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Old 04-27-2016, 09:54 AM
 
3,792 posts, read 2,384,773 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by I_Like_Spam View Post
Fair enough analysis.


But since minimum wage hasn't kept up, neither have the old folks as their checks haven't kept up with the same inflationary cycle.


If the minimum wage gets raised, as proposed to $15, should not the checks for SSI and Social Security recipients be doubled as well?
But old folks get to live in retirement housing that is subsidized.
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Old 04-27-2016, 11:34 AM
 
10,075 posts, read 7,538,920 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ContrarianEcon View Post
But old folks get to live in retirement housing that is subsidized.
Poor people live in subsidized housing too
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Old 04-27-2016, 02:22 PM
 
Location: Ohio
24,621 posts, read 19,159,948 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by I_Like_Spam View Post
But since minimum wage hasn't kept up,...
Prove that minimum wage or any wage must keep pace with Inflation.
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Old 04-27-2016, 02:31 PM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,451,622 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eyeb View Post
Poor people live in subsidized housing too

MOST poor people live in UNsubsidized housing. Where I live, waiting lists for subsidized housing are at least 5-10 years long.
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Old 04-27-2016, 02:32 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mircea View Post
Prove that minimum wage or any wage must keep pace with Inflation.

Cannot be proven or disproven; that is a political issue.
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Old 04-27-2016, 02:43 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ringwise View Post
You clearly do not know how Prop 13 works. First of all, new homeowners are not exempt. Secondly, it's not just homeowners, but all property owners, that fall under Prop 13.

How are new homeowners not exempt? You buy a home, the sale price establishes your assessment, and Prop 13 protects you as long as your home is not sold or transferred outside your family. Yes, it's all homeowners but historically homeowners got the primary benefits because business property on average was sold - and thus reassessed - more frequently than owner-occupied homes...until businesses adopted methods designed to afford their property the same protection as owner-occupied homes.

e.g. Five owners successively own and sell a commercial building; property is reassessed five times... One owner conveys commercial building to his corporate shell, the corporate shell is sold five times but the building is reassessed only once.
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Old 04-27-2016, 03:16 PM
 
17,400 posts, read 11,972,033 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
How are new homeowners not exempt? You buy a home, the sale price establishes your assessment, and Prop 13 protects you as long as your home is not sold or transferred outside your family. Yes, it's all homeowners but historically homeowners got the primary benefits because business property on average was sold - and thus reassessed - more frequently than owner-occupied homes...until businesses adopted methods designed to afford their property the same protection as owner-occupied homes.

e.g. Five owners successively own and sell a commercial building; property is reassessed five times... One owner conveys commercial building to his corporate shell, the corporate shell is sold five times but the building is reassessed only once.
You keep implying that it's just homeowners that get a perk. Per your example, a new homeowner OR commercial property owner is the same. The homeowner, in the same situation, gets NO additional tax break or exemption. NONE.
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Old 04-27-2016, 03:38 PM
 
Location: Mableton, GA USA (NW Atlanta suburb, 4 miles OTP)
11,334 posts, read 26,081,428 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by I_Like_Spam View Post
It hasn't lagged behind Social Security, VA and SSI payments or the official federal COLA rates.

The federal minimum wage back in 1986 was $3.35, today its $7.25
The federal SSI payment back in 1986 was $336/month, today its $733.

Both up about 117% over the past 30 years.

Impoverished working people aren't falling behind any more than fixed income senior citizens, and are probably doing BETTER than them as old people spend a lot more on medical care which has risen by a greater amount than the cost of living in general
OK, that's a very Interesting comparison. Thank you.

Many of those older folks have other income to supplement their SSI payments, however, while many minimum wage earners do not. Even those who have multiple jobs get hit by the lack of hours and benefits that often accompany minimum wage positions.

Some older people are also working minimum wage jobs, so they get both. Younger people don't have that option.
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Old 04-27-2016, 03:42 PM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,451,622 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ringwise View Post
You keep implying that it's just homeowners that get a perk. Per your example, a new homeowner OR commercial property owner is the same. The homeowner, in the same situation, gets NO additional tax break or exemption. NONE.

Before Prop 13, individual owners typically conveyed their non-homestead property to buyers (new owners) by selling the property directly. Prop 13 changed this by motivating owners to place their nonhomestead property in corporate shells in order to keep Prop 13 protection by selling the property indirectly through the shell rather than directly, which would trigger reassessment.
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Old 04-27-2016, 03:50 PM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,451,622 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by I_Like_Spam View Post
It hasn't lagged behind Social Security, VA and SSI payments or the official federal COLA rates.


The federal minimum wage back in 1986 was $3.35, today its $7.25

The federal SSI payment back in 1986 was $336/month, today its $733.


Both up about 117% over the past 30 years.


Impoverished working people aren't falling behind any more than fixed income senior citizens, and are probably doing BETTER than them as old people spend a lot more on medical care which has risen by a greater amount than the cost of living in general

I disagree. Most fixed income senior citizens enjoy stable, largely fixed housing costs. They have a very high homeownership rate (mortgage either retired or old and low), or are living in subsidized housing with stable housing costs tied to their income. Impoverished working people typically pay market rents in UNsubsidized housing. (Since half of all low-income renters spend at least half their income on shelter, we KNOW that a minority of low-income renters live in subsidized housing.)

Impoverished working people are falling WAY behind if they pay market rent in unsubsidized housing. In my area, rents went up 15 percent last year while there was no SS COLA.
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