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Old 03-21-2018, 11:11 AM
 
Location: East of Seattle since 1992, originally from SF Bay Area
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian_M View Post
I hadn't heard this before (on my 4th home now). First home in Wyoming was 1.5 times, second in Denver was about 2 times (both of these were just under $1k/month for mortgage, insurance and taxes). Both in Georgia have been under 1 (roughly .75), and under $500/month in costs. All homes were 3 bed/2 bath and around 2,000sq/ft (2 "starter", 2 custom built).


Would that indicate "high income" class then? I think our highest tax year ever was $92k, we're a bit south of that now though....

Such a hard thing to pigeon hole when there are Such variations across this country.
One might think I am upper class based on home since my house is 3,000 sf and worth about $850,000, but you cannot go by that either. I bought it in 1993, for only $190k. mortgage $1,400 (taxes almost $7,000/year)
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Old 03-21-2018, 11:11 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Catgirl64 View Post
This is what I think of, as well, when I think about it at all.

To put it quite bluntly, "upper class" isn't just money, it's OLD money, family, social connections, schooling, and a whole set of other traits. The Kardashians, for example, are not upper class. They're just rich. It isn't the same thing.
Highest 1-10% of income.

Highest 1-10% of wealth.

Obviously two different things.

Then there are the social and other associations with and within the upper class.

I pick door #2. Door #3 is either unnecessary, or an illusion.

IMO one can be upper class and not live in a mansion nor drive a luxury car. And not attend expensive parties.

But to call one upper class because they associate with or frequent the gatherings of the rich doesn't fit. IMO of course.
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Old 03-21-2018, 11:22 AM
 
Location: East Cobb, GA
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I don’t think a certain income qualifies you as "upper class". I think it depends more on your education, family, career, where you live etc.

If you don’t want to consider money, I think net worth would be more appropriate. There are tons of people who make 100k or 200k who are heavily in debt and living pay check to pay check.
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Old 03-21-2018, 11:40 AM
 
8,272 posts, read 3,452,461 times
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Originally Posted by Soccernerd View Post
I donít think a certain income qualifies you as "upper class". I think it depends more on your education, family, career, where you live etc.

If you donít want to consider money, I think net worth would be more appropriate. There are tons of people who make 100k or 200k who are heavily in debt and living pay check to pay check.
I agree with you, net worth/wealth not income.

But IMO you could be uneducated, have no family, career, and it matters not where you live.

An upper class lifestyle is something else. Optional with the upper class. Imagined, feigned or borrowed into by someone lower.
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Old 03-21-2018, 11:41 AM
 
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Agree that this falls well short of measuring financial stability or security...it should be more about accumulated wealth and the ability to withstand fiscal shocks.... partly because social classes and income seem to be losing some of the formerly well-delineated relationship.

And I think the national awareness of social class has shifted and diminished. Nobody really talks about being from the wrong side of the tracks where one side is the blue collar and the other side the white collar. There isn't such a visibly pronounced physical and geographical separation in most communities...even if some of the historical separations still exist (like wealthier people in many communities live up in the hills (the Heights, etc) and the poor people live on the flats).

If we were to use the traditional metric of class, then we would have to look at education and pedigree and occupation like Soccernerd mentioned. And that's not superhelpful in understanding EARNED income distributions anymore.

In that regard, America is more egalitarian than ever before.
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Old 03-21-2018, 11:46 AM
 
Location: Aurora Denveralis
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kinkytoes View Post
Anyway this is america, we have no upper class.
Was that meant to be humor? Nowhere else on earth does a highly classist nation so continually chorus that we are a classless society. Didn't know anyone still believed it...
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Old 03-21-2018, 11:56 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aslowdodge View Post
I always wonder what it feels like to be upper class. I well surpassed the number, but feel like I'm lower middle class.
I'm quite comfortable and live in a pretty nice house, but drive vehicles that have 135k and 198k miles on them and bought used at 121k and 89k miles.
Still if I look around I always feel like I don't quite match up to,people surrounding me.
I guess it's a mental thing.
You shouldn't fall prey to that kind of thinking though. First its probably false when based on something as superficial as the vintage of your cars. Most people can't afford to BUY the cars that they drive..so its a false symbol of wealth in that the display of wealth is not an accurate indicator of actual wealth.

Secondly, the urge to compare yourself to others can lead to envy or jealously which are both unproductive and destructive emotions. We would all do well to try to keep these out of our repertoire. Not saying you are either of these things, but only that indulging or succumbing to these won't ever help you or anyone else.

I think its much more useful to look at what your work has yielded for you - how much you have saved, or how secure your source of income is, or how well-diversified your assets are, or your wealth-to-debt ratio, because those things measure your ability to withstand economic downturns.

If you own your house and your vehicles outright, even if they are worth less than the bigger houses and newer cars you might see, then you are in better shape than someone that does have either of those but is heavily mortgaged and doesn't own the car and is making big monthly lease payments on it. Because their wealth is illusory and yours is real. So of the two , you'd be in a higher/better position.
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Old 03-21-2018, 12:03 PM
 
5,016 posts, read 1,525,865 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quietude View Post
Was that meant to be humor? Nowhere else on earth does a highly classist nation so continually chorus that we are a classless society. Didn't know anyone still believed it...
We are a less classist society than even just 30 years and far less classist than 50 or 100 years ago.

This despite all the SJW noise about "income inequality" which lets be honest...is almost entirely an artifact of three negative and destructive forces that have emerged since the mid-century (20th):

- the liberal policies of the welfare state
- mass immigration
- fiat money gone wild

I could also add in the fact that overpopulation drives down wages, as does the presence of more workers in the workforce (women's "liberation" meant employers could get two workers for far less than twice the cost of the one they previously had), but these are second order effects of the other things.
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Old 03-21-2018, 12:38 PM
 
8,021 posts, read 6,220,904 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phantompilot View Post
We are a less classist society than even just 30 years and far less classist than 50 or 100 years ago.

This despite all the SJW noise about "income inequality" which lets be honest...is almost entirely an artifact of three negative and destructive forces that have emerged since the mid-century (20th):

- the liberal policies of the welfare state
- mass immigration
- fiat money gone wild

I could also add in the fact that overpopulation drives down wages, as does the presence of more workers in the workforce (women's "liberation" meant employers could get two workers for far less than twice the cost of the one they previously had), but these are second order effects of the other things.
Apparently you haven't read the terms of service. You should keep the political nonsense out of this discussion.
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Old 03-21-2018, 12:47 PM
 
312 posts, read 201,364 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aslowdodge View Post
I always wonder what it feels like to be upper class. I well surpassed the number, but feel like I'm lower middle class.
I'm quite comfortable and live in a pretty nice house, but drive vehicles that have 135k and 198k miles on them and bought used at 121k and 89k miles.
Still if I look around I always feel like I don't quite match up to,people surrounding me.
I guess it's a mental thing.
I think the disconnect is the scope you're looking through. You're looking at the people surrounding you, which isn't very indicative. On top of that, there could be numerous reasons for the disparity. People around you might be in debt to their eyeballs or inherited some wealth. The only things these numbers show is the rarity in the income amounts as you go upward.
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