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Actually in economics it’s all “dollar based”. The advancements you describe are included as hedonic adjustments to the numbers for inflation, productivity, etc. that are used to generate the indices we compare.
Good point.
My point was that even with a lack of advancing wages, a cellphone can be a huge jump in personal satisfaction, entertainment and convenience.
Sure it adds some as far as it being a nice tool and making some aspects of life more convenient no doubt.
All those little conveniences add up together to make a better quality of life.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPrzybylski07
Sure I can’t speak for everyone but there’s no debate about the majority of people not being happy and fulfilled with their work. If work was fun then they wouldn’t have to be paid to do it.
Ah come on don't go all Larry Caldwell on me, there is a debate on just about everything:
I'm pretty skeptical of any survey that attempts to measure anything as nebulous and subjective as happiness, but I don't think it's so cut&dry to claim most feel one way or the other. It's also probably very dynamic with sentiment, I doubt those articles would get same results if done yesterday.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPrzybylski07
The US might have a high standard of living when it comes to modern day conveniences but we really aren’t that happy overall as a country nor do we really have that high of a sense of well being. We are actually overall pretty unhealthy physically as a country as well which is directly correlated with feelings of our well being. We work more then other countries to pay for these modern day conveniences and as a result have less time to spend with our families, relax, and get out in nature. All three of those activities are universally regarded as activities that make people feel happier and healthier.
"Well being" is an impossible to define metric.
How does "pretty unhealthy" compare to most other countries? You keep using subjective terms like this that aren't useful since they can't provide context relative to other countries.
This work more thing, as of 2016 US median hours was about 1 more per week than Italy, half hour more than New Zealand. Are there lives that much richer for this time?
The standard of living is not all dollar based. You have to consider advances that come along and change and iimprove on the very nature of our lives. Like the PC, cellphone and Internet. Huge advances in our lives without great cost.
While you are right, I would argue that our standard of living has crashed in many every other ways as well; especially THE most important way- time: For example, my Dad was home between 3-4pm everyday when I was growing up. The companies that he worked for (2), which still exist today, would never permit this now. Also, at the start of my career most of the best workers worked between 30-35 hours per week , myself included. Forcing a 40 hour week used to be something that companies did to those that weren't cutting it, or for those the company wanted to force out. This sort of thing was VERY common back then. In fact I knew people that worked in jobs with 35 hour or even 30 hour schedules, but the companies paid for 40 hours. This was a very common perk used to recruit workers- even workers of mediocre talent!- at that time.
And of course we know the recent phenomenon of the past 20 years or so in MANY industries, where work doesn't end once you are off the clock. That type of thing was simply unheard of 30 and especially 40 years ago. Furthermore, the work in most instances has become much more labor intensive, challenging, and difficult.
TIME is the most valuable commodity and by that metric, standard of living has crashed.
You see crashing standard of living in all kinds of ways. One big one is that leisure activity among adults has completely tanked, like almost completely. Adult sports used to be huge this country 30-40 years ago. Others went to concerts, fished, car shows, relaxed on boats....
These things all exist, but in greatly diminished form. People either don't have the time, or don't have the money for them.
While you are right, I would argue that our standard of living has crashed in many every other ways as well; especially THE most important way- time: For example, my Dad was home between 3-4pm everyday when I was growing up. The companies that he worked for (2), which still exist today, would never permit this now. Also, at the start of my career most of the best workers worked between 30-35 hours per week , myself included. Forcing a 40 hour week used to be something that companies did to those that weren't cutting it, or for those the company wanted to force out. This sort of thing was VERY common back then. In fact I knew people that worked in jobs with 35 hour or even 30 hour schedules, but the companies paid for 40 hours. This was a very common perk used to recruit workers- even workers of mediocre talent!- at that time.
And of course we know the recent phenomenon of the past 20 years or so in MANY industries, where work doesn't end once you are off the clock. That type of thing was simply unheard of 30 and especially 40 years ago. Furthermore, the work in most instances has become much more labor intensive, challenging, and difficult.
TIME is the most valuable commodity and by that metric, standard of living has crashed.
You see crashing standard of living in all kinds of ways. One big one is that leisure activity among adults has completely tanked, like almost completely. Adult sports used to be huge this country 30-40 years ago. Others went to concerts, fished, car shows, relaxed on boats....
These things all exist, but in greatly diminished form. People either don't have the time, or don't have the money for them.
Someone on this thread actually gets it....
When you are on your death bed you won’t be looking back all the time spent using your phone or watching your big screen tv. It will be the memories of the time you spent with family, being out in nature, traveling, socializing and connecting with friends. .
While you are right, I would argue that our standard of living has crashed in many every other ways as well; especially THE most important way- time: For example, my Dad was home between 3-4pm everyday when I was growing up. The companies that he worked for (2), which still exist today, would never permit this now. Also, at the start of my career most of the best workers worked between 30-35 hours per week , myself included. Forcing a 40 hour week used to be something that companies did to those that weren't cutting it, or for those the company wanted to force out. This sort of thing was VERY common back then. In fact I knew people that worked in jobs with 35 hour or even 30 hour schedules, but the companies paid for 40 hours. This was a very common perk used to recruit workers- even workers of mediocre talent!- at that time.
And of course we know the recent phenomenon of the past 20 years or so in MANY industries, where work doesn't end once you are off the clock. That type of thing was simply unheard of 30 and especially 40 years ago. Furthermore, the work in most instances has become much more labor intensive, challenging, and difficult.
TIME is the most valuable commodity and by that metric, standard of living has crashed.
You see crashing standard of living in all kinds of ways. One big one is that leisure activity among adults has completely tanked, like almost completely. Adult sports used to be huge this country 30-40 years ago. Others went to concerts, fished, car shows, relaxed on boats....
These things all exist, but in greatly diminished form. People either don't have the time, or don't have the money for them.
Does anyone remember the Blue Laws, the strict Jewish traditions? In many places Saturday and Sunday were assigned as a days of rest. In our modern, secular, societies we are “on” 24/7 and that takes a toll.
I'm pretty skeptical of any survey that attempts to measure anything as nebulous and subjective as happiness, but I don't think it's so cut&dry to claim most feel one way or the other. It's also probably very dynamic with sentiment, I doubt those articles would get same results if done yesterday.
"Well being" is an impossible to define metric.
How does "pretty unhealthy" compare to most other countries? You keep using subjective terms like this that aren't useful since they can't provide context relative to other countries.
This work more thing, as of 2016 US median hours was about 1 more per week than Italy, half hour more than New Zealand. Are there lives that much richer for this time?
The fact the majority of our population falls into one or more of these categories: dependent on alcohol, takes pharmaceutical drugs, sleep deprived, vitamin D deficient from lack of being outdoors, overweight and out of shape and needs coffee to get them going in the morning, makes measuring well being very easy actually.
The fact the majority of our population falls into one or more of these categories: dependent on alcohol, takes pharmaceutical drugs, sleep deprived, vitamin D deficient from lack of being outdoors, overweight and out of shape and needs coffee to get them going in the morning, makes measuring well being very easy actually.
The quality of the food has absolutely crashed as well. Good food can still be had, but the price of the good produce, good quality fruits, and good quality meats that we used to enjoy has gone through the roof.
And its the same thing with everything- the quality that we used to enjoy is still out there, but companies that sell it lay it in at such a high price point that in some cases, it's only for rich people.
Citing any "exact standard" of anything over a 70 yer period is silly.
But if you insist.. then start with the number of work hours required to achieve either one.
Agreed it's silly, you'll notice I was responding to a post making claims about having the exact standard of living today versus in previous era. I wasn't the one insisting.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrRational
Ward and June could have had more income and that might have led to a "higher standard"
than they were able to achieve on ONE income with a ton of time off and other benefits...
but having June (or Ward ftm) racking up another 1000 or 2000 hours a year to get it...
well, that really isn't any sort of bargain. Is it?
Many people think it is indeed a bargain, that's why they choose to have a second income in the family. They believe the lifestyle it can bring them, with many things Ward & June couldn't have obtained is worth the extra hours and makes their life better.
The fact the majority of our population falls into one or more of these categories: dependent on alcohol, takes pharmaceutical drugs, sleep deprived, vitamin D deficient from lack of being outdoors, overweight and out of shape and needs coffee to get them going in the morning, makes measuring well being very easy actually.
No it doesn't. You've basically invented a measure for well-being by picking some categories and deciding the majority of a population falling into them means it's easy to define them as having poor well-being. You're seriously promoting a measure that include how much of the population "needs" coffee to get them going in the morning, that's crack-pot science since you can't even measure the submetrics you're attempting to use to arrive at your broader metric.
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