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Old 03-03-2018, 08:55 PM
 
Location: Niceville, FL
7,282 posts, read 15,288,684 times
Reputation: 7029

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Quote:
Originally Posted by harry chickpea View Post
The idea that a maker of overpriced vacuums that took a company OUT of the U.S. and began using PLASTIC parts is now "re-thinking" building a factory in the U.S. based on a tariff on aluminum and steel is frankly asinine posturing, picked up by the media for consumption by the gullible. If it can't make a profit because it pays a buck or two more for steel per unit, where is the low price to the consumer that every other maker seems to be able to manage?
They make far more than vacuums including some very high end stoves, refrigerators, and other appliances with their nice stainless steel finishes.
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Old 03-03-2018, 09:18 PM
 
Location: la la land
27,190 posts, read 11,359,293 times
Reputation: 19285
Quote:
Originally Posted by njbiodude View Post
Let's say a corporation gets a 15% tax cuts then has to pay a 15% premium on metals does it really effect them in the end very much? Save money one place, spend it in another. The only difference is American metals are bought keeping American manufacturers in business, which can be converted into war materials if necessary.

Some unscrupulous companies may try to claim the tariffs caused them to raise prices, but eventually the free market will fix that.
What do you think, that 20 new steel plants are going to magically open up because of these tariffs? What about auto manufacturers, don't you think that they might now consider opening or expanding plants in Mexico instead of the US? Our prices will go up on many products, but I'm sure my son will be ok with that his $7 biweekly pay increase due to the tax bill will surely cover it https://www.thestreet.com/story/1450...conomists.html

So we are going to save a few thousand steelworker's job at the sake of really screwing up the economy? And there will be retaliation, China is already threatening to cut soybean imports from the US and why in the world would he go after Canada? https://www.ers.usda.gov/topics/crop...l-crops/trade/

He's going to start a trade war, Bush did the same thing in 2002 and we lost 200,000 jobs as a result. And all because of what? Because he was angry about something and that doddering old fool Wilbur Ross told him the world would love him if he imposed these tariffs? https://www.bloomberg.com/view/artic...-george-bush-s

And believe it or not, the US doesn't just import steel, we export it too...don't you think the countries we export to will slap a similar tariff on steel? https://www.trade.gov/steel/countrie...exports-us.pdf

I just wish we had a person in the White House regardless of political party who could actually act like a President rather than a petulant 6 year old
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Old 03-03-2018, 09:37 PM
 
9,272 posts, read 7,295,540 times
Reputation: 22765
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hopelesscause View Post
Americans should be happy to pay more to support American jobs. What’s wrong with you people? Thank you Trump, even though you’re a total jerk.
Can someone provide a real explanation as to how this will produce more jobs? It's not as simple as the foreign steel being more expensive.
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Old 03-03-2018, 09:47 PM
 
Location: la la land
27,190 posts, read 11,359,293 times
Reputation: 19285
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlygal View Post
Can someone provide a real explanation as to how this will produce more jobs? It's not as simple as the foreign steel being more expensive.
No kidding, I'd love for people who claim that to show some evidence that steel tariffs have ever resulted in a net increase in jobs in the US. There are around 140,000 steel workers but there are many, many more people who work in industries that use steel in production, as the price of steel increases those industries will react in some way, either by raising prices, moving production to another country or reducing output.
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Old 03-03-2018, 09:59 PM
 
Location: California
601 posts, read 438,522 times
Reputation: 741
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2sleepy View Post
Our prices will go up on many products, but I'm sure my son will be ok with that his $7 biweekly pay increase due to the tax bill will surely cover it https://www.thestreet.com/story/1450...conomists.html

So we are going to save a few thousand steelworker's job at the sake of really screwing up the economy? And there will be retaliation, China is already threatening to cut soybean imports from the US and why in the world would he go after Canada?
Corporate tax rates were just cut from 35% to 21%. That will cover a lot of the tariff cost if not all of it for most companies. That's major savings.

Should we care about steelworkers jobs? Maybe it's a nice side effect. But not making steel domestically is a potential national security issue. Are we going to import steel from China when at war with them? The reason we need an across the board tariff on all countries is China was getting around steel imports passed by Obama by importing first to other countries and having us buy it second hand.

American steel is likely of higher quality anyway. Pay slightly more for your car and have it last longer. The Chinese government has been stealing company patents for years and then handing the information over to local companies that dump cheap products on our shores for less than they were made for years. A trade "war" or more like a reassessment of our trade policies is essential.
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Old 03-03-2018, 10:08 PM
 
Location: la la land
27,190 posts, read 11,359,293 times
Reputation: 19285
Quote:
Originally Posted by njbiodude View Post
Corporate tax rates were just cut from 35% to 21%. That will cover a lot of the tariff cost if not all of it for most companies. That's major savings.

Should we care about steelworkers jobs? Maybe it's a nice side effect. But not making steel domestically is a potential national security issue. Are we going to import steel from China when at war with them? The reason we need an across the board tariff on all countries is China was getting around steel imports passed by Obama by importing first to other countries and having us buy it second hand.

American steel is likely of higher quality anyway. Pay slightly more for your car and have it last longer. The Chinese government has been stealing company patents for years and then handing the information over to local companies that dump cheap products on our shores for less than they were made for years. A trade "war" or more like a reassessment of our trade policies is essential.
You really need to research the implications of this, trade wars are not good, no matter what Trump thinks. And as far as it being a national security issue, the Department of Defense disagrees https://www.forbes.com/sites/phillev.../#6fe704e14f1c
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Old 03-04-2018, 01:00 AM
 
Location: England
3,243 posts, read 3,020,677 times
Reputation: 3182
Trump has tweeted that he might place stiff tariffs on European cars imported into the US.
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Old 03-04-2018, 01:41 AM
 
1,029 posts, read 559,669 times
Reputation: 300
Quote:
Originally Posted by Supposn View Post
NJ Brazen_3133, annual trade deficits are always net detrimental their nation's GDP. … I'm among the proponents of the trade policy described within Wikipedia's “Import Certificate” article. Similar to tariffs, all net expenses are passed on to the nation's purchasers of imported goods.

Unlike tariffs, it's not a source of net government tax revenue. Its rates are set and monitored by law to do no more than defray all of the government's net administration costs due to the policy. Any net costs beyond governments administrative expenses are due to markets' behaviors and serve as an indirect subsidy of the nation's exported goods at no increased cost to anyone.
Unlike tariffs, government doesn't determine differing rates for differing types of products, or nation's of origin or particular enterprises or industries; government doesn't choose winners or losers. … Import Certificate policy significantly reduces, if not entirely eliminating the adopting nation's annual trade deficit of goods in a manner that increases their GDP and numbers of jobs more than otherwise.
Respectfully, Supposn
Because the Import Certificate policy is applicable to all USA's imported and exported goods, (but it's not applied to the values of scarce or precious mineral materials integral to those goods), the additional cost of imported steel would be of no particular disadvantage to USA manufacturers requiring steel. Both Imported steel and imported products composed of steel are subject to the same rate of increased prices within USA marketplaces. To the extent that due to this policy, market behaviors anywhere in the world increases prices of imported goods within USA domestic markets beyond our federal government's expenditures, those increases serve as indirect but effective price subsidies of USA's exported goods.

Refer to Wikipedia's “Import Certificate” article.
Respectfully, Supposn
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Old 03-04-2018, 02:25 AM
 
Location: Eugene, Oregon
7,098 posts, read 2,213,337 times
Reputation: 9643
Quote:
Originally Posted by C2BP View Post
A trade war is the last thing the US needs after running up its deficit spending. One that causes commodity inflation is even worse, especially since the US doesn't produce enough of these products to make the transition easy for those down the channel. Also, there will be counter tariffs and China is an important market for higher margin products like cars for instance. It is easy to mouth toughness that looks good for America but it's quite another thing to do something that hurts the free market and helps our already advanced economy.

The best way to help the steel and aluminum industry is to help them advance to use more robotics and automation which won't do so much for employment.

When Krushchev threatened the United States, I think he was mistranslated. I think what he actually said was, "You will bury yourselves!".
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Old 03-04-2018, 03:29 AM
 
9,272 posts, read 7,295,540 times
Reputation: 22765
Quote:
Originally Posted by albion View Post
Trump has tweeted that he might place stiff tariffs on European cars imported into the US.
More empty bluster. What percentage of Americans drive European cars? The big foreign carmakers in the U.S. are Japanese and Korean.
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