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Old 04-01-2016, 04:23 PM
 
13,566 posts, read 16,078,259 times
Reputation: 18037

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Quote:
Originally Posted by hakkarin View Post
Let's say that only people who own real property are allowed to vote

How about if only people who own real property are...
allowed to marry...
allowed to possess weapons...
allowed to possess a driver's license...
allowed to earn at least minimum wage...
allowed to have their children attend public schools...
allowed to walk on certain streets at certain times of day...?

Why not carry out your wonderful concept in its totality?


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Old 04-01-2016, 04:25 PM
 
Location: Oregon, formerly Texas
5,242 posts, read 3,398,836 times
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It brings up the question - who or what is sovereign? People or property? If we think that the government's primary function is to protect property and propertied interests, then yes, we should only let people with property vote. If we think the government does more than that, then we need to let all the interested parties vote, which would be all adults as we define adults (18+).
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Old 04-01-2016, 05:01 PM
 
729 posts, read 294,128 times
Reputation: 739
Maybe home ownership would be too exclusive. Maybe just proof of employment, and of course proof of citizenship.
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Old 04-01-2016, 07:33 PM
 
Location: Fort Lauderdale, Florida
8,144 posts, read 7,472,580 times
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I think only those that can afford a Rolls Royce should be allowed to vote.
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Old 04-01-2016, 09:51 PM
 
Location: Silicon Valley
16,744 posts, read 20,511,200 times
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Hmmmm, sounds kind of like how America was before the Revolution. There was something similar in France that happened when those landowners with all the power suggested the little people eat cake.

Those dang serfs are so uppity.
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Old 04-01-2016, 11:24 PM
 
Location: CO/UT/AZ/NM Catch me if you can!
4,253 posts, read 3,954,423 times
Reputation: 9432
Quote:
Originally Posted by hakkarin View Post
Let's say that only people who own real property ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Real_property ) are allowed to vote, but that in return the only form of taxation is taxation on property. Would this not incentivize good economic policy since only people who have actual economic resources to lose would have a say while people who don't have property don't need to pay taxes? It just seems reasonable that only the people holding wealth get to decide how said wealth is spent for the whole, as compared to the current system where people just vote themselves into prosperity using other people's stuff.
No. And people can't "just vote themselves into prosperity using other people's stuff" - not in the USA, anyhow. Maybe they can do this in some European countries which tend to be more accepting of socialist ideas than Americans are. If this were true here, no one in the US would be living at or below the poverty line - unfortunately, we can't just vote ourselves out of poverty. Besides, do you really think that property owners like Goldman-Sachs and the other "too big to fail" outfits on Wall Street would vote for policies that were in their own best interests or would they instead have an amazing change of heart and vote for what is good for the nation (and its citizens) even if it wasn't good for corporate America? Three guesses and the first two don't count.

Oh, and how would the non-property owners get out of paying taxes? I don't know about Iceland, but everything you can think of is taxed in the US - food, clothing, gasoline, even our dogs since we usually have to pay a fee to some municipality to get them "licensed." So, like would we have a special "non-property owner" special tax free card that would give us a "get out of jail free" option on all those myriads of taxes? If so, the property owners would be paying just about every penny they have in order to pay for all the things that non-property owners used to help pay for. But hey, if Goldman Sachs wants to cover the upkeep of all the infra-structure in the US, pay for education K-12 plus all state sponsored universities, cover the upkeep of our extremely expensive military system as well as coughing up the bucks for the preservation and upkeep of America's extensive national lands system, etc., etc, I say go for it! It's about time they paid ALL of us taxpayers in the US for the havoc they wrecked on our economy and getting bailed out for a song.

Yep, brilliant.
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Old 04-02-2016, 06:15 AM
 
Location: Whereever we have our RV parked
8,036 posts, read 7,063,138 times
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Colorado Rambler wrote:
Quote:
No. And people can't "just vote themselves into prosperity using other people's stuff" -
This is exactly what Democratic voters hope they are doing. Just look at the increase in the number of people on food stamps, even though supposedly we have a national unemployment rate of 5%? Remember the video of the woman in Chicago at Obama's victory celebration that believed that Obama would now pay all their expenses. The Democrats have been great at handing out a free living to their voters. SSI, welfare, food stamps, Sec 8, heat assistance, subsidized college education, school lunch program, jobs programs, etc, etc, etc. That's why so many of the underclass vote for them.
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Old 04-02-2016, 06:31 AM
 
11,325 posts, read 5,852,301 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Colorado Rambler View Post
No. And people can't "just vote themselves into prosperity using other people's stuff" - not in the USA, anyhow. Maybe they can do this in some European countries which tend to be more accepting of socialist ideas than Americans are.
The problem is that we all live in a global economy and you can't do it in a vacuum. France is having massive strikes right now. Airline traffic halted. Rail traffic halted. Roads blocked. The Socialist government is in the process of killing the 35 hour week and changing the labor laws that make it almost impossible to terminate even non-performing employees. France has massive unemployment problems as corporations flee those labor laws. This is the left wing party in power doing it, not the right wing party.
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Old 04-02-2016, 09:09 AM
 
Location: Columbia MO
1,456 posts, read 1,739,185 times
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"Would the economy be better if only property owners were allowed to vote?"

For the property owners, absolutely.
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Old 04-02-2016, 09:24 AM
 
8,108 posts, read 4,454,981 times
Reputation: 8733
Quote:
Originally Posted by hakkarin View Post
Let's say that only people who own real property ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Real_property ) are allowed to vote, but that in return the only form of taxation is taxation on property. Would this not incentivize good economic policy since only people who have actual economic resources to lose would have a say while people who don't have property don't need to pay taxes? It just seems reasonable that only the people holding wealth get to decide how said wealth is spent for the whole, as compared to the current system where people just vote themselves into prosperity using other people's stuff.
had a long violent discussion about this years ago with my boss, I agree with you.

not on the presidental or congrees votes, but local items like property tax, schools tax. yes i agree, i think you need to be vested into the community before you can vote program,
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