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Old 04-28-2019, 10:46 AM
 
8,725 posts, read 3,821,037 times
Reputation: 1710

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Quote:
Originally Posted by craigiri View Post
Can't do any of that without whittling down the Security State to size and raising taxes, something I (as a fairly big taxpayer) agree with heartily.

We are effectively choking ourselves.

I'd put quite a bit of stock in those who claim we are at "end stage capitalism" because the system does not scale. It was reliant on unlimited resources, cheap and slave labor and now...unlimited debt.

Only structural changes can possibly help this. The first among them is probably universal health coverage, which will free people up to innovate more and prosper. Infrastructure and education are big time.....

So, we are in agreement BUT, you cannot get there in small steps. Can't happen because all the separate forces working against this (Security State, Medical Corporations, etc.) won't let it happen.
We use more federal deficit spending, not more or more progressive taxes. New moneys can be used to help fund more universal HC. Assuming we have the available resources to do so.
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Old 04-28-2019, 10:51 AM
 
4,087 posts, read 987,132 times
Reputation: 3188
Quote:
Originally Posted by EDS_ View Post
Dude no-one with any sense about these matters buys what you are selling. 3.2% GDP growth nearly 10 years into an expansion is fantastic - possibly unprecedented - no matter how much you hate it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by redguard57 View Post
#2 - can you name any?

From what I recall, a number of them did recognize the problem with sub-prime mortgages, but few had a sense of how deep the rabbit hole went with the banks beyond just making those mortages, but selling and reselling them. Few thought the entire banking system was at risk, but did realize that 20-25% of the mortgage market was rotten.

That is, until it became clear the banking system was in serious jeopardy, which I recall being recognized by the financial media in late winter, early spring of 2008.

As for today.... I don't know, I'm in my 30s. I graduated into the recession and had a bad first 3-5 years if my working life. Things got better for me circa 2012-13. They have been in a steady upward trend since then.

Pre-recession I was in the army or in college and had mcjobs. I don't know what that economy was like writ-large, didn't pay attention back then.

As far as I can tell, we will either never have another recession again, another 2008 is around the corner or something in between.

What's interesting is that most Americans don't rate the economy as that great. They rate it mediocre. Even though from all appearances and indicators it is the best it has ever been.
I have no doubt that's what most of the media is portraying to them.
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Old 04-28-2019, 10:52 AM
 
Location: Middle of the ocean
30,539 posts, read 19,333,635 times
Reputation: 44144
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grlzrl View Post




I have no doubt that's what most of the media is portraying to them.

Consumer sentiment numbers are quite high.
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Old 04-28-2019, 10:54 AM
 
Location: Aurora Denveralis
6,527 posts, read 2,293,083 times
Reputation: 10186
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grlzrl View Post
I have no doubt that's what most of the media is portraying to them.
Really? An awful lot of the threads here are comparing the endlessly rosy numbers and reports, which are about as widely reported by "thuh media" as anything... to the quite different reality many of us are experiencing outside our front doors (which, by and large, doesn't make the news).

It's really past time to stop flogging "the media" as the cause of every consensus thought you don't happen to like. After all, where do YOUR opinions come from... godlike omniscience?
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Old 04-28-2019, 10:57 AM
 
4,087 posts, read 987,132 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quietude View Post
Really? An awful lot of the threads here are comparing the endlessly rosy numbers and reports, which are about as widely reported by "thuh media" as anything... to the quite different reality many of us are experiencing outside our front doors (which, by and large, doesn't make the news).

It's really past time to stop flogging "the media" as the cause of every consensus thought you don't happen to like. After all, where do YOUR opinions come from... godlike omniscience?
The difference is, I look at all sources and lefties refuse to consider any sources except left leaning sources as evidenced by the constant ragging on 'Faux News'. The irony is, there are many left leaning people on Fox so there is actual debate and discussion, whereas CNN and MSN is All hate Trump, all the time.

And for the record, I used to be a leftie too, until I saw I was being deceived on a regular basis.
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Old 04-28-2019, 11:01 AM
 
Location: Aurora Denveralis
6,527 posts, read 2,293,083 times
Reputation: 10186
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grlzrl View Post
The difference is, I look at all sources...
Ah. And pretty much unfailingly espouse a Fox News commentator viewpoint, often in completely undigested phrases. Got it. Happy to have your fair and balanced input here.
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Old 04-28-2019, 11:27 AM
 
Location: Oregon, formerly Texas
5,324 posts, read 3,650,097 times
Reputation: 8988
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grlzrl View Post




I have no doubt that's what most of the media is portraying to them.
What media?

I don't have cable, haven't watched cable news since 2016. I haven't watched a network news broadcast from start to finish since about 2009. I watch pieces of it, incidentally to get at the weather report. I buy a newspaper maybe once every 3 months, usually when I'm at the airport, for something to read while waiting.

So what is this "media" that is supposed to be all-powerful?
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Old 04-28-2019, 11:30 AM
 
Location: Aurora Denveralis
6,527 posts, read 2,293,083 times
Reputation: 10186
Quote:
Originally Posted by redguard57 View Post
So what is this "media" that is supposed to be all-powerful?
Oddly enough, it's every news source on earth besides Fox News, as defined and used by FN viewers.

See, FN isn't "those guys" (=="media," eww)... they're just Good Chermans.
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Old 04-28-2019, 04:26 PM
 
Location: Thailand
5,708 posts, read 2,749,770 times
Reputation: 10684
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grlzrl View Post
The difference is, I look at all sources and lefties refuse to consider any sources
Are you serious? You're doubling down on your claim that you know better because you watch better news by saying you also happen to know exactly what everyone who disagrees with you watches and it's not as good a choice as what you watch.
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Old 04-28-2019, 05:16 PM
 
Location: Aurora Denveralis
6,527 posts, read 2,293,083 times
Reputation: 10186
Quote:
Originally Posted by lieqiang View Post
Are you serious? You're doubling down on your claim that you know better because you watch better news by saying you also happen to know exactly what everyone who disagrees with you watches and it's not as good a choice as what you watch.
You're missing that she's a Reformed Leftie. There were flaws in the ideal, so she jumped the fence to unchallengeable rightness. No need to ever look further.
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