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Old 09-30-2018, 12:32 PM
 
1,040 posts, read 414,845 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SportyandMisty View Post
This type of extortion is a major factor driving up the price of housing.

This type of extortion should be illegal. If the city wants improvements in its infrastructure, it should not hold developers hostage.
Developers are more than welcome to take their projects elsewhere.
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Old 09-30-2018, 01:24 PM
 
25,817 posts, read 49,712,454 times
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And many do...

A local regional developer was trying to do a project in Oakland... an old run down industrial property that had been vacant over a decade...

The developer has a 30 year track record of quality projects up and down the West Coast and is Bay Area based...

Really quality and mixed use projects providing housing and rejuvenating retail... many awards from cities small and large...

The Oakland project never happened... the property was sold to a redevelopment group an still sits after hundreds of thousands in studies...

The first thing the city council woman said was what is in it for me and my district? She said she needed a guarantee of 50 union jobs for her constituents and each city department added layers... even a police substation and fire house was brought up.

5 generations of my family call Oakland home... just saying.

... and so it goes.
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Old 09-30-2018, 01:42 PM
 
1,040 posts, read 414,845 times
Reputation: 930
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultrarunner View Post
And many do...

A local regional developer was trying to do a project in Oakland... an old run down industrial property that had been vacant over a decade...

The developer has a 30 year track record of quality projects up and down the West Coast and is Bay Area based...

Really quality and mixed use projects providing housing and rejuvenating retail... many awards from cities small and large...

The Oakland project never happened... the property was sold to a redevelopment group an still sits after hundreds of thousands in studies...

The first thing the city council woman said was what is in it for me and my district? She said she needed a guarantee of 50 union jobs for her constituents and each city department added layers... even a police substation and fire house was brought up.

5 generations of my family call Oakland home... just saying.

... and so it goes.
There's a flip side to it as well.

Many people actually don't just want growth for the sake of growth, but instead they want high quality growth at a sustainable pace

People never object if developers are bringing in stuff that will boost property values and make the community more attractive to well-off residents, like Whole Foods, Costco or corporate HQs.

But instead, if all developers want to bring in is cheap tract housing, warehouses that only create low-wage jobs and fast food restaurants (all of which depresses property values despite putting more strain on the infrastructure), it's understandable why residents would want to chase them away.
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Old 09-30-2018, 05:30 PM
 
25,817 posts, read 49,712,454 times
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This is exactly how it works... residents chase them away and then wonder why they are left behind???
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Old 09-30-2018, 05:36 PM
 
1,040 posts, read 414,845 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultrarunner View Post
This is exactly how it works... residents chase them away and then wonder why they are left behind???
Some folks are ok with slow growth if it means ensuring high quality growth. There's nothing wrong with that IMO.
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Old 09-30-2018, 05:47 PM
 
25,817 posts, read 49,712,454 times
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This project was reusing an old industrial site that have been vacant for more than 10 years and building mixed use.

The mayor declared it a blight and OPD said it was a haven for criminal elements...

But... to move forward it was not politically correct enough.

Currently the city and county of SF have projects at the approval stage with permits ready to issue... some have taken my years and cost tens of thousands of dollars and builders are walking away... no enough certainty with interest rates on the upswing... huge increases in labor and materials when no one has a Crystal Ball as to what the economic climate will be in 18 to 24 months as these projects would be coming to fruition...

Actions have consequences... plus... the tax roll suffers and city services stained when an entire city block stays vacant for a decade or more... no winners here.
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Old 09-30-2018, 05:51 PM
 
10,702 posts, read 20,119,835 times
Reputation: 9859
Quote:
Originally Posted by SportyandMisty View Post
This type of extortion is a major factor driving up the price of housing.

This type of extortion should be illegal. If the city wants improvements in its infrastructure, it should not hold developers hostage.
There's really no good solution. The city and its current residents shouldn't have to take on bonds to develop infrastructure in that specific area to support residents that haven't moved yet, nor should the developer have rights to 100% of the profits while leaving the city holding the bag.

Ie the whole, "privatize profits but socialize losses" kinda thing...
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Old 09-30-2018, 05:59 PM
 
1,040 posts, read 414,845 times
Reputation: 930
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultrarunner View Post
This project was reusing an old industrial site that have been vacant for more than 10 years and building mixed use.

The mayor declared it a blight and OPD said it was a haven for criminal elements...

But... to move forward it was not politically correct enough.

Currently the city and county of SF have projects at the approval stage with permits ready to issue... some have taken my years and cost tens of thousands of dollars and builders are walking away... no enough certainty with interest rates on the upswing... huge increases in labor and materials when no one has a Crystal Ball as to what the economic climate will be in 18 to 24 months as these projects would be coming to fruition...

Actions have consequences... plus... the tax roll suffers and city services stained when an entire city block stays vacant for a decade or more... no winners here.
I don't know the specifics of the situation you're speaking on, so I will withhold my opinion

I merely stating that there are legitimate reasons for people to be strongly NIMBY and hostile to certain developers.
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Old 09-30-2018, 09:52 PM
 
340 posts, read 163,263 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wheelsup View Post
There's really no good solution. The city and its current residents shouldn't have to take on bonds to develop infrastructure in that specific area to support residents that haven't moved yet, nor should the developer have rights to 100% of the profits while leaving the city holding the bag.

Ie the whole, "privatize profits but socialize losses" kinda thing...
This is a hot topic in Jersey City, NJ. Jersey City has been growing substantially in the past 10 or so years and many residents rely on the PATH train to get to jobs in NYC. However, the PATH is now way over-capacity in part due to the new residential development (there was a recent thread in the N.J. forum). The main selling point for the new residential development is the PATH train but the train line is bursting at the seams because of the new residents yet developers keep on building. I donít believe the city is requiring developers to contribute to the infrastructure but the situation is becoming unsustainable.

As for my own house search, even my realtor has told me to sit tight for a little while as patience will likely pay off given the current indicators. I was surprised to hear that from a realtor but I truly appreciate his honesty.
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Old 10-01-2018, 07:42 AM
 
25,817 posts, read 49,712,454 times
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This makes many assumptions...

Just because someone moves into a new development doesn't mean they need or will use public transit...

Plenty of work from home models and those that work odd hours or those no longer in the workforce.

As to paying... Mello-Roos is alive and well... with monies collected for streets, drainage, parks, fire and schools...
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