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So just had a great conversation with a elderly person while i was out shopping and he stated that when things were made prior to plastic being the go too, things were made with quality in mind. Things lasted longer and people took pride in there work. Thus the main reason why cast iron, tin toys, are lasting longer than todays toys or house hold items. So his concept holds true, the main reason why we build things with cheaper products, is so they break easy and in return we are having to repurchase the item again and again, thus making that company more money. I remember having a Tonka dump truck and crane that was made from tin and real cable wire and rubber tires, now its all plastic and junk, breaks after about 4 hours of use in a sandbox.
So what happen to quality work, when it become quantity vs quality?
It went out a long time ago. Due to the pace of technological progress, many people are eager to replace whatever they have with something more modern. That's why there's less emphasis on quality nowadays (if you count durability as part of quality).
We often read that real wages have stagnated for decades. Somehow the good old days were supposed to have been better than now. This was a big issue in the past election and Bernie Sanders was especially vocal about it. Trump promised to make America Better Again. Somehow life for the average middle class American family has not progressed. That is not what we see. Houses and cars are bigger and better than ever. We have better, cheaper food and clothing. More sophisticated electronic devices. Everyone expects A/C, cellphones, iPads and a Fitbit.
What is happening is something different. Sure there has been a very slow recovery from the Great Recession. That is a global event. Other trends have been going on for decades. These include automation, robotics, computerization, big agriculture and big ranching, globalization and an influx of tens of millions of low or unskilled workers. The bottom of our middle class is being hit hard. Modern society is offering great jobs for those with skills and education. Those without are sinking with no end in sight.
I would love to know what you are referring to. I can barely think of anything I owe that breaks quickly and needs to be replaced.
It's called "Built-in obsolescence" and we see it a lot with appliances these days. I mentioned in another thread that my brand new Maytag washer (the dependability people) broke after 3 years. Maytag wouldn't fix it for free as it was out of warranty. It would have cost me almost as much to fix it as to just buy another washer. After mentioning that another poster told me she had the same experience with her Maytag, only hers lasted 4 years.
Years ago appliances would last you a good 20 years but many companies figured out a way to make more money by forcing you to replace the appliance more frequently.
Remember TV repairmen? Do they even exist anymore? What do people do when their TV breaks? Do they try and find a repair person or do they just go buy another TV?
I think it's a combo of built-in obsolescence and our throw away mentality.
It's called "Built-in obsolescence" and we see it a lot with appliances these days. I mentioned in another thread that my brand new Maytag washer (the dependability people) broke after 3 years. Maytag wouldn't fix it for free as it was out of warranty. It would have cost me almost as much to fix it as to just buy another washer. After mentioning that another poster told me she had the same experience with her Maytag, only hers lasted 4 years.
Years ago appliances would last you a good 20 years but many companies figured out a way to make more money by forcing you to replace the appliance more frequently.
Remember TV repairmen? Do they even exist anymore? What do people do when their TV breaks? Do they try and find a repair person or do they just go buy another TV?
I think it's a combo of built-in obsolescence and our throw away mentality.
Also it is a byproduct of the wage gap and economy of scale. Subpar goods are mass manufactured by the low wage work force overseas and at home keeping the prices cheap. Subpar goods are to be repaired, when available, piece by piece by businesses charging steep hourly rates, at let's say $100/hr much of the stuff owned by the ersatz consuming middle class makes no economic sense to repair. The "new" economy of cheap disposable goods and obsenely priced services built on the backs of 3rd world encourages waste.
Aside of cars a lot of things turned to junk. Garden tools, garden tractors, appliances, toys, kitchen stuff, most of tools, construction materials, furniture, shoes, etc., etc. .......
So you finally conceded on cars. Let us again look at a few of the items on your list.
Garden tools - I just bought a shovel. It looks every bit as good as a shovel from years ago, except it only cost me $11. I cannot see any difference in garden tractors over the years. The engines seem to last forever. They die because of abuse such as hitting big rocks. Even then usually the repair is just a $1 shear pin.
Appliances - I have had no problems ever. If you are worried about longevity, go to Sears or another big box store and buy the extended warranty. Some refrigerators come with a 10 year compressor warranty as standard. Check with Consumer Reports. They provide a list of recommendations for durable appliances.
Toys - The old truck in the sandbox has been replaced by ipads, Gameboys and computers. If you still want the high quality Teddy bears and dolls, they are available. You just wont find them at KMart.
Construction materials - Like 2x4's? How about steel replacements that do not burn? Or granite countertops? Designer roofing shingles with a 50 year guarantee? Waterproof bathroom materials instead of tile on wallboard? A/C units that are efficient and last forever? Nail guns that speed work and prevent repetitive motion injuries? High end windows with double panes and built in blinds? Should I continue?
Shoes - I absolutely love the modern choices. I buy high tech walking/hiking shoes. They last forever and are built to be comfortable. My old Western Steers were true junk by comparison. The soles wore out quickly and they took almost as long to break in.
Furniture - You can still buy high end furniture. It costs!
Kitchen stuff - WOW, we have a high end kitchen store nearby. The choices and quality are amazing.
Either you have a very selective memory or live in the middle of nowhere without access to decent stores.
I cooked my dinner today in a cast iron pot. (For which there is a huge demand)
In fact I have very FEW cooking containers which are not cast iron or stonewear.
Similar quality cookware is $$$$$.
My grandfather's tools are among my best tools
As to food, in the last few years I've started getting food like my grandpa grew up with.
Raw milk, GMO free, fruits and vegies grown for flavor vs how long they will sit pretty on a shelf...
There's NO COMPARISON!
I don't think that poster is off base. While you may want to use cast iron, many do not. Many families do little cooking at all, because both parents are working, and when they do cook, it is something quick and in a non-stick aluminum or stainless steel pan.
So you finally conceded on cars. Let us again look at a few of the items on your list.
Garden tools - I just bought a shovel. It looks every bit as good as a shovel from years ago, except it only cost me $11. I cannot see any difference in garden tractors over the years. The engines seem to last forever. They die because of abuse such as hitting big rocks. Even then usually the repair is just a $1 shear pin.
Appliances - I have had no problems ever. If you are worried about longevity, go to Sears or another big box store and buy the extended warranty. Some refrigerators come with a 10 year compressor warranty as standard. Check with Consumer Reports. They provide a list of recommendations for durable appliances.
Toys - The old truck in the sandbox has been replaced by ipads, Gameboys and computers. If you still want the high quality Teddy bears and dolls, they are available. You just wont find them at KMart.
Construction materials - Like 2x4's? How about steel replacements that do not burn? Or granite countertops? Designer roofing shingles with a 50 year guarantee? Waterproof bathroom materials instead of tile on wallboard? A/C units that are efficient and last forever? Nail guns that speed work and prevent repetitive motion injuries? High end windows with double panes and built in blinds? Should I continue?
Shoes - I absolutely love the modern choices. I buy high tech walking/hiking shoes. They last forever and a built to be comfortable. My old Western Steers were true junk by comparison. The soles wore out quickly and they took almost as long to break in.
Furniture - You can still buy high end furniture. It costs!
Kitchen stuff - WOW, we have a high end kitchen store nearby. The choices and quality are amazing.
Either you have a very selective memory or live in the middle of nowhere without access to decent stores.
We just live in different world then. Much of the garden tools are not just junky, some of the tools are gotcha junk one cannot even use, I went through 4 shovels in the last 4 years, but if you dont use them much they will last as a decorative item. Garden tractors? you cannot be serious to claim what you claim, it is a steep decline over all brands, not only they dont last, they dont cut what the old tractors used to cut. Generic appliances do not last, I am not in the high end market. Toys are junk. Generic kitchen stuff - junk, some of it gotcha junk good for nothing, I wasted a small fortune on the can openers alone, dont work, dont last. But you seems talking about high end stuff anyway not what an average person can realistically afford.
+1
Cars made as late as the '50s typically needed a valve & ring job by 50k miles. However, the extreme rust problems of these cars meant that people who drove less than average probably didn't even get to put 50k miles on their cars before they had to junk them as a result of the rust.
Oil changes actually used to be every 1,000 miles, up through the late '50s, and there was also a need to lube about 20 places on the chassis at that same number of miles. In the '60s, 3k-4k oil changes became more common. And, we had to replace the spark plugs, points, and condenser every 10k miles, and we also had to deal with those incredibly inefficient carburetors.
The old bias-ply tires were frequently even shorter-lived than you recalled. My father's '66 Ford Galaxie 500 came with BFG Silvertown tires that were almost bald at 16k miles. They were evenly worn, so it wasn't an alignment problem. The real problem was that the tires in those days were barely rated for the unladen weight of the car. Put 4 people and luggage in the car, and the tires were overloaded by several hundred pounds, and that takes an awful toll on the life of the tire. And, or course, those old bias-ply tires produced handling that was really bad.
The cars from The Good Old Days needed a huge amount of maintenance, and even with that intensive maintenance, they simply didn't last very long. And, they had crummy brakes, awful handling, and were dangerous to their occupants in a crash.
Ergo, The Good Old Days were nowhere near as good as people like to think that they were.
Cars are definitely one item that it can be said are better now, but I believe it pertains mainly to the mechanical systems (engines, transmissions, drive train, fuel system, etc). The frames and bodies are better in that they don't rust as much, but considering that cars are smaller and that much of the bodies are plastic with foam bumpers, they are a lot easier to total these days from an accident.
I have in my garage a 40 year old fridge I inherited from a deceased relative. In less than 20 years I probably had 2-3 modern fridge which broke and were not worth fixing. I had an $800 front load washer which broke after a year. Water leaked and shorted everything out and was a total loss.
You can buy things built to last but you will pay an arm and a leg compared to the past where everything was built to last. I have a 15 year old pair of hiking boots which I paid quite a bit for years ago, however it can be resoled and it has paid for itself instead of buying a new cheap pair every year. I have a tool set I received from a deceased grandparent which are probably 70+ years old and still work fine.
Cars are definitely one item that it can be said are better now, but I believe it pertains mainly to the mechanical systems (engines, transmissions, drive train, fuel system, etc). The frames and bodies are better in that they don't rust as much, but considering that cars are smaller and that much of the bodies are plastic with foam bumpers, they are a lot easier to total these days from an accident.
Maybe compared to the 1950s. Cars, IMO peaked in the 1980s/90s. Since then they have just been getting unnecessarily complicated without getting any better.
As to the larger point of the thread, you can still find high quality of any item you choose, you just have to do research. If you think, "I want [X]" and then drive over to your local big box emporium, head straight to the [X] isle, and buy the first [X] you see prominently displayed at eye level, you'll probably get something overpriced and low quality. If you spend an hour or two reading blogs about [X] and finding out which brands are the longest lasting and best value, then rigorously price-compare at several online sites, you'll have better results.
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