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Old 04-08-2018, 03:21 PM
 
7,050 posts, read 3,701,331 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Huckleberry3911948 View Post
America is very fearful of standing up to its adversaries
Like a frightened child that
Robbed of his lunch money daily -fears for reprisals if he resists
This is not wisdom -this is not global economy -nor free trade
but American cowardice
This describes it exactly. The pansies here always telling us how we can't do anything and looking at disputes solely in terms of how it hurts us and apparently believing we will lose in any war with any opponent or any issue are the ones that have put us in these kinds of situations. The degree to which a trade war would hurt us is a direct result of allowing imbalances for so long in the past.
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Old 04-08-2018, 03:23 PM
 
17,624 posts, read 12,203,533 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oceangaia View Post
Are you aware that treasury bonds are serial numbered and specific ones (held by China) can be voided while not voiding other ones (held by Americans)? Defaulting on external debt does not necessarily mean defaulting on domestic debt.
Actually since all bond issues now are book entry only they don’t all have serial numbers. Can you please point me to the outline you’ve seen where the US voids a portion of an issue but not all of it or are you speaking in hypotheticals? Defaulting will cause systematic issue, so you think Japan wouldn’t second guess what would happen to the paper they hold if we got mad at them? What about US conpanies that our government took issue with? It most certainly would create systematic issue even if your hypothetical process that doesn’t exist came true

Last edited by Lowexpectations; 04-08-2018 at 03:35 PM..
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Old 04-08-2018, 03:51 PM
 
7,050 posts, read 3,701,331 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lowexpectations View Post
Actually since all bond issues now are book entry only they don’t all have serial numbers. Can you please point me to the outline you’ve seen where the US voids a portion of an issue but not all of it or are you speaking in hypotheticals? Defaulting will cause systematic issue, so you think Japan wouldn’t second guess what would happen to the paper they hold if we got mad at them? What about US conpanies that our government took issue with? It most certainly would create systematic issue even if your hypothetical process that doesn’t exist came true
Of course I'm speaking hypothetically. Duh! The U.S. isn't likely to default on any debt. I'm just saying it is a "nuclear" option.

And no, taking drastic action on one party for sufficient cause (not merely "getting mad") won't make all other parties feel like they are a similar target because they aren't doing similar things. We attacked Afghanistan in response to them being the base for the group that attacked us on 9/11. Did that make Canada fear we would attack them? No, because Canada wasn't harboring such groups. So don't "dump" our debt with the intent of crashing our economy and you won't have your debt voided.
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Old 04-08-2018, 04:33 PM
 
17,624 posts, read 12,203,533 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oceangaia View Post
Of course I'm speaking hypothetically. Duh! The U.S. isn't likely to default on any debt. I'm just saying it is a "nuclear" option.
You are saying it’s an option like issuing a stop payment on a check when the two are nothing remotely similar

Quote:
And no, taking drastic action on one party for sufficient cause (not merely "getting mad") won't make all other parties feel like they are a similar target because they aren't doing similar things.
Again spoke as though that’s 100% the case when there is zero reason to believe it’s true. Any default will cause an issue and doing it selectively to one party should give concern to others holding the debt. Japan holds around a trillion of the debt too and once you start selective defaults it’s a slippery slope.

Quote:
We attacked Afghanistan in response to them being the base for the group that attacked us on 9/11. Did that make Canada fear we would attack them? No, because Canada wasn't harboring such groups. So don't "dump" our debt with the intent of crashing our economy and you won't have your debt voided.
And if we don’t get the right NAFTA deal done does a selective Canadian default come into picture. You are kidding yourself if you think a selective default or any default for that matter won’t cause some systematic issues
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Old 04-08-2018, 06:02 PM
 
4,036 posts, read 1,835,475 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oceangaia View Post
This describes it exactly. The pansies here always telling us how we can't do anything and looking at disputes solely in terms of how it hurts us and apparently believing we will lose in any war with any opponent or any issue are the ones that have put us in these kinds of situations. The degree to which a trade war would hurt us is a direct result of allowing imbalances for so long in the past.
I call it the "Vietnam syndrome"..........since WW2 americans have lost the will to sacrifice enough to come out a winner..........even in domestic problems.........
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Old 04-08-2018, 06:51 PM
 
Location: Southwest
1,533 posts, read 942,403 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silverkris View Post
Actually, that is a big issue with China - about hot money coming into their economy - which could overheat their real estate and other equities markets beyond what it already is...
Isn't their RE market already overheated? Ever see pictures of those ghost cities they built?


Quote:
Originally Posted by oceangaia View Post
And if China really crosses the line, we void the debt they hold.
I guess the chance of this happening is slim, but I've wondered for some time what would happen if we did void the debt the hold.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Enigma777 View Post
Not being facetious, but I am just curious if any of those putting forth responses of 'what will happen' also predicted the credit default swap disaster, business and bank failures and the crash of 2007?
There was one guy on Wall Street that did predict '07 and made a ton of money. I forget his name.
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Old 04-09-2018, 09:41 PM
 
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Meanwhile, China blinks because they understand what they have to lose in a trade war better than many self-hating Americans.

China's President Xi Jinping on Tuesday promised to cut China's auto import tariffs and ease restrictions on foreign ownership in its auto industry amid an escalating tariff spat with Washington.
“We will take the initiative to expand imports,” Xi said during his keynote speech at the opening of the Boao Forum for Asia, China Plus News reported. "China does not seek trade surplus; we have a genuine desire to increase imports and achieve greater balance of international payments under the current account," he said.
China's Xi promises to cut auto import tariff, warns against
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Old 04-09-2018, 11:52 PM
 
2,138 posts, read 1,150,540 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oceangaia View Post
Meanwhile, China blinks because they understand what they have to lose in a trade war better than many self-hating Americans.

China's President Xi Jinping on Tuesday promised to cut China's auto import tariffs and ease restrictions on foreign ownership in its auto industry amid an escalating tariff spat with Washington.
“We will take the initiative to expand imports,” Xi said during his keynote speech at the opening of the Boao Forum for Asia, China Plus News reported. "China does not seek trade surplus; we have a genuine desire to increase imports and achieve greater balance of international payments under the current account," he said.
China's Xi promises to cut auto import tariff, warns against
No blink, they've been promising this for years now. Over and over. This is posturing, no different than NK meeting in China and SK without the United States. They are handling their own business and it is a show that our influence is waning in Asia.

They get to appear like they are taking steps while doing mostly nothing. This will do nothing to address what Trump is screaming about. Not that Trump is going to do anything about it either but it is a convenient political point stupid people can look at the headline and pretend they understand.
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Old 04-10-2018, 05:41 AM
 
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Nice spin. Another typical example of viewing any and every action as American failure. We threaten tariffs if they don't ease up on their import restrictions, they cave in and ease up on their import restrictions, and you tell us it shows our influence is waning. Amazing.
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Old 04-10-2018, 08:24 AM
 
8,021 posts, read 6,222,835 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oceangaia View Post
Nice spin. Another typical example of viewing any and every action as American failure. We threaten tariffs if they don't ease up on their import restrictions, they cave in and ease up on their import restrictions, and you tell us it shows our influence is waning. Amazing.
Right, that's why China has filed a grievance with the WTO over the tariffs.

http://https://www.usatoday.com/stor...ffs/501926002/

Promises mean nothing. Action is what matters.
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