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Old 05-18-2009, 01:48 PM
 
1,956 posts, read 4,679,436 times
Reputation: 1101

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Quote:
Originally Posted by old_cold View Post
If you watched/read any amount of these sob stories, don't you start getting the impression they've been picked to do just the opposite of invoking sympathy?
Given that he writes for the NYT, I think he's the one who did the picking, and I get the feeling that he's probably taking a gamble by telling his story, hoping that enough suckers will buy the book. Since it's being published by Norton, it's probably a safe one. Norton isn't going to publish something that won't sell.

If we insist on playing the blame game, this guy deserves probably 1/3 of the blame for his situation. The mortgage hawks and real estate agents who provided the easy money and the real estate hype in the first place probably deserve another 1/3. Finally, the government, in having ridiculously low interest rates during an economic boom and tax policies that favor homeownership over renting deserves the final 1/3.

As much as you holier-than-thou "credit-is-evil" and "debtors-to-hell" apostles would have otherwise, this isn't a simple case of an idiot who didn't do his math.
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Old 05-18-2009, 01:56 PM
 
Location: Castle Hills
1,129 posts, read 2,285,441 times
Reputation: 605
Quote:
Originally Posted by StoneOne View Post
Given that he writes for the NYT, I think he's the one who did the picking, and I get the feeling that he's probably taking a gamble by telling his story, hoping that enough suckers will buy the book. Since it's being published by Norton, it's probably a safe one. Norton isn't going to publish something that won't sell.

If we insist on playing the blame game, this guy deserves probably 1/3 of the blame for his situation. The mortgage hawks and real estate agents who provided the easy money and the real estate hype in the first place probably deserve another 1/3. Finally, the government, in having ridiculously low interest rates during an economic boom and tax policies that favor homeownership over renting deserves the final 1/3.

As much as you holier-than-thou "credit-is-evil" and "debtors-to-hell" apostles would have otherwise, this isn't a simple case of an idiot who didn't do his math.
Yes, its a very simple case of an idiot that didn't do his math. When he went to his ATM and it said he had $196 left in his account, and at that point he realized he was broke? What would you call that exactly? How anyone could even think of defending this guy is beyond me. I have an idea, you and him should be friends and hang out together.

This was 90% his fault and 10% the banks fault in my opinion.
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Old 05-18-2009, 02:03 PM
 
1,956 posts, read 4,679,436 times
Reputation: 1101
Quote:
Originally Posted by ufcrules1 View Post
Yes, its a very simple case of an idiot that didn't do his math. When he went to his ATM and it said he had $196 left in his account, and at that point he realized he was broke? What would you call that exactly? How anyone could even think of defending this guy is beyond me. I have an idea, you and him should be friends and hang out together.

This was 90% his fault and 10% the banks fault in my opinion.
So you don't see any moral hazard on the part of the government doing it's hardest to encourage homeownership?

I'm not defending him, but I'm saying it's more complicated than you're making it out to be. A storm cannot be caused by stupidity on the part of one party.
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Old 05-18-2009, 02:07 PM
 
Location: Charlotte, NC
2,193 posts, read 4,450,017 times
Reputation: 1072
Quote:
Originally Posted by StoneOne View Post
Given that he writes for the NYT, I think he's the one who did the picking, and I get the feeling that he's probably taking a gamble by telling his story, hoping that enough suckers will buy the book. Since it's being published by Norton, it's probably a safe one. Norton isn't going to publish something that won't sell.

If we insist on playing the blame game, this guy deserves probably 1/3 of the blame for his situation. The mortgage hawks and real estate agents who provided the easy money and the real estate hype in the first place probably deserve another 1/3. Finally, the government, in having ridiculously low interest rates during an economic boom and tax policies that favor homeownership over renting deserves the final 1/3.

As much as you holier-than-thou "credit-is-evil" and "debtors-to-hell" apostles would have otherwise, this isn't a simple case of an idiot who didn't do his math.
There's a lot of blame to go around in this crisis in general. I do agree with that. I do feel it did start off at the top with the banks and govco.
However the way the author himself worded this article does sound like it was a failure in basic math. He himself said he had a salary of $2700 and and his mortgage payment was around that much too. I mean come on!
Even the subprime people or the ARM holders didn't even do that!

This guy appears to have known what his monthly salary was and his almony payment. He also knew his monthly mortgage amount. How can a person put his entire salary towards a mortgage?

I do have some sympathy for subprime people and ARM holders because I think many were suckered in, but not this guy.
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Old 05-18-2009, 02:10 PM
 
947 posts, read 2,783,703 times
Reputation: 721
Quote:
Originally Posted by old_cold View Post
If you watched/read any amount of these sob stories, don't you start getting the impression they've been picked to do just the opposite of invoking sympathy?
I'm wondering if they volunteer.
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Old 05-18-2009, 02:25 PM
 
Location: Castle Hills
1,129 posts, read 2,285,441 times
Reputation: 605
Quote:
Originally Posted by sheenie2000 View Post
There's a lot of blame to go around in this crisis in general. I do agree with that. I do feel it did start off at the top with the banks and govco.
However the way the author himself worded this article does sound like it was a failure in basic math. He himself said he had a salary of $2700 and and his mortgage payment was around that much too. I mean come on!
Even the subprime people or the ARM holders didn't even do that!

This guy appears to have known what his monthly salary was and his almony payment. He also knew his monthly mortgage amount. How can a person put his entire salary towards a mortgage?

I do have some sympathy for subprime people and ARM holders because I think many were suckered in, but not this guy.
Same goes for the guy on the mortgage forum right now. Has combined salary of 87k and it buying a 400k+ house. Totally stupid.

I read the whole article on this guy that worked for the NYT'S and I'm beginning to think its made up to sell a book etc. I'm not sure anyone can be that stupid.

The people who are here defending him might be though.
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Old 05-18-2009, 02:34 PM
 
Location: down south
514 posts, read 1,406,871 times
Reputation: 640
Quote:
Originally Posted by sheenie2000 View Post
LOL ok and don't marry a man who doesn't know how to add. And on top of that, fantasizes about a stay at home mom for 20 years to all of a sudden be earning six figures. So she could make up for his lack of ability to add a couple numbers together.

Anywho both were stupid for not realizing their budget. This has nothing to do with him getting married.
I'm not saying he's innocent, but I suspect that his decision to take up mortgage of that size probably had something to do with not wanting to come off as "cheap" in the eyes of his high school sweetheart. His story just reeks of a man trying desperately to at least not leave a bad impression on his woman. From his description, his wife probably considers that to be very important part of attractiveness. I know several cases of couples splurging their entire saving on a fancy wedding because of female insistence on having a dream wedding. I personally don't understand the rational behind it, although I probably would make the same choice as he did if I truly loved that woman. I'm just saying he's stupid, but his wife probably provided some impetus for him to put his stupidity into action.
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Old 05-18-2009, 02:38 PM
 
Location: Some place very cold
5,500 posts, read 19,522,360 times
Reputation: 4209
Quote:
Originally Posted by janetvj View Post
It's very hard for me to feel sympathy for people like this.
If you had read the article, you'd understand that the author is not asking for sympathy. He is simply telling his story.
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Old 05-18-2009, 02:43 PM
 
223 posts, read 462,182 times
Reputation: 209
You know I read this story and get frustrated by the mistakes of others, because ultimately they affect us all. This guy's story is just one of millions at this point in time. I would love to have a yacht and sail around the world, but you know what I can't afford that........so I don't have it. You have to work for things in this life, and if it seems too good to be true it probably is. If people lived within their means we would not be in the crisis we are in right now. I am so frustrated at how other's stupidity affects the world at large! If you couldn't afford the apartment payment, how in the world would you afford a house payment? And then everyone is your neighbordhood gets to look at your crappy grass, the paint chips, and the junk all over the place because you did something stupid!!!!! UGGGGGGGGG!!!!!!
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Old 05-18-2009, 04:28 PM
 
Location: Baltimore
1,802 posts, read 7,073,289 times
Reputation: 1910
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woof Woof Woof! View Post
If you had read the article, you'd understand that the author is not asking for sympathy. He is simply telling his story.
Actually, I did read the article. And he makes excuse after excuse as to why he is in the situation he is in. And it appeared to me that his excuses, explanations, rationales, and denials are an attempt to elicit sympathy. He thought he could beat the odds, he was in love, he was just like all the "otherwise sane Americans". It could happen to anybody. Well I disagree; it couldn't happen to anybody. It didn't happen to most of us. But we are the ones that have to now foot the bill. If he isn't asking for sympathy, he's asking for understanding, and he isn't going to get either from me.
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