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Old 10-15-2018, 11:41 AM
 
6,503 posts, read 3,435,815 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buckeye77 View Post
Nope - started with the 16th Amendment. EVERYTHING that is wrong with America today can be attributed to the ability of the federal gov (and the politicians) to line their own pockets with our money. What would DC look like today without all of our money?
Pay attention, all you sov. citizens claiming there is no right for the government to collect an income tax...
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Old 10-15-2018, 11:46 AM
 
Location: SoCal
14,530 posts, read 20,124,163 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buckeye77 View Post
Nope - started with the 16th Amendment. EVERYTHING that is wrong with America today can be attributed to the ability of the federal gov (and the politicians) to line their own pockets with our money. What would DC look like today without all of our money?
There is another issue I wish we could address. I think Congress should have term limits, perhaps 12 years maximum.
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Old 10-15-2018, 12:05 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lovehound View Post
There is another issue I wish we could address. I think Congress should have term limits, perhaps 12 years maximum.
Well, if it's not the incumbents holding that same seat next term, someone else will. I don't think term limits have much to do with budgeting unless you're looking at doing so to cap the maximum eligible retirement benefit that a member of congress could accrue. Which, contrary to popular belief, is NOT full salary after one term.

https://www.investopedia.com/article...ll-average.asp

I hear a lot of "states' rights" sentiment in this thread for those against a federal income tax, but many states are getting federal assistance, in one form or another, funded by the individual taxpayer. States would probably not benefit from the absence of a federal tax unless they expected to raise their own taxes immediately after it was repealed.

In addition to several types of benefits currently funded by the Fed having to find alternative funding or collapsing, not all states have the population or citizens' taxable income to pay for current obligations using solely what's able to be recouped within their borders.

No FEMA, no SS, no federal assistance for unemployment benefits. NC decided against help when it came with strings attached. Cut a standard 26 week / $500 maximum benefit down to $350 a week for 13 weeks.

Taxes achieve what directly and democratically voting on issues would never pass via that process. It's paying for the things that not everyone wants to pay for voluntarily. I'll admit that.

Without the above programs, you'd have seniors moving back in with their kids (again, you can't escape those filial responsibility laws), states slacking on rebuilding after natural disasters even worse than they already do WITH FEMA assistance, and the next economic downturn resulting in much more crime than the last.

Taxes fund things that shut people up, and a lot of times - not every time - stop mobs from forming when the citizens feel an injustice has been committed. The Wild West is over. For those of you with something to prove, go buy your 100 acres outside city limits and build your own compound. Plenty of people in my neck of the woods who do exactly that as a big F-U to living under city ordinances and codes.
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Old 10-15-2018, 12:16 PM
 
Location: SoCal
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The biggest tax thing I fear is VAT!

IMO that would totally screw us.
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Old 10-15-2018, 12:31 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lovehound View Post
The biggest tax thing I fear is VAT!

IMO that would totally screw us.
20% like UK no thanks!

I wonder if value-removed transactions are exempt - such as recycling and salvage.

It would be a crappy way to eke out a living, but hey, anything to avoid paying out the nose every time you turn around.
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Old 10-15-2018, 01:05 PM
 
Location: SoCal
14,530 posts, read 20,124,163 times
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Well so far the federal government is forbade from enacting a national sales tax, or that's what I've been told, so at least for now VAT appears unlikely. I'm sure there would be great furor over any proposed VAT for US.
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Old 10-15-2018, 04:20 PM
 
Location: SoCal
14,530 posts, read 20,124,163 times
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I'm giving the current administration until the 2020 election to take steps to balance the budget. Even better if they can start reducing the debt.

It does not help things that the two major political parties do not play well together. They are treating their political rivalry like a zero sum game. Our elected officials should work together to help America. It seems to me that many in Congress are more interested in furthering their financial gain than in doing their jobs.

One pundit quipped he slept well only when Congress wasn't in session.
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Old 10-15-2018, 06:42 PM
 
Location: Prepperland
19,025 posts, read 14,205,095 times
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If government was reduced to "securing endowed rights" and nothing more, the government would not need a monstrous budget. But as long as millions "consent to be governed," there's little hope of that. Oh, right, you didn't learn that in government approved educational camps.
Nothing to see here. Move along. Don't read that Declaration and ask preposterous questions.
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Old 10-15-2018, 06:49 PM
 
Location: Raleigh, NC
1,070 posts, read 392,817 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lovehound View Post
There is another issue I wish we could address. I think Congress should have term limits, perhaps 12 years maximum.
I’m 100% w/you on this Hound! I’d also add age limits. I suggest 75 - good bye Grassley, Hatch, McConnell, Pelosi, Bernie....
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Old 10-15-2018, 06:59 PM
 
Location: Prepperland
19,025 posts, read 14,205,095 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ddm2k View Post
Pay attention, all you sov. citizens claiming there is no right for the government to collect an income tax...
A. Though Americans are sovereigns without subjects, a citizen is a subject. Ergo, there is no such thing as a sovereign citizen.
B. No endowed right is subject to taxation by a government instituted to secure endowed rights. Only government privileges are subject to taxation. Politely ask your public servants to explain how rights transformed into revenue taxable privileges.
C. There is no "income tax." The law imposes a privilege tax that uses the income derived as the means of calculating the tax due.
D. Go read the law for yourself. Oh, right, even Congress doesn't bother to read laws it enacts.
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