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Old 08-24-2018, 01:44 PM
 
57 posts, read 27,405 times
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We can blame the victims and be done with it (and there certainly are people - in America who starve, sleep on ground, etc.) or expect people to deal when things go terribly wrong and provide the tools and community to overcome their hardship.

The Gates Foundation has started an initiative to examine poverty and solutions.
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Old 08-24-2018, 02:13 PM
 
394 posts, read 244,865 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gwynedd1 View Post
That sounds a lot like one of the silly, leftist accusations . The link between crime and poverty is often the observation that crime is bad for business , not that the poor are inherently criminal.
I agree, I think the rich steal on a grander scale.
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Old 08-24-2018, 02:42 PM
 
Location: The Triad (NC)
26,846 posts, read 57,851,863 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gwynedd1 View Post
The link between crime and poverty is often the observation that crime is bad for business,
not that the poor are inherently criminal.
Quote:
Originally Posted by raggedjim View Post
I agree, I think the rich steal on a grander scale.
On business losses and who steals most/best (zip to the 40second mark):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uBohPAycB0w
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Old 08-24-2018, 03:13 PM
 
Location: Honolulu, HI
4,567 posts, read 1,141,729 times
Reputation: 6529
Quote:
Originally Posted by eselpee View Post
We can blame the victims and be done with it (and there certainly are people - in America who starve, sleep on ground, etc.) or expect people to deal when things go terribly wrong and provide the tools and community to overcome their hardship.

The Gates Foundation has started an initiative to examine poverty and solutions.
Poverty can't be solved. Poverty has always existed. There will always be poor people in America.

The difference is that atleast in America you have opportunities and choices whereas in other countries such opportunities do not exist.

Even a poor person in America can't deny how good they have it in the world.
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Old 08-24-2018, 03:38 PM
 
Location: DFW - Coppell / Las Colinas
29,921 posts, read 34,526,470 times
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You'll never cure poverty when you import it by the millions of illiterates that come here yearly. We keep spreading the available aid, housing thinner.

We restock the welfare shelves faster than we can get them out of the store.
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Old 08-24-2018, 08:18 PM
 
Location: ATX/Houston
1,817 posts, read 468,588 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SportyandMisty View Post
Poverty has declined significantly over the past 50 years. Those who disagree ignore data because they don't like what it shows.

Some argue that the official poverty measure from the US Government indicates little improvement since the early 1970s. But this measure is misleading.

First, over the past 40 years America’s safety net has shifted substantially towards in-kind programs such as SNAP (food stamps) and housing benefits, and towards tax expenditures such as the Earned Income Credit while shifting away from traditional cash-transfer programs (live checks). It turns out the US "Official Poverty Measure" doesn't count in-kind assistance or tax expenditure programs.

Second, the official poverty measure relies on incomplete survey data. Americans are less willing today to take the time to respond accurately to government interviewers. For example, the official poverty survey registered only half of the cash welfare the government actually paid out.

Third, the official measure accounts for inflation using the Consumer Price Index for all Urban Consumers, or CPI-U, a benchmark that does not accurately reflect the influence of new consumer products, changes in the quality of goods, or the shift to low-cost stores. While such errors in accounting for inflation have only a small effect on changes from one year to the next, they accumulate over decades and substantially alter long-term trends.

If, instead of focusing on reported incomes, you evaluate poverty based on actual consumption, you get a much better picture. So look at what food, housing, transportation and other goods and services people actually purchase and consume. The data clearly shows that there is much, much less material deprivation than there was decades ago.

For example, according to the American Housing Survey, the poorest 20% of Americans live as the middle class did a generation ago as measured by the square footage of their homes, the number of rooms per person, and the presence of air conditioning, dishwashers and other amenities.

It still sux to be dirt-poor compared to being wealthy, but life is unquestionably getting better for the bottom quintile.

I think we have done well with poverty, where we have lagged solely behind is providing relevant training and education over the last 30 years.
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Old 08-24-2018, 08:20 PM
 
Location: ATX/Houston
1,817 posts, read 468,588 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rakin View Post
You'll never cure poverty when you import it by the millions of illiterates that come here yearly. We keep spreading the available aid, housing thinner.

We restock the welfare shelves faster than we can get them out of the store.

Nonsense. It didn't ruin us the other times it happened, it's a matter of investing in ourselves instead of deciding who is worthy of it. Our aging population and it's effects on public spending is far more pressing.
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Old 08-24-2018, 10:54 PM
 
Location: Honolulu, HI
4,567 posts, read 1,141,729 times
Reputation: 6529
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rakin View Post
You'll never cure poverty when you import it by the millions of illiterates that come here yearly. We keep spreading the available aid, housing thinner.

We restock the welfare shelves faster than we can get them out of the store.
Very good point. Being from San Antonio Texas, I've seen the statistics firsthand that illustrate how non native English speakers struggle in western education. The dropout rate among Hispanics (many of which are first and 2nd generation illegal and legal immigrants) is even higher than blacks. Plus you also have high birthrate and out of wedlock children.

Bureaucrats are pretty funny, on one hand they want more power to "fix poverty" and on the other hand they import poverty by the millions who won't even get a GED, let a lone a college degree.
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Old 08-25-2018, 08:29 AM
 
3,720 posts, read 1,667,677 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eselpee View Post
We can blame the victims and be done with it (and there certainly are people - in America who starve, sleep on ground, etc.) or expect people to deal when things go terribly wrong and provide the tools and community to overcome their hardship.

The Gates Foundation has started an initiative to examine poverty and solutions.
It isn't necessary to blame the and it isn't necessary to encourage them. They can find their own way out of their hardship. No one can live their lives for them. They have to do it themselves.
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Old 08-25-2018, 08:36 AM
 
8,504 posts, read 2,389,571 times
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By any measure, the social programs AND the war on (great) poverty have been successful.

The biggest shortfall on the 2nd is the lack of free (better) education and retraining...and, probably, reparations (for the white lower classes in WV and KY whose birthrights were stolen by the timber, coal and other barons).....

But, in general, these programs have been very successful. Plenty of faults can be found for any human endeavor, but our sick, elderly and others are - in general - much better off than before the "war" (before 1960 or so)....

It is true that we have stabilized - largely because the GOP has fought tooth and nail against giving a "hand up" to the lower classes. But still.....measured by most any statistic, FDR and LBJ (and T. Roosevelt) are the biggest heroes of the 20th century.
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