That's no slap on the wrist for most people. Maybe for Justin Bieber and celebrities but most Americans, no.

States like Pennsylvania and Wisconsin appear to have more empathy then most. They actually "gasp" give people a more reasonable punishment. They want people to learn from their mistakes whereas other states seem to just want to shake you down for money and turn your life upside down.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Burkmere View Post
Now, at least in CA they want to pass a law to ban drinking and eating in a car. LOL. Wait until they make the interlock device mandatory for all offenders. A friend of mine had to have one on as part of a pilot program in CA and it's a nightmare...doesn't work...have to blow into it for 20 seconds just right, etc...have to take it in all the time....and it gives false readings very often so they either try to extend your time on it or even charge you again.....

I don't like what this country has become, but at least when I move out of Ca they won't get the exhorbitant state income tax or the other high costs associated with providing for the increasing welfare class that loves it here because they have life just a notch below folks who work and sometimes not even that.

"The trouble with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money." Margaret was right.
Totally forgot about the interlock device, that's a requirement now here in AZ. For a first time offender, c'mon. And I hear it's expensive. Just another money grubbing requirement that makes peoples lives harder. I used to live in California, and agree it is just super expensive. Here in AZ it is cheap living and still close to CA.... check it out if you haven't.
 
Old 01-23-2015, 04:23 PM
 
1,192 posts, read 1,097,870 times
Reputation: 8525
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce Jackpot View Post
Seriously. Financially ruined is just the start. There should absolutely be stiff consequences but I feel we have gone too far. Harsh feel good laws from MADD that don't stop the problem, just produce revenue and make peoples lives miserable. The punishment in many states (like here in AZ) does not fit the crime IMO.

In many states you are looking at losing thousands in fines and future insurance increases. Not to mention the cost if you choose to hire an attorney. Also, possible jail time, loss of license or months, and some other requirements. Many people lose their jobs. Or they can't get a job because of a background check. Their entire life is turned upside down... and these are often otherwise good normal people. Not alcoholics, just regular folks who may not even drink alcohol often.... just made one poor choice to drive after drinking.

A first time offender, run-of-the-mill DUI (no accident, injury) makes one bad decision and his/her life is in pieces. I have no sympathy for people who don't learn from their mistakes... but I do believe there should be a second chance and empathy barring no extreme injury or accident was caused.

How is any of that not the fault of the person who chooses to drink and drive? The consequences are no secret and are easily avoided. It's not a "mistake," it is a choice to endanger the lives of other people. It's stupid and selfish, and the consequences should be harsh. Everyone has the power to avoid the consequences of drinking and driving simply by choosing not to do it.

At what point do you think someone should experience the consequences of making the choice to drink and drive? After killing one person? Five people? Ten? Better to get him/her off the road as soon as possible and save the lives of his/her potential victims. Why shouldn't the consequences of deliberately putting others at risk be a harsh as possible?

Last edited by Chaofan; 01-23-2015 at 04:24 PM.. Reason: typo
 
Old 01-23-2015, 04:23 PM
 
17,135 posts, read 11,394,808 times
Reputation: 12204
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce Jackpot View Post
Interesting. If you ever made this poor choice and got caught, I'd bet you'd disagree with that statement. Thousands in fines, possible jail time, loss of license, classes etc. That's no slap on the wrist for most people. Maybe for Justin Bieber and celebrities but most Americans, no.

States like Pennsylvania and Wisconsin appear to have more empathy then most. They actually "gasp" give people a more reasonable punishment. They want people to learn from their mistakes whereas other states seem to just want to shake you down for money and turn your life upside down.



Totally forgot about the interlock device, that's a requirement now here in AZ. For a first time offender, c'mon. And I hear it's expensive. Just another money grubbing requirement that makes peoples lives harder. I used to live in California, and agree it is just super expensive. Here in AZ it is cheap living and still close to CA.... check it out if you haven't.


Most people arrested as a first time offender aren't actually first time drunk drivers, they just hadn't been caught before
 
Old 01-23-2015, 04:42 PM
 
Location: Phoenix, AZ
519 posts, read 597,166 times
Reputation: 674
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaofan View Post
How is any of that not the fault of the person who chooses to drink and drive? The consequences are no secret and are easily avoided. It's not a "mistake," it is a choice to endanger the lives of other people. It's stupid and selfish, and the consequences should be harsh. Everyone has the power to avoid the consequences of drinking and driving simply by choosing not to do it.

At what point do you think someone should experience the consequences of making the choice to drink and drive? After killing one person? Five people? Ten? Better to get him/her off the road as soon as possible and save the lives of his/her potential victims. Why shouldn't the consequences of deliberately putting others at risk be a harsh as possible?
My point is the consequences are too harsh in most states for a DUI causing no injury or accident. Not an extreme case where someone was twice or three times the legal limit. I'm talking a run-of-the-mill first time DUI arrest.

But I do believe the punishment should be harsh for people who get two or three DUI's. As obviously they have not learned their lesson. But for your average Joe or Jane getting a DUI should not, IMO, throw their lives upside down. They should not possibly lose their job and go into debt etc.

Have some empathy for regular people who make one poor decision, jeezus. The DUI laws in this country (most states) reek of a money grabbing scam. Simply feel good laws pushed by MADD to destroy peoples lives. It makes me sick. Good people make mistakes... they make poor decisions. But people have this self-righteous holier-than-thou attitude about this. As I said, with no accident or injury lets give people a second chance and an opportunity to learn from their poor decision. Shaking them down for money and making their life more difficult going forward is not the solution. A more reasonable fine and punishment is.
 
Old 01-23-2015, 04:49 PM
 
11,780 posts, read 7,935,898 times
Reputation: 3420
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce Jackpot View Post
My point is the consequences are too harsh in most states for a DUI causing no injury or accident. Not an extreme case where someone was twice or three times the legal limit. I'm talking a run-of-the-mill first time DUI arrest.

But I do believe the punishment should be harsh for people who get two or three DUI's. As obviously they have not learned their lesson. But for your average Joe or Jane getting a DUI should not, IMO, throw their lives upside down. They should not possibly lose their job and go into debt etc.

Have some empathy for regular people who make one poor decision, jeezus. The DUI laws in this country (most states) reek of a money grabbing scam. Simply feel good laws pushed by MADD to destroy peoples lives. It makes me sick. Good people make mistakes... they make poor decisions. But people have this self-righteous holier-than-thou attitude about this. As I said, with no accident or injury lets give people a second chance and an opportunity to learn from their poor decision. Shaking them down for money and making their life more difficult going forward is not the solution. A more reasonable fine and punishment is.
What's the punishment? A weekend in jail? That hardly sounds excessive.
 
Old 01-23-2015, 05:01 PM
 
Location: San Jose
574 posts, read 540,381 times
Reputation: 732
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce Jackpot View Post
Interesting. If you ever made this poor choice and got caught, I'd bet you'd disagree with that statement. Thousands in fines, possible jail time, loss of license, classes etc. That's no slap on the wrist for most people. Maybe for Justin Bieber and celebrities but most Americans, no.
For an incredibly irresponsible activity that is highly likely to kill innocent people, I would say the punishment is not harsh enough. Everyone has the ability to control how much they drink (and to not drink at all). And if you decide to go overboard, you can call a cab. Deciding to drive anyway is a blatantly disregarding the lives of innocent human beings, and these people should be hit with everything possible.

While I'm perfectly fine with drugs that don't cause harm to others (destroying your life is your own decision), if there's one drug that should be banned, it's alcohol.



The only reason alcohol isn't banned entirely (and why prohibition failed) is that it is an incredibly popular drug, making enforcement nigh impossible.
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