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Thanks for posting this. Wow, this coming from government employee! Your honestly is much appreciated. Some public lazy bums here are posting stuff out of their behind and apparently don't care if people can google the facts.
You're welcome.
At the same time, you're not doing your cause any favors with the "public lazy bum" name calling.
Maybe if you learned how to do actual research, instead of just Googling stuff and grabbing whatever suits your agenda, you'd know the real facts. The vast majority of public employees not only work hard, but retire with nothing NEAR what you all are citing. You really think the average teacher, librarian, etc, is getting half a million at retirement? I'd be happy to show you my CalPERS statement if you believe that, and then you'll see the actual reality. My account currently has like $35K, with around $2200 as projected monthly benefits. This is more common than these extreme examples everyone cherry-picks. It's like saying everyone who works for Facebook earns the CEO's salary, ffs.
And I don't care what that other poster said, because even they admitted those facts are 30+ years old. Most of us haven't been in the system that long, and we are NOT overpaid or compensated. I'm even from the same region as them (literally a few miles away), and see a much different picture. Yes, the county pays more into those accounts than the employee, but we still aren't retiring rich. What do you do for the city, MysticalTyger? Because I want your job, if you really think we're overpaid and under-worked!
I'm just a clerk for the SJ Public Library.
By the way $2200 a month in benefits after 7 years of service is still quite generous. That's about $26,400 a year. You'd need the equivalent of about $660,000 in a 401k to sustain that level of income (plus annual inflation increases) for 30 years of retirement.
The account crediting balance of 35K is most likely what you'd be able to take with you if you decided you didn't want to be part of the pension system (that would mean you'd take the 35K cash and forfeit any benefits at retirement age--Practically no one who leaves their employer but who is vested does this).
I don't think we're overpaid...but we most definitely are over-benefited. That's probably true even with San Jose's less generous pension plan for new hires. I mean, what would it take to convince you? San Jose is paying more in employee pension costs than it's paying in salaries! At what point do we admit it? 200% on top of salaries? 300%? 500%?
A little off topic, since we're talking specifically about retirement benefits - but coincidentally, my mother just emailed a link to my "Transparent California" page, and I almost choked when I saw the listed salary! It says I earned over $95K in 2016, because they add all benefits/retirement/etc into the calculation, when in reality I earned $67K that year. So when people also gripe about us earning too much, I hope they're looking beyond the presented numbers. Regional costs matter too, as $67K in the Bay Area is like $35-40K almost everywhere else... I do earn quite a bit more now, but still just barely cracking the local median.
The 95K is what it costs your employer to keep you. It IS the relevant number. Yeah, I know. You didn't want to hear that. The truth sometimes sucks.
All those that got conned by the republicans to go into the private sector for a high pay without safety net in retirement are now seeing how a stupid mistake that was. Now its too late, and they are suffering for a acute case of "pension envy". Guess what, they told you that your 401k will allow you to retire in luxury? didnt they?, just give your money to the wall street casino players and you will be ok..... i got a message for you....you have been conned! the same way Trump conned you last election. when will you learn?
Public pensions invest in the same "casino" (stocks and bonds) as people do with their 401k money. Stock market returns have been below the long term historical average for the last 20 years, which is part of the reason why a lot of pensions are underfunded.
Newsflash: People, whether they be politicians & unions over-promising pension benefits or the general citizenry under-funding their 401ks with skimpy 6% savings rates, suck at creating sustainable safety nets for themselves because the majority are greedy and short sighted.
In the public sector, the contracts are negotiated between the union reps, and the reps of politicos whom the union probably helped elect. They have common interests, which is how they end up with the cozy contracts that they write. It's effectively a kickback scheme, which would be unethical and perhaps illegal in other contexts.
....which is why even Progressives like FDR said government workers shouldn't be engaged in collective bargaining. He knew what would eventually happen.
You do realize there are fifty state pensions? My state pension does factor in overtime. You get the average of your three highest paying years.
Get over yourself and realize the feds aren't the only ones with government pensions, will you?
....And as I've also said, the federal pensions are actually pretty reasonable. Good, but not crazy generous. Many state & local pensions are overly generous and not sustainable.
Public pensions invest in the same "casino" (stocks and bonds) as people do with their 401k money. Stock market returns have been below the long term historical average for the last 20 years, which is part of the reason why a lot of pensions are underfunded.
Newsflash: People, whether they be politicians & unions over-promising pension benefits or the general citizenry under-funding their 401ks with skimpy 6% savings rates, suck at creating sustainable safety nets for themselves because the majority are greedy and short sighted.
The difference is in many areas, if the pension doesn’t generate a certain return the taxpayer is on the hook to make it up. In years where the market return exceeds 7% or so no “top up” is needed, but if it’s lower, tax dollars are used to make up the difference.
Just playing devil's advocate here, but where I live, it went the other way. Our mayor and council gave police and firefighters a 5% raise right after 9/11 without them even asking for it (but not other employees).
This was an irresponsible move for so many reasons, not least of which was the fact it was evident that we were on the verge of a recession and other City departments really took a major hit when the budget cuts started coming a month or two later.
Interesting. That may have happened in NYC, as well, but I don't know.
I do remember that the recruits were lining up for the academy afterward to replace the 23 NYPD and 37 PAPD who were lost, as well as the 343 FDNY.
The difference is in many areas, if the pension doesn’t generate a certain return the taxpayer is on the hook to make it up. In years where the market return exceeds 7% or so no “top up” is needed, but if it’s lower, tax dollars are used to make up the difference.
There is no such benefit with a 401k.
No disagreements from me.
I will say, however, that when people don't save enough for retirement, they want the government to bail them out with subsidized senior housing, food stamps, etc. And politicians inevitably give in. So taxpayers still end up on the hook to some degree.
My personal preference would be for a system like Australia has. It's basically a universal, but private 401k type system. Employee & employer each contribute about 9% each to the account, but they are invested in real assets (stocks/bonds) and the person has ownership of their account, unlike with Social Security.
We could have these universal 401ks have Vanguard style target date funds. It wouldn't be that hard to set it up.
America hates building society up as a group. They would much rather bring people down. It is always about keeping people down when the people at the very top think you have too much.
Last edited by toosie; 05-27-2018 at 04:55 AM..
Reason: TOS copyright
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