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Old 05-15-2016, 08:23 PM
 
Location: Ruidoso, NM
5,667 posts, read 6,595,121 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jm1982 View Post
No way it will be 1-2% increase .
Do the math. I've shown it a bunch of times.
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Old 05-16-2016, 10:44 AM
 
7,899 posts, read 7,112,201 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rruff View Post
Do the math. I've shown it a bunch of times.

Here is some math:


I live in NY. Fast food employees average just short of $9/hr. The MW is going to go to $15. That is a 67% increase for businesses where labor costs are about 25% of total costs. That calculates to a 17% cost increase.


Many other small businesses are in the same position. Businesses that cut lawns and blow leaves call themselves landscapers. They rely on cheap labor at or near minimum wage. Costs are about 50% labor so the price increases will be about 30-40%. I am already priced out and cannot afford the high prices.


Day care workers in my area are paid an average of $9.77. With the increase to $15, that will be at least another $200/week or $800/month not counting added costs for benefits. The total is more likely to be about $1000/month extra. Depending on age of the children, there needs to be 1 worker for each 5 kids. The extra costs will be $200/month/child. My daughter and son in law have two kids in day care and can barely afford that. I am not sure how they can handle an extra $400/month expense. More low income workers are going to need to drop out of the workforce to take care of kids since day care is beyond their means.
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Old 05-16-2016, 10:49 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles (Native)
25,303 posts, read 21,458,447 times
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Good points . It's going to change of eliminate many industries entirely . I don't think that is the type of change the pro $15 crowd was looking for ...
People are just looking at it from an emotional point of view.
They think it will be a quick easy fix , but aren't looking at all the negative consequences for working people .
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Old 05-16-2016, 10:56 AM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
37,465 posts, read 61,396,384 times
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When wages go up; prices go up. Housing costs increase, the cost of food goes up, every thing goes up. Because city and state employees wages go up, so the municipal revenue must go up. Which means that your taxes go up. When wages go up; prices go up and your taxes go up.

Travel around the nation. See for yourself. Cities with high paying jobs, also have high COL. Their COL is high because all prices and taxes are higher. Yet at the same time, keep traveling and you can see low wage areas where the COL is low. When wages go up; prices and COL goes up to match. Nobody wins.

Nobody wins but are their any losers? Hmm. What about those whose income did not go up? Everyone on pensions, SS, SSDI who are doing okay living in a region with low COL. When the wages double, the COL will double, and what happens to those on fixed incomes? They become impoverished. Nobody wins, and pretty of people lose.
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Old 05-16-2016, 11:00 AM
 
Location: Ruidoso, NM
5,667 posts, read 6,595,121 times
Reputation: 4817
Quote:
Originally Posted by jm1982 View Post
it's not a 1-2% increase , it's much higher .
Aggregate cost of everything. I have no idea what you are referring to, or how you are tracking it "on the ground".

I am 100% certain that every price that increases and every business that fails will attributed to the MW increase. The screaming and yelling and gnashing of teeth will escalate for a time, but in reality everything will be fine and people will keep moving to CA and getting jobs and businesses will grow. The nutcases will then be off chasing their new pet theory about armageddon.

Your fiasco regarding Denmark's MW proves that you use any excuse you think you can get away with to support your "case". Deliberately lying is a lot worse than just being a nut.
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Old 05-16-2016, 11:11 AM
 
7,899 posts, read 7,112,201 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jm1982 View Post
Good points . It's going to change of eliminate many industries entirely ...... .
There are going to be a lot of changes, but it seems we often do not have the data to calculate the impact. Gas stations and convenience stores are staffed with low paid labor. Gas stations operate on very low profit margins. Many are going to need to look at the cost of labor on off shifts and may just need to close. I would not be surprised to see many gas stations close up for third shift. In small towns and remote locations they might need to consider closing on 2nd shift as well. That could make it a real nuisance to drive evenings or nights in low population areas of the country.
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Old 05-16-2016, 11:16 AM
 
Location: Ruidoso, NM
5,667 posts, read 6,595,121 times
Reputation: 4817
Quote:
Originally Posted by jrkliny View Post
Here is some math: I live in NY. Fast food employees average just short of $9/hr. The MW is going to go to $15. That is a 67% increase for businesses where labor costs are about 25% of total costs. That calculates to a 17% cost increase.
Good examples, all. But you need to compute the cost of labor compared to sales, not the costs. In fast food this is typically 15-20%.

You mention lawn service and daycare, and how some people will no longer be able to afford them. Have you ever considered how the people working those $9/hr jobs are able to afford *anything*?

If you really want to have a cheap slave/servant class then retire in a 3rd world country, don't turn the US into one.
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Old 05-16-2016, 11:21 AM
 
Location: Ruidoso, NM
5,667 posts, read 6,595,121 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrkliny View Post
Many are going to need to look at the cost of labor on off shifts and may just need to close.
They can just raise their prices. Do you think the working poor who got a big pay increase won't be buying things there?

The *only* businesses that might be hurting are the ones where a high % of their sales are in low wage labor, *and* they cater to a higher income customer.
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Old 05-16-2016, 12:23 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles (Native)
25,303 posts, read 21,458,447 times
Reputation: 12318
Quote:
Originally Posted by rruff View Post
Aggregate cost of everything. I have no idea what you are referring to, or how you are tracking it "on the ground".

I am 100% certain that every price that increases and every business that fails will attributed to the MW increase. The screaming and yelling and gnashing of teeth will escalate for a time, but in reality everything will be fine and people will keep moving to CA and getting jobs and businesses will grow. The nutcases will then be off chasing their new pet theory about armageddon.

Your fiasco regarding Denmark's MW proves that you use any excuse you think you can get away with to support your "case". Deliberately lying is a lot worse than just being a nut.
I didn't lie about anything . Saying prices will only go up 1-2% is a lie

On the ground meaning seeing what is happening with prices day to day in a city affected by minimum wage increases . My experience is Los Angeles.
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Old 05-16-2016, 12:26 PM
 
7,899 posts, read 7,112,201 times
Reputation: 18603
Quote:
Originally Posted by rruff View Post
Good examples, all. But you need to compute the cost of labor compared to sales, not the costs. In fast food this is typically 15-20%.

.....
Or maybe 26% of costs with a 3% margin. How Higher Minimum Wage for Fast-Food Workers Can Affect Prices


A 3% profit margin seems low, but the industry average for even McDs is 6%. Blimpie, Quiznos and others are already failing and the chains are likely to go under even without a MW increase.
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