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Old 05-27-2017, 08:10 AM
 
Location: Prepperland
13,116 posts, read 9,202,467 times
Reputation: 8988

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoonose View Post
Can you 'cliff note' the above? It's not clear to me the lesson (s).
The currency / money token system is a giant scam to skim a fortune for those who operate it. Socialism and retirement accounts are suicidal, since the money token is highly taxed, devalues, and only benefits those who are on the top of the pyramid.
*** You've been punked ***

Money does not make one prosperous. If that were true, a billionaire trapped on a deserted island would be prosperous. Money only functions where one NEEDS money and will trade labor and property for that money.

Where people have learned to live without needing money, prosperity is based on prodigious production, equitable trade, and enjoyment of surplus usable goods and services. And without the involvement of money, there is no way to ACCOUNT for the money value of that trade. All Socio-eCONomic pontifications and explanations are meaningless in societies that move away from "needing money."

Absent socialism, money and usury, the only way one can prosper is by generating prodigious surplus of usable goods and services, and equitably trading with others.

Once one can no longer be productive, one must rely upon one’s stored surplus, upon one’s family, or the charity of strangers. Prepare accordingly.
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Old 05-27-2017, 08:31 AM
 
8,280 posts, read 3,454,476 times
Reputation: 1584
Quote:
Originally Posted by jetgraphics View Post
The currency / money token system is a giant scam to skim a fortune for those who operate it. Socialism and retirement accounts are suicidal, since the money token is highly taxed, devalues, and only benefits those who are on the top of the pyramid.
*** You've been punked ***

Money does not make one prosperous. If that were true, a billionaire trapped on a deserted island would be prosperous. Money only functions where one NEEDS money and will trade labor and property for that money.

Where people have learned to live without needing money, prosperity is based on prodigious production, equitable trade, and enjoyment of surplus usable goods and services. And without the involvement of money, there is no way to ACCOUNT for the money value of that trade. All Socio-eCONomic pontifications and explanations are meaningless in societies that move away from "needing money."

Absent socialism, money and usury, the only way one can prosper is by generating prodigious surplus of usable goods and services, and equitably trading with others.

Once one can no longer be productive, one must rely upon one’s stored surplus, upon one’s family, or the charity of strangers. Prepare accordingly.
Very interesting.

I would suggest that one learn all the details of our money scam, take advantage of it, and/or make the best of it. Accumulating tokens over the long term and try and beat inflation. Legal tax avoidance. Learn how to leverage your tokens to accumulate more. Extracting rent can be very rewarding. Like you say the key is productivity, but all along the way tokens are very useful as exchange for just about anything one's heart desires. Socialism, money and usury are not going away. Or death and taxes. I used to be a punk, but stuck to a successful long term plan that prepared me properly.

I would say that money can make you prosperous if managed properly. I would also say that that billionaire could stay prosperous using our modern technologies.
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Old 05-27-2017, 08:57 AM
 
4,229 posts, read 1,905,340 times
Reputation: 3782
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoonose View Post
Distant future do you envision a universal basic income or some sort of central jobs creation program?
The distant future is unknowable, save for the certainty of being dead long before then. As the founders did, I will leave it to the peoples of those times to make those sorts of decisions for themselves. Hopefully however, they will have learned by then not to elect people like Donald Trump.
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Old 05-27-2017, 09:03 AM
 
33,046 posts, read 20,714,185 times
Reputation: 8928
Quote:
Originally Posted by MLSFan View Post
if everyone moved to venezuela, that $400,000,000,000 becomes like $4,000
not a problem, the only way burger flippers make it to retirement is by relying on government already, they are already living in retirement if you count tax dollars spent on them. So they know what the next 50 years of life will be like, enjoy it

??? ??? ??? ??? What tax dollars are being spent on childless burger flippers in states which did not expand Medicaid?

e.g. no Medicaid, no EITC, no child tax credits, no food stamps, no Section 8 housing assistance...
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Old 05-27-2017, 09:56 AM
 
Location: USA
6,171 posts, read 4,950,686 times
Reputation: 10547
If you're working as a burger flipper, chances are you are making so little you qualify for a number of welfare programs. Just think of the billions of dollars the taxpayer forks out to subsidize the Walmart workers.
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Old 05-27-2017, 10:00 AM
 
Location: Vallejo
13,438 posts, read 15,041,010 times
Reputation: 11924
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chemistry_Guy View Post
I am fighting to get to the point where my retirement income is 70% of my salary but I keep getting these huge raises, inflating my salary to the point where 70% just isn't feasible anymore.


Seriously, the summary for this article should be that mature economies cannot consistently achieve the growth of developing economies and some of the world's biggest economies will be significantly more developed by 2050.
Just depends. As long as you're getting these huge raises relatively early on, it just makes it easier. Sure you hop tax brackets but those are marginal money while you don't need to inflate your standard of living. If you were comfortable on $50,000 and 20% savings, it should be easy to do a 40% savings on $100,000. You don't really need any of that money for living expenses so it can go entirely to taxes and savings.
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Old 05-27-2017, 10:10 AM
 
Location: Cincinnati near
2,507 posts, read 3,351,758 times
Reputation: 5606
Quote:
Originally Posted by Malloric View Post
Just depends. As long as you're getting these huge raises relatively early on, it just makes it easier. Sure you hop tax brackets but those are marginal money while you don't need to inflate your standard of living. If you were comfortable on $50,000 and 20% savings, it should be easy to do a 40% savings on $100,000. You don't really need any of that money for living expenses so it can go entirely to taxes and savings.
My point was meant to be tongue-in-cheek; I am not actually getting huge raises. The point is that the 400 trillion number is mostly meaningless because it is merely a product of the difference in growth patterns between developing and developed economies. The logic that dirt poor people need less retirement savings than middle class, so a rising middle class in developing countries constitutes a 'crisis' is fairly ridiculous.
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Old 05-27-2017, 10:39 AM
 
3,789 posts, read 1,723,980 times
Reputation: 2154
Quote:
The point is that the 400 trillion number is mostly meaningless because it is merely a product of the difference in growth patterns between developing and developed economies.
hardly meaningless. and this is just retirement income shortfall. 400 Trillion is mind boggling and these "experts" & "professors" help get us into this mess. Great reset coming either in the form of currency crisis, war or population reduction.
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Old 05-27-2017, 11:05 AM
 
Location: Vallejo
13,438 posts, read 15,041,010 times
Reputation: 11924
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chemistry_Guy View Post
My point was meant to be tongue-in-cheek; I am not actually getting huge raises. The point is that the 400 trillion number is mostly meaningless because it is merely a product of the difference in growth patterns between developing and developed economies. The logic that dirt poor people need less retirement savings than middle class, so a rising middle class in developing countries constitutes a 'crisis' is fairly ridiculous.
It is and it isn't.

Used to be more care by relatives and iceflows. If you didn't have relatives that could care for you, you got the iceflows. Maybe there might be some very small amount of resources but pretty much you just went homeless if you couldn't afford shelter, begged, and then died. I saw a lot of that in Cambodia. Most of the elderly had family. Those that didn't, well, they probably didn't last too long. There's limited access to anything beyond basic medicine. They die earlier, life expectancy is 14 years less than Korea. That's something Japan and Korea are grappling with now. The traditional family structure where relatives are cared for in old age is falling apart. Society is more mobile and human capital is more utilized. A 50-year-old working full-time can't necessarily provide the support that their 75-year-old parents may need so they're dealing with how to provide care services. Society is more mobile so the kids may be in different parts of the country or world rather than remaining in the same area they were born. In developing Cambodia they're not really dealing with that. Most don't make it to 75 anyway, and those that do are pretty healthy or they'd have died before 75. If they don't have relatives, they end up begging and I can't imagine they last long. Tough to see. In the villages it was common to see a few elderly beggars, sometimes dozens in large ones, along the roads coming in and out of town. Some of them seemed to be more out there for social hour, but some of them looked really bad.
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Old 05-27-2017, 11:26 AM
 
8,280 posts, read 3,454,476 times
Reputation: 1584
Quote:
Originally Posted by illtaketwoplease View Post
hardly meaningless. and this is just retirement income shortfall. 400 Trillion is mind boggling and these "experts" & "professors" help get us into this mess. Great reset coming either in the form of currency crisis, war or population reduction.
Pick any number. Money can be created. The real essence is based in resources, productivity and then distribution.
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