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Old 01-27-2015, 09:00 PM
 
Location: NE Mississippi
25,434 posts, read 17,121,995 times
Reputation: 37120

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Quote:
Originally Posted by hakkarin View Post
One thing that baffles the hell out of me when I listen to many people who consider them self's left-leaning is when they talk about the rich and capitalism in a negative way and how the wealthy want every to be poor.

Perhaps I am missing something, but how is it possible to make money of others being poor? How is poverty profitable? How can a rich dude become richer by making someone else poor? Please explain the economics behind this to me.
Good for you!

You've seen right through the smoke screen and asked the right questions.
One has nothing to do with the other, of course. One person may be well off and the other poor, but they are both products of their own life's equation.

We are all born with an equal sign that follows us around. Can't ever out-run it, either. You and I are both the result of our birth circumstances, our genetic make up, our good and bad luck, and the time we have been working toward becoming whatever we are. A meth-head living in poverty led himself toward his end just as the businessman did toward his.

Take from the rich and give to the poor, and the poor will quickly lose their new-found wealth. And the rich will quickly start anew to regain their wealth.
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Old 01-27-2015, 09:06 PM
 
Location: NE Mississippi
25,434 posts, read 17,121,995 times
Reputation: 37120
Quote:
Originally Posted by sedimenjerry View Post
That's literally what a bank account is. Money just sitting there. The only way to collect money is to not spend it. That's how so many get rich. Save it, make proper investments. Lottery winners so often blow all their money because they spend it all. Never said the ultra rich keep all of their money idle, but to think they spend all of it is actually asinine.
No it isn't. Without your money (and lots of others') sitting in the bank, the bank would not be able to loan me money to buy a house.

So, your money is safe, and yet I have used it. And when I bought the house using credit created by money that you deposited, the realtor made a nice commission; and with that commission she bought a new TV, and then signed up for Netflix...................
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Old 01-27-2015, 09:25 PM
 
325 posts, read 254,824 times
Reputation: 439
Quote:
Originally Posted by Listener2307 View Post
Good for you!

You've seen right through the smoke screen and asked the right questions.
One has nothing to do with the other, of course. One person may be well off and the other poor, but they are both products of their own life's equation.

We are all born with an equal sign that follows us around. Can't ever out-run it, either. You and I are both the result of our birth circumstances, our genetic make up, our good and bad luck, and the time we have been working toward becoming whatever we are. A meth-head living in poverty led himself toward his end just as the businessman did toward his.

Take from the rich and give to the poor, and the poor will quickly lose their new-found wealth. And the rich will quickly start anew to regain their wealth.
There is a great deal of truth here. That's why communism just doesn't work.
All it takes is for people to live the concept of enough.

When YOU have enough, invest for the good of your countryman, for the benefit of your friends and neighbors, and your community. Invest in your local economy, and try to create a culture of the company being a host to benefit all of the little parasites clinging to it. There is nothing wrong with profit. Avarice is the strongest motivating force other than love and sex. The problems arise with MAXIMIZING profits.
Take ENOUGH, be prosperous, and give back to those who made you that way through wages and benefits.
The corporation is not a citizen, it is an organization which exists to provide a benefit to the people it is composed of. whatever happened to competing on the basis of quality?
Does anyone else notice that everything you buy sucks?
Even food has turned to ****.
No selection, just processed crap and the worst cuts of meat.
We get what they want us to have.
The leavings, as though we were hogs.
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Old 01-27-2015, 09:29 PM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,385,078 times
Reputation: 9074
Quote:
Originally Posted by Listener2307 View Post
No it isn't. Without your money (and lots of others') sitting in the bank, the bank would not be able to loan me money to buy a house.

So, your money is safe, and yet I have used it. And when I bought the house using credit created by money that you deposited, the realtor made a nice commission; and with that commission she bought a new TV, and then signed up for Netflix...................

And when my landlord bought the house using credit created by money I deposited, I helped pay for it in the form of a rent increase.
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Old 01-27-2015, 09:53 PM
 
325 posts, read 254,824 times
Reputation: 439
Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
And when my landlord bought the house using credit created by money I deposited, I helped pay for it in the form of a rent increase.
Because he had the credit to buy it, the bank makes a profit from the interest on the mortgage.
The owner then rents it to you, and your rent pays his mortgage.
Say the landlord borrows 100k.
He pays the bank 150k.
He does that over 30 years by you being a good citizen and paying your rent.
So after 30 years the score is
Bank + 50k- interest profit
Landlord +100k value of property on the market
You- too old to work and eating cat food on Social Security.
Do you get it yet?
The alternative is living on the street, smelly and sick and ostracized.
You work your whole life for nothing.
Imagine that times 100 million and you have a billionaire.
How many people eating the cat food or just starving to death so he can FEEL SUPERIOR?
My CEO's kids should go to Ivy League schools but I don't deserve the opportunity to PAY FOR FROM MY WAGES and EARN a modest pension? Pensions are paid for by you, they share some of the profits from the capital YOU have been providing to them for the last 30 years. Yet pensions are looked at as a handout, and unions are destroying American business. They're reviled.
Do you get it yet?
Moderator cut: inappropriate language

Last edited by Marka; 02-12-2015 at 02:05 AM..
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Old 01-27-2015, 10:02 PM
 
Location: NE Mississippi
25,434 posts, read 17,121,995 times
Reputation: 37120
Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
And when my landlord bought the house using credit created by money I deposited, I helped pay for it in the form of a rent increase.
You didn't "help pay for it" at all - you paid for all of it!

Now that you understand how it works, I am sure you will want to go out and buy some rental property. That's what we did in 1987. We bought two townhouses, kept them rented out and now they are paid for and are funding our retirement. Net cost to us = 0. Contribution to net worth = $200,000. Net income = about $1,000/month. Forever.

Cool, huh? You should join in and do it yourself instead of attacking people who understand how it all works......or, as above, you could eat cat food. Up to you.
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Old 01-27-2015, 10:10 PM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,385,078 times
Reputation: 9074
Quote:
Originally Posted by Listener2307 View Post
You didn't "help pay for it" at all - you paid for all of it!

Now that you understand how it works, I am sure you will want to go out and buy some rental property. That's what we did in 1987. We bought two townhouses, kept them rented out and now they are paid for and are funding our retirement. Net cost to us = 0. Contribution to net worth = $200,000. Net income = about $1,000/month. Forever.

Cool, huh? You should join in and do it yourself instead of attacking people who understand how it all works......or, as above, you could eat cat food. Up to you.

Thank you...now do you all see why cheap housing is so important to me?
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Old 01-27-2015, 10:42 PM
 
Location: Clinton Township, MI
1,901 posts, read 1,822,173 times
Reputation: 2329
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Maleman View Post
At this time, I'm not a millionaire. but I have enough.
I've been homeless and I've been a millionaire. Regardless, I have always worked.
I notice that there is much less opportunity today for those seeking to advance through effort and good decision making, which led me to do the research upon which my philosophies are based.
How do you know the "right" network, "right" degree, etc, when everyone has conflicting opinions? Because it worked for you does not mean it will work for everyone. Or anyone.
With all due respect, you sir, are an azzhole.
What I promote is the concept of ENOUGH.
Who needs 10 or 20 or 50 billions?
What good is wealth after you have supplied the worldly needs of your family and all of its future generations in perpetuity? What purpose can it serve?
How much is enough?
Ha! I'm the A-hole but yet YOU are the one trying to regulate how "much" someone should have? We are in a Specialized Skill Economy and the Industrial Age is over. What this means is that in order to make it to the Middle Class TODAY, you are going to have to specialize in one of the new IN DEMAND areas within the Economy and they all revolve around STEM fields. I'm talking:

- Nursing
- Medicine
- Other Healthcare
- IT
- Computers
- Engineering
- Finance/Banking/Accounting

And other areas. There's no conflicting opinions on this, study and data after data shows that this is where the Economy is today. So either people do what they have to do to become trained and ingrained into these areas, or they will be LEFT behind.

Your solution of just "pass the wealth around" does nothing to produce new wealth, new profits, new jobs, new factories, new plants, new technologies, new inventions....NOTHING. All you are doing is taking from a productive side of the Economy and giving it to an unproductive side of the Economy.

But yet I'm the A-Hole?? Ha!
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Old 01-27-2015, 10:48 PM
 
Location: Clinton Township, MI
1,901 posts, read 1,822,173 times
Reputation: 2329
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Maleman View Post
There is a great deal of truth here. That's why communism just doesn't work.
All it takes is for people to live the concept of enough.

When YOU have enough, invest for the good of your countryman, for the benefit of your friends and neighbors, and your community. Invest in your local economy, and try to create a culture of the company being a host to benefit all of the little parasites clinging to it. There is nothing wrong with profit. Avarice is the strongest motivating force other than love and sex. The problems arise with MAXIMIZING profits.
Take ENOUGH, be prosperous, and give back to those who made you that way through wages and benefits.
The corporation is not a citizen, it is an organization which exists to provide a benefit to the people it is composed of. whatever happened to competing on the basis of quality?
Does anyone else notice that everything you buy sucks?
Even food has turned to ****.
No selection, just processed crap and the worst cuts of meat.
We get what they want us to have.
The leavings, as though we were hogs.
And who defines the concept of "ENOUGH"? You? What if inflation goes through the roof and what was "ENOUGH" 10 years ago wouldn't be "ENOUGH" today? What if you have enough, but you get into an emergency or a major lawsuit, or something else that causes you to have to pay for a major expense, what if your ENOUGH at that point might no longer be ENOUGH?

You do realize that people who have more than Enough, do more to stimulate the economy than people who spend their entire paycheck every week? Money saved in the bank or invested in the market or invested into businesses, all do more to stimulate the overall Economy than some single mother spending all of her food stamps every month. Or some minimum wage worker spending their entire paycheck on bills for that week.

You are a Socialist. You want to spread the wealth around instead of creating a situation where people go out and acquire their own damn wealth. You have no business telling other people when they have ENOUGH, hell, maybe they want to save the money to pay for the college education of not just their kids but their GRANDCHILDREN. You have no right to determine how they should be allocating their money you Socialist.
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Old 01-28-2015, 12:05 AM
 
325 posts, read 254,824 times
Reputation: 439
I suppose the best term would be Democratic Socialist. I don't object to anyone getting what they can. It is when greed and the need for gain becomes counter productive and causes harm to others that limits need to be imposed.
I do not espouse blindly giving everything you've worked for to those less fortunate, rather, that there is a point when enough of a fortune has been built and if one will not willingly return those monies to the economy that regulation should force you to do so. Example- raise the minimum wage to a living wage or face tax penalties.
You are no doubt an opponent of welfare, so be fair here and help cut the corporate welfare which shifts costs to the taxpayers.
Nobody who is willing to work diligently should have to use food stamps and medicaid in order to put MORE money in YOUR pocket.
This strategy will reduce taxes for everyone. Social Services is the largest single line item in all Government budgets.
STOP THE RACE TO THE BOTTOM!
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