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Old 11-27-2018, 09:28 AM
 
8,374 posts, read 3,546,650 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
maybe is my answer ....

just because my landlord raises my rent does not make that "inflation " the market conditions allowed it and what i have is an increase in my expenses with the same income . why should my income be adjusted upward hypothetically on paper to match ? it really shouldn't .

somethings are just plain ole rises in expenses , plain and simple . my income should not be inflated on a graph just because of that demand driving up my expense . there is no reason my income should be inflated to match . i need to earn more income to keep up on an un-inflated bases .

that is very different then the money supply growing and equaling things out by adjusting incomes accordingly . so it can be tough trying to really figure out wages on an inflation adjusted basis if not near impossible since it treats monetary inflation and just increases from shortages ,strikes ,weather and everything else all the same.

all those other reasons can just as easily be considered just expenses going up against the same income in reality and i need to earn more income to keep up not an adjustment that pretends to equal things out because nothing was done to dilute that income on the same scale so automatically boosting wages is not representative of what transpired ..

think about it , if you got a raise and the money supply was not fiddled with , you got more money in today's dollars .... the fact certain expenses may have risen is a separate issue . that does not mean you did not have wage growth , because you did

As a medical intern in 1976/7 I made something like $13K my first year as a doc. My daughter made $52K her first year. And with general inflation considered, the numbers are identical! But I live in a low COL area, she a high one. I had a family, home and all that to attend to. She's still single. So a whole different ballgame for her today.


Of course every individual and family is different. With different jobs, expectations and local COL realities. And then all that viewed over time.

So to look at the broad national picture, many compromises have to be made if one is to find some average.

And that average has to take into account all the individual life's and family's differences, regional differences as well as built in monetary inflation.

You know what you made in year one and then say year 10. And then you need to compare with some inflation adjusted data. I've looked at the MIT billion price data, and it seems to make sense to me. Online pricing is much less local or regional of course, so it inherently gives broader data on the pricing of so many things we buy.

Our Public Data – The Billion Prices Project
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Old 11-27-2018, 09:35 AM
 
1,106 posts, read 587,819 times
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MathJak, regardless if the U.S. dollars reduced purchasing power’s due to increased money supply, or to other causes, the consequential inflation justifies increasing wages.

That’s not a remedy for inflation, but it’s the national need. You can complain about what our government did, or should have done, or should do to reduce inflation. Until inflation rate is reduced, and to the extent that inflation continues to exist or increase, increased wage rates kept in tandem to inflation are justified.

Ignoring inflation or not providing employees with some forms of remedy or relief, (such as pegging the federal minimum wage rate to the Cost-price index number), have been to some extent, and will continue in the future to be net detrimental to USA's economy.
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Old 11-27-2018, 09:36 AM
 
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we will have to agree to disagree on this ...
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Old 11-27-2018, 09:49 AM
 
8,374 posts, read 3,546,650 times
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Originally Posted by Supposn View Post
MathJak, regardless if the U.S. dollars reduced purchasing power’s due to increased money supply, or to other causes, the consequential inflation justifies increasing wages.

That’s not a remedy for inflation, but it’s the national need. You can complain about what our government did, or should have done, or should do to reduce inflation. Until inflation rate is reduced, and to the extent that inflation continues to exist or increase, increased wage rates kept in tandem to inflation are justified.

Ignoring inflation or not providing employees with some forms of remedy or relief, (such as pegging the federal minimum wage rate to the Cost-price index number), have been to some extent, and will continue in the future to be net detrimental to USA's economy.
IMO the standard of living is most important. And of course that is a very general and broad concept. But more important and more germane than wage or inflation numbers.

Inflation we certainly have some control on. And for the long past and foreseeable future looks to remain low. Endemic inflation hasn't been onerous in a long time now.

That all being said, if I were king I'd concentrate on alleviating OOP HC expenses for the middle class. HC is something that affects us all, and it's dollar effect on the middle class is getting very large. So with central action, we could immediately ease the burden and raise the standard of living of huge numbers of our people. If we the people so desire.

Medicare as it sits today is a grand bargain for those 65 and over enrolled. Not that we need Medicare for all per se. But subsidizing about 1/3 of the middle class' OOP HC costs on a yearly basis would be a big plus. Which is about the same bargain with Medicare. The subsidy would come from taxes, premiums, copays, deductibles, and of course some serious new central money creation.
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Old 11-27-2018, 11:22 AM
 
Location: Ruidoso, NM
5,179 posts, read 4,798,614 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Supposn View Post
How did you generate this graph? why can’t I recover the link to the original source?
Google search "median household income", set time to "last month", click on "images". It's the first one.
https://static.seekingalpha.com/uplo...809_thumb1.png
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Old 11-27-2018, 09:05 PM
 
1,106 posts, read 587,819 times
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Originally Posted by Hoonose View Post
IMO the standard of living is most important. And of course that is a very general and broad concept. ... That all being said, if I were king I'd concentrate on alleviating OOP HC expenses for the middle class. HC is something that affects us all, and it's dollar effect on the middle class is getting very large. So with central action, we could immediately ease the burden and raise the standard of living of huge numbers of our people. If we the people so desire. ...
HooNose, I was speaking to an acquaintance which if not a millionaire, is certainly among our nation’s wealthier taxpayers. I’m more concerned with USA’s economics rather than other issues. I should have said education and training, should be our #1 concern. His top choice was global warming because if we don’t get on top of that, there’s no economy that could be saved; I replied if we don’t have a robust economy, our nation won’t confront global warming.
I regret that I didn’t mention education and training as my top choice. If we, as a nation understood more and were more skillful, everything else would somewhat improve. A prior senator from Minnesota, Paul Wellstone said. “We all do better when we all do better”.

The most expensive factor for medical insurance is to find better methods of providing affordable medical screenings and treatments. Some great problems can be confronted and solved with a very few great radical methods of improvement. I suspect that isn’t the case for reducing our nation’s medical costs while obtaining healthier outcomes. I believe our medical costs problems will have to be attacked by many great radical solutions while simultaneously being nibbled away by more numerous small improvements.

One of the Affordable Care act’s yet to be fulfilled promises was to enable patients’ medical records to always follow them everywhere. If we entered any USA emergency room, regardless of within what state we last voted, or where we were last employed, physicians with our permission could have our current, accurate, and to be depended upon records of our entire prior treatments, drugs, and medical tests. We need our federal government, and our medical and legal professionals to resolve the legal privacy and confidentiality issues that are hindering enactment of solutions for these problems. These problems are costing lives and money. They undermine the quality of families lives and the economy of our nation.
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Old 11-27-2018, 09:17 PM
 
Location: Ohio
18,311 posts, read 13,437,666 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Supposn View Post
MathJak, regardless if the U.S. dollars reduced purchasing power’s due to increased money supply, or to other causes, the consequential inflation justifies increasing wages.

No, it does not. Your understanding of Economics is incredibly poor.


That's not how it works. Wages aren't based on prices, and for good reason.


Economics has built-in safety guards like Demand-pull Inflation. That's all you. It is your over-consumption and over-use that is causing prices to rise. If you can't afford it, then you can stop consuming, reduce consumption, seek substitutes or increase the Supply to offset Demand and either halt additional price increases or lower prices.


No one else has the guts to do it, but maybe you do: Explain how we benefit by accelerating the depletion, over-use or over-consumption of resources, goods and services.
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Old 11-27-2018, 11:46 PM
 
1,106 posts, read 587,819 times
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Originally Posted by Mircea View Post
No, it does not. Your understanding of Economics is incredibly poor.


That's not how it works. Wages aren't based on prices, and for good reason.


Economics has built-in safety guards like Demand-pull Inflation. That's all you. It is your over-consumption and over-use that is causing prices to rise. If you can't afford it, then you can stop consuming, reduce consumption, seek substitutes or increase the Supply to offset Demand and either halt additional price increases or lower prices.


No one else has the guts to do it, but maybe you do: Explain how we benefit by accelerating the depletion, over-use or over-consumption of resources, goods and services.
Mircea, your post is opinions devoid of facts; (i.e. it's not factual). This is not a cause to criticize your post, since economics unlike physical science, is almost entirely concerned with theories and concepts, rather than facts.
I agree with your opinion that “Wages aren't based on prices”. I more or less disagree with the remainder of opinions expressed within your post.
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Old 11-28-2018, 08:46 AM
 
8,374 posts, read 3,546,650 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Supposn View Post
Mircea, your post is opinions devoid of facts; (i.e. it's not factual). This is not a cause to criticize your post, since economics unlike physical science, is almost entirely concerned with theories and concepts, rather than facts.
I agree with your opinion that “Wages aren't based on prices”. I more or less disagree with the remainder of opinions expressed within your post.
Wages being dependent on prices is a rather vague notion. Prices almost has to be part of it though. But increased prices may or may not be associated with increased wages.

Those employees producing or involved with producing any product or service may have wages all over the map. And their wage may not change in proportion to others with sale price variation.

Some business are more dependent on volume of sale. So some businesses might lower their prices, yet make more money and profit through more volume. And then the owners may or may not change the wages of the employees. Of course the trend and maybe the hope is there, if you are the employee. And this is all very dependent on specific business and locale, as well as local and general economic timing. So the tendency or trend of pricing and wages could vary all over the place.
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Old 11-28-2018, 09:14 AM
 
1,106 posts, read 587,819 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Supposn View Post
Mircea, ... I agree with your opinion that “Wages aren't based on prices”. I more or less disagree with the remainder of opinions expressed within your post.
Hoonose, yes, you, Mircea, and I agree that “Wages aren't based on prices”. Who was your post #79 addressed to?
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