U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Economics
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 03-27-2017, 08:57 PM
 
2,360 posts, read 1,034,056 times
Reputation: 2071

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by TaxPhd View Post
What would you like me to chime in on?



Price gouging doesn't exist - except for government, or natural monopolies where government oversight isn't properly applied (as you aptly showed in your example).
Shouldnt be any natural monopolies period. Yes they built the lines and poles, but should be allowing others to rent those lines or buy space on the poles. Them keeping others coming in on their territory is wrong and should be penalized. Every town or state should have more than 2 power, water, ISP providers than just having one monopolist were they can price gouge you. It happens you know it so stop ignoring it.

Their is price gouging every where you go, at the gas pumps, food store, every day items you need, even your cell phone is over priced. How is it that one gas station can have 15 cents different than a competing gas station, and they get the same truck?, I work in retail so i see wholesale cost every day.. Because we only buy what we can sell, to keep from having over stock, we dont get the big discounts that the big box store gets. We get our stuff from the same vendor, vendor price gouge the little guys.. it happens. ISP does this knowing they are the ONLY provider in town so they can jack up the rates anytime since their is no contracts anymore. How can you jack up the price 50mb internet when NOTHING changed on your end or the head office. sorry cost doesnt jump %20 in 6 months. Not in the ISP industry. Take a look at our cell phone price wars now. If it wasnt for T-Mobil breaking the rules by dropping contracts and lowering the rates it created a fenzy. The big guys saw their people leaving in flocks, so they had to stop price gouging to keep the cust from leaving. Competition is the best thing for the consumer, just not for the big business.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 03-27-2017, 10:57 PM
 
3,071 posts, read 1,630,712 times
Reputation: 7974
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pub-911 View Post
Why do you all hate capitalism? In a capitalist system, entrepreneurs manipulate prices in order to maximize profit to shareholders, not benefits to customers.
Asked and answered in the same post.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-27-2017, 11:13 PM
 
5,239 posts, read 2,387,943 times
Reputation: 5119
Quote:
Originally Posted by RememberMee View Post
I am saying that under normal circumstances gas retailers avoid competition on the price field. I have a hunch that relatively small franchise station operators are afraid to sneeze not to upset corporate gas heavyweights, while big chains see no pressing value in pricing their smaller competitors out of existence (not to invite big chains to move in), as a result price truce sets in, something like that happens between big neighboring box stores peddling the same junk, prices are very similar, or they would do price matching upon demand. John D. Rockefeller once exclaimed, “Competition is a sin!” and I believe Economics 101 does not emphasize reluctant nature of business competition.
What do you think would happen if a gas retailer (regardless of size) were to price their gas $.50 higher or lower than the market clearing equilibrium price for their location?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-27-2017, 11:18 PM
 
5,239 posts, read 2,387,943 times
Reputation: 5119
Quote:
Originally Posted by RememberMee View Post
The most vivid memory of 911 I have is hysteric voice of a radio announcer calling patriotic citizenry to report price gouging. Some gas stations doubled+ their prices as soon as planes hit wtc. Apparently there are anti gouging laws just for that occasion. But under normal circumstances businesses avoid price wars.
That some who are uneducated about economics believe price gouging exists, and some politicians pander to that belief is hardly evidence of the existence of "price gouging."

After 9/11, why didn't gas stations raise their prices ten-fold? If "price gouging" exists, it would have been for them to do so. Why didn't they?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-27-2017, 11:29 PM
 
5,239 posts, read 2,387,943 times
Reputation: 5119
Quote:
Originally Posted by hitpausebutton2 View Post
Shouldnt be any natural monopolies period. Yes they built the lines and poles, but should be allowing others to rent those lines or buy space on the poles. Them keeping others coming in on their territory is wrong and should be penalized. Every town or state should have more than 2 power, water, ISP providers than just having one monopolist were they can price gouge you. It happens you know it so stop ignoring it.
Did you not understand my post where I said it does happen in natural monopolies where proper oversight was lacking?

Quote:
Their is price gouging every where you go, at the gas pumps, food store, every day items you need, even your cell phone is over priced. How is it that one gas station can have 15 cents different than a competing gas station, and they get the same truck?, I work in retail so i see wholesale cost every day.. Because we only buy what we can sell, to keep from having over stock, we dont get the big discounts that the big box store gets. We get our stuff from the same vendor, vendor price gouge the little guys.. it happens. ISP does this knowing they are the ONLY provider in town so they can jack up the rates anytime since their is no contracts anymore. How can you jack up the price 50mb internet when NOTHING changed on your end or the head office. sorry cost doesnt jump %20 in 6 months. Not in the ISP industry. Take a look at our cell phone price wars now. If it wasnt for T-Mobil breaking the rules by dropping contracts and lowering the rates it created a fenzy. The big guys saw their people leaving in flocks, so they had to stop price gouging to keep the cust from leaving. Competitin is the best thing for the consumer, just not for the big business.
Explain how a retailer can ask, and get (consistently) more than the equilibrium price for their goods and services?

Gas stations are frequently accused of price gouging. If a gas station in your town was charging $2/gallon more than every other gas station in town (and they get to do that because they are "price gouging"), how much gas will they be selling?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-28-2017, 01:59 AM
 
4,829 posts, read 4,814,241 times
Reputation: 6172
Quote:
Originally Posted by TaxPhd View Post
That some who are uneducated about economics believe price gouging exists, and some politicians pander to that belief is hardly evidence of the existence of "price gouging."

After 9/11, why didn't gas stations raise their prices ten-fold? If "price gouging" exists, it would have been for them to do so. Why didn't they?
Doubling and tripling prices within a few hours of 911 is not as insignificant as you make it to be. Hell only knows the prices had 911 been a major supply shattering disaster. As a rule in the time of major wars and disasters (black) market prices are way outside of reach of average people thus rationing must be instituted. Aren't you Ron Paul fan? I clearly remember him saying that free markets would have allocated resources in the most efficient way during ww2. Perhaps, in economic terms, it would have been the case, free markets would have allocated much greater share of wealth to the owners of scarce commodities. BUT in practical terms it would have been a disaster. The best way to understand modern economics is to imagine a guarded water tanker selling water to the people dying of thirst. More desperate people would give more and/or agreed to progressively more demeaning demands.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-28-2017, 09:13 AM
 
4,829 posts, read 4,814,241 times
Reputation: 6172
Quote:
Originally Posted by TaxPhd View Post
What do you think would happen if a gas retailer (regardless of size) were to price their gas $.50 higher or lower than the market clearing equilibrium price for their location?
As I mentioned before gas prices at interstate exits are virtually identical because large chains do not want to play the pricing game on each other (per John D Rockefeller advice) while smaller franchises do not dare an attempt. I frequent a town without major gas station chains, there is much more price variability, but again nothing dramatic.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-28-2017, 09:39 AM
 
2,360 posts, read 1,034,056 times
Reputation: 2071
Quote:
Originally Posted by TaxPhd View Post
Did you not understand my post where I said it does happen in natural monopolies where proper oversight was lacking?



Explain how a retailer can ask, and get (consistently) more than the equilibrium price for their goods and services?

Gas stations are frequently accused of price gouging. If a gas station in your town was charging $2/gallon more than every other gas station in town (and they get to do that because they are "price gouging"), how much gas will they be selling?
Consider the next town over with gas is more than 20+ miles away, than you really dont have a choice if your on empty. If your the only gas station, than yes.. price gouging.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-28-2017, 09:44 AM
 
2,360 posts, read 1,034,056 times
Reputation: 2071
Quote:
Originally Posted by TaxPhd View Post
That some who are uneducated about economics believe price gouging exists, and some politicians pander to that belief is hardly evidence of the existence of "price gouging."

After 9/11, why didn't gas stations raise their prices ten-fold? If "price gouging" exists, it would have been for them to do so. Why didn't they?
Belive the law under state of emergency that prevented them from raising prices.. But some got away with it and were caught doing it and fine.

9/13/01: State gas stations charged with fraud | News-Gazette.com

http://fleetowner.com/news/fleet_states_suing_gas
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-28-2017, 11:37 AM
 
5,239 posts, read 2,387,943 times
Reputation: 5119
Quote:
Originally Posted by RememberMee View Post
Doubling and tripling prices within a few hours of 911 is not as insignificant as you make it to be. Hell only knows the prices had 911 been a major supply shattering disaster. As a rule in the time of major wars and disasters (black) market prices are way outside of reach of average people thus rationing must be instituted. Aren't you Ron Paul fan? I clearly remember him saying that free markets would have allocated resources in the most efficient way during ww2. Perhaps, in economic terms, it would have been the case, free markets would have allocated much greater share of wealth to the owners of scarce commodities. BUT in practical terms it would have been a disaster. The best way to understand modern economics is to imagine a guarded water tanker selling water to the people dying of thirst. More desperate people would give more and/or agreed to progressively more demeaning demands.
Do you not want to answer the question that I posed in the post that you responded to?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Economics
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2018, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top