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Old 09-13-2019, 07:48 AM
 
73,404 posts, read 73,197,565 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bpollen View Post
Many CEFs are income funds. They are not intended to gain in share value. The purpose of owning them is for monthly income. The owner is not that concerned about whether the share price goes down a bit or up a bit.

If a fund is volatile, it usually is volatile both ways. It goes down a lot, and goes up a lot. You have to look at the long term trailing returns.

There can be regular, open-end funds that behave the same way. How a fund behaves in any economic environment depends on the investments it holds.
if they are paying out more then they appreciate then in effect part of that payout is a return of capital . so looking at share price movement alone is a moot point . you need to factor in all the money paid out
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Old 09-13-2019, 01:29 PM
 
Location: West Los Angeles
10,140 posts, read 10,018,416 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
if they are paying out more then they appreciate then in effect part of that payout is a return of capital . so looking at share price movement alone is a moot point . you need to factor in all the money paid out
Indeed -- looking at that mutual to which I linked and the unrealized loss on my brokerage statement, I'm in the hole for probably another decade just to break even with the initial outlay, and that's without considering inflation.
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Old 09-13-2019, 01:33 PM
 
Location: West Los Angeles
10,140 posts, read 10,018,416 times
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Here's another doozy:

https://seekingalpha.com/symbol/CHW?s=chw

My aunt bought in at $15/shr, it's now trading at half that. Even owning this for a decade, I have an unrealized loss of $2,311 for the 334 shrs my aunt was sold. And at her cost basis, I'm only getting a 5% on this crap fund. And it goes on and on with this trust I inherited -- some of these CEF's even worse. Should I consider reporting this broker to the SEC?
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Old 09-13-2019, 01:35 PM
 
73,404 posts, read 73,197,565 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Exitus Acta Probat View Post
Indeed -- looking at that mutual to which I linked and the unrealized loss on my brokerage statement, I'm in the hole for probably another decade just to break even with the initial outlay, and that's without considering inflation.
i owned an untraded reit like that ... to keep paying the dividend out in poor years they used both money ear marked for more property as well as borrowed money .

every penny we got dinged the share price more and more .
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Old 09-13-2019, 02:28 PM
 
8,231 posts, read 5,202,242 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Exitus Acta Probat View Post
...And it goes on and on with this trust I inherited -- some of these CEF's even worse. Should I consider reporting this broker to the SEC?
It takes an exquisitely clever "broker" to recommend such disastrous options. Even a classic early-90s-style high-load actively-managed fund would have done better. Reporting this broker might have some cathartic value, and in that sense, is worth doing, for one's emotions. But the odds of actually getting a cash settlement are not high.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
...every penny we got dinged the share price more and more .
But wait, that's not all! You were also liable for annual income-tax on those dividends!
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Old 09-13-2019, 02:36 PM
 
73,404 posts, read 73,197,565 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ohio_peasant View Post
It takes an exquisitely clever "broker" to recommend such disastrous options. Even a classic early-90s-style high-load actively-managed fund would have done better. Reporting this broker might have some cathartic value, and in that sense, is worth doing, for one's emotions. But the odds of actually getting a cash settlement are not high.



But wait, that's not all! You were also liable for annual income-tax on those dividends!
No , they were actually considered a return of principal ....that was the tip off something was up with those payouts ..the 1099 div showed very little taxable income compared to the 6% payout
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Old 09-13-2019, 04:22 PM
 
Location: 5,400 feet
2,680 posts, read 2,642,772 times
Reputation: 3791
Quote:
Originally Posted by Exitus Acta Probat View Post
Here's another doozy:

https://seekingalpha.com/symbol/CHW?s=chw

My aunt bought in at $15/shr, it's now trading at half that. Even owning this for a decade, I have an unrealized loss of $2,311 for the 334 shrs my aunt was sold. And at her cost basis, I'm only getting a 5% on this crap fund. And it goes on and on with this trust I inherited -- some of these CEF's even worse. Should I consider reporting this broker to the SEC?

Did you inherit those shares through a revocable trust that distributed assets on her death? If so, your tax basis is the value on her date of death.
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Old 09-13-2019, 04:26 PM
 
73,404 posts, read 73,197,565 times
Reputation: 50973
Quote:
Originally Posted by jiminnm View Post
Did you inherit those shares through a revocable trust that distributed assets on her death? If so, your tax basis is the value on her date of death.
Yep , Assets distributed after death from a revocable trust get a step up in basis so no tax would be due on any gains up until that date
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Old Yesterday, 12:31 PM
 
19,046 posts, read 13,909,381 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Exitus Acta Probat View Post
Here's another doozy:

https://seekingalpha.com/symbol/CHW?s=chw

My aunt bought in at $15/shr, it's now trading at half that. Even owning this for a decade, I have an unrealized loss of $2,311 for the 334 shrs my aunt was sold. And at her cost basis, I'm only getting a 5% on this crap fund. And it goes on and on with this trust I inherited -- some of these CEF's even worse. Should I consider reporting this broker to the SEC?

What would you report the broker for? Do you know what your aunt’s objectives were when she purchased it? Do you know what she was looking for? Fwiw 09/2009 it was trading in the high 7s buying it for 15 wouldn’t have been easy as I’m not sure it’s ever been that high. Total returns going back 10 years was just south of 10% annualized

Edit yahoo price history doesn’t show it ever any higher than low 11.xx
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Old Today, 11:53 AM
 
Location: Was Midvalley Oregon; Now Eastside Seattle area
4,447 posts, read 2,051,139 times
Reputation: 3438
+@bpollen,
I bought some CEF for wife's trading account, taxable. Brand named, specific purposed, 6-9% dividend with minor amount of return-of-investment (not k-1). Trading price somewhat interest sensitive and, of course, sensitive to the X-div day. She doesnt take the CEFs div
income for income. The CEF acts as a counterbalance (in my thinking) to a couple of speculative stocks holdings. We are retired @ 69/72.
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