Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Education
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 08-04-2010, 12:27 AM
 
30,894 posts, read 36,943,634 times
Reputation: 34516

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by runningncircles1 View Post
Bare bone basics are things you need to get through life, IMO. Basics in an post-industrialized nation like the US, however, would include:

Elementary:
Reading (increasing the length/variety of words as one progresses through the grades)

Writing (with spelling becoming more important as one progresses, especially homonyms, grammar, punctuation, how to properly diagram/break down a sentence to check for correct syntax, etc.)

Arithmetic, start introducing algebra without introducing algebra (ex: "what minus 3 is 5" instead of x-3=5, solve for x. "If Mike can paint 2 houses in an hour and Claudia can paint 1 house in an hour, how many houses will be painted in an hour?"). PEMDAS method of solving equations. Some basic geometry, such as recognition of shapes. Just get them to think abstractly instead of "solve this problem."

Physical science (not too equation specific, more like unlike charges attract, magnets attract on opposite sides, etc.. Observational. Get them to think why that might happen.)

Social Studies should focus on learning basic government structure (not getting too detailed like saying the senate appoints so-n-so committee to review such and such issue before pigeon holing it), Constitution, Bill of Rights especially, formation of the nation, how a bill becomes a law, voting and civic duty, what the flag stands for and why it is designed the way it is, number of states and what they're known for, maybe a brief introduction on how each was formed but not too detailed (gotta save something for middle school and high school). Basic geography. Introduction to World History and culture.

Foreign Language: Oh yes. This isn't even so they can necessarily speak the language but so they know how to analyze language. Believe me, much of the stuff I learned in Spanish I could apply to English (parts of speech, diagram of syntax, etc.). The same can be done in English, BUT many will simply forget it because "hey, I already know English, so who cares?" BUT, they do not know the foreign language like the back of their hand, do they? They actually HAVE to think about what they are doing. That can translate greatly into English. Plus, learning a foreign language will help greatly with vocab in English if it is Germanic or Latin based, as many stem-words apply in each, and patterns arise in translation. A "simple" word in Spanish, when Anglicized or just changing stems, can make a complex word in English.

Middle School:
Math: Start introducing letters with the numbers. Explain to them how it relates to a real world problem and how they're actually doing it in their head everyday. Just now, they have to diagram it. One thing that I've done that's helped my students that I tutored is take the x and replace it with "what", equal sign with "is" and you have a question. They'll understand how to get the answer that way. Then, you just show them how to diagram it by solving an equation. I also used to do a "recursive reverse PEMDAS method" to help them solve the equation. I've also made it into a little game where they have to save the "princess" (the variable they are solving for) by using the right keys to unlock each step to get closer to her. It makes it much more fun and they solve the things like they're nothing. Geometry should get more complex, such as adding in degrees/radians to measure angles, how triangles' angles can only sum to 180 degrees, introduction of more sides on a polygon means more degrees as well (and how an infinite number of equal sides on a polygon means infinite summation of degree, which is basically a circle... get them thinking about limits/calculus early before actually doing it). By the end, they should have a solid understanding of Algebra I (which is usually taught in HS, not good at all IMO).

Reading/Writing: These classes should now be combined together. Students should now learn how to analyze larger passages and give a summary of what's going on. Chapter books should be read. Reports should be done, and approaches on how to do a longer essay (3-5 pages) over a long period of time should be learned. Symbolism should be introduced. A thesaurus should be used to find better words and expand vocab in writing. Spelling should be scrutinized more (one incorrect word in an essay shouldn't be -50 pts ever, but if it is riddled with errors, it means they don't care or aren't doing well in that area. Assess which it is and take proper action.).

Science: Get more equations based, introduce more labs that the teacher doesn't have to baby-step through (but still explain clear enough for a middle schooler to understand), etc..

Social Studies: A detailed course on the particular state you're teaching in. Get them to learn the history of the state, government setup, counties, immediate geography, population dynamics, etc.. US History should be more in depth, including analysis of why things happened. Should tie into world history and culture, and overall human development. How "history repeats itself" for XYZ reasons. Government structure more detailed and thorough in detail (by the end of middle school, they should understand taxation, government role, and watch CSPAN while knowing a good number of words such as "committee," "cabinet," "judicial review," etc.. If given a citizenship test, should be able to pass, basically.

High School:

Social Studies: Micro and macro economics. Student should understand what a central bank is and what it does, and how that affects them at the end of the day. Should understand pros/cons of fiscal policy, monetary policy, how currency works, fractional reserve and money creation, etc.. Should understand inverse relationship between supply and demand, how taxes affect either, about long-term, medium-term, and short-term, "spiraling" supply/demand effects within a market (if demand goes down, price goes down in short run, but in the long run supply curve will shift left as firms exit the market due to inability to stay competitive, allowing businesses to raise price a little), profit vs. revenue, government role in economy. World History should be learned, US History should tie in more. Analysis of both must be in depth and thorough.

Science: Start bell-curving! And, I mean make the class more difficult, like what they'd find in college. Equations based, lab-based (hell, if you want, make it a "fail the lab, fail the course" type deal). Newtonian classical mechanics, electrostatics and magnetism should be taught, with a brief introduction to "modern physics," including Einstein's General Relativity and a bit of quantum theory (you can be less equations based with that, though, since it is college level stuff). Should be more algebra based, maybe calculus based if on college track. However, only simple calculus, nothing too hard... things that can be taught in one or two class periods. Chemistry and biology should be emphasized. All three fields should be tied together to show that science isn't compartmentalized.

Math: Algebra II, Euclidean Geometry, Trigonometry/pre-Calculus, Calculus I.

English: Further analysis into stories and literature. How to read a business contract... can be very English intensive. Scrutinize to make sure basic syntax and analysis is being used.

All classes should be on a curve or similar system at this point. Why? Because they should be difficult and challenging to need one. Also, many electives should be introduced to allow the student to find out what they are good at, especially since many don't want to go to college. If they have a subject they are good at and like, they are more likely to stay in school and go to the "dreaded" classes.

For all levels, some form of physical education should be emphasized, proper nutrition taught, and maybe arts/music in lower levels. There's more, but I can only type so long, LOL.
GREAT POST. I agree with everything here.

I would also add to the basics:

1. Personal Financial Planning: Managing bank accounts, basics of insurance; basics of stock, bond, real estate, & mutual fund investments; retirement planning basics (401K, 403b, IRA, etc.); understanding of loans; compound interest; estate planning basics; income taxation basics.

and

2. Comprehensive Sex Education. This would include the benefits of abstinence but not ignore teaching of contraception. Would also talk about the long term failure rate of contraception (I think this gets ignored). Would explore not just the physical, but also the emotional ramifications of risky sexual activity.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 08-04-2010, 04:01 AM
 
20,793 posts, read 61,290,510 times
Reputation: 10695
Quote:
Originally Posted by mysticaltyger View Post
GREAT POST. I agree with everything here.

I would also add to the basics:

1. Personal Financial Planning: Managing bank accounts, basics of insurance; basics of stock, bond, real estate, & mutual fund investments; retirement planning basics (401K, 403b, IRA, etc.); understanding of loans; compound interest; estate planning basics; income taxation basics.

and

2. Comprehensive Sex Education. This would include the benefits of abstinence but not ignore teaching of contraception. Would also talk about the long term failure rate of contraception (I think this gets ignored). Would explore not just the physical, but also the emotional ramifications of risky sexual activity.
Not that I don't think that these are important but is it really the responsibility of the schools to have comprehensive courses in these subjects? My kids had sex ed in school along with "health" classes but they were by no means "comprehensive". We took care of most of that. Same with financial planning, it's great to have an elective course in high school but shouldn't the parents teach this? Our high school has a required Economics class and they do touch on these things and introduce them but the rest should be up to the parents.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-04-2010, 06:44 AM
 
13,254 posts, read 33,513,664 times
Reputation: 8103
Quote:
Originally Posted by golfgal View Post
Not that I don't think that these are important but is it really the responsibility of the schools to have comprehensive courses in these subjects? My kids had sex ed in school along with "health" classes but they were by no means "comprehensive". We took care of most of that. Same with financial planning, it's great to have an elective course in high school but shouldn't the parents teach this? Our high school has a required Economics class and they do touch on these things and introduce them but the rest should be up to the parents.
I agree with golfgal. There are only so many hours in a day. A normal HS student is not going to have any money to save to put into mutual funds or a job with retirement benefits. Not that these aren't needed pieces of information for adults, but it won't be needed or remembered by HS students. Basic finance is taught in our schools and general savings information should be a life skill taught by parents.
__________________
Please follow THESE rules.

Any Questions on how to use this site? See this.

Realtors, See This.

Moderator - Lehigh Valley, NEPA, Harrisburg, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, Delaware, Education and Colleges and Universities.

When I post in bold red, that is Moderator action and per the TOS can be discussed only via Direct Message.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-04-2010, 07:00 AM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,297 posts, read 120,711,654 times
Reputation: 35920
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88 View Post
Kids don't learn to use a cellphone or an iPod in school. How do you suppose they get so good at it? It is not necessary at all to teach people who own computers how to use them in a structured educational setting. Just as it was not necessary to teach kids in school how to use the telephone or the radio in 1950.

Compared to the present, automobiles were very, very difficult to learn to drive in the 1920s. But no schools taught kids to drive them. But now they do. Go figure. I can teach a person to drive a car with a stick shift in one afternoon. But it takes a high school a whole year to teach a kid to drive an automatic.
I took driver's ed in school in the 60s, and it had been around long before I was 16. Learning the mechanics of driving a car does not make one a safe driver, though there are way too many people on the road who think just that! In my state, driver's ed is not offered in school in most districts, and you have to log 50 hours of practice before you can get your license. It's not as simple as "push in clutch, put car in gear and go".
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-04-2010, 07:08 AM
 
9,229 posts, read 8,544,975 times
Reputation: 14770
I believe the term "basics" was originally intended to be the body of information necessary to prepare our young for further study. When public education was created, it was designed to prepare them for a better life than their parents enjoyed, and for some the hope was higher learning.

In order to move into a world of higher knowledge, the standards grow as the levels of higher learning raise.

At minimum, I would like our children :
  • ... to leave the public (and home) schools with the ability to speak and write our language as it is understood by the rest of our society.
  • ... to be prepared to do the math necessary to understand presently known sciences.
  • ... to understand how to operate and maintain their bodies.
  • ... to know how to conduct day-to-day financial life.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-04-2010, 07:50 AM
 
632 posts, read 1,517,039 times
Reputation: 799
Quote:
Originally Posted by golfgal View Post
Same with financial planning, it's great to have an elective course in high school but shouldn't the parents teach this? Our high school has a required Economics class and they do touch on these things and introduce them but the rest should be up to the parents.
I teach a required senior-level class called Personal Finance. I cover checking/savings accounts, buying a car, renting an apt., insurance, credit, etc. While I think it should be the parents teaching this, even my students from middle- to upper-socioeconomic households say their parents just haven't had time to teach this. Those from lower socioeconomic households get their first exposure to all concepts in this class.

It's only a semester, so the it doesn't take away too much classroom time from other basics. Just this summer, I had 3 students contact me to tell me how they'd used the knowledge and skills learned in class. One student said she helped save her parents money on their car insurance. She said they'd never considered the deductible.....they raised their deductible from $250 to $500 and saved over $900 in premiums in a year! Simple stuff you'd think people consider, but don't.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-04-2010, 09:17 AM
 
Location: On a Slow-Sinking Granite Rock Up North
3,638 posts, read 6,166,537 times
Reputation: 2677
Quote:
Originally Posted by golfgal View Post
Not that I don't think that these are important but is it really the responsibility of the schools to have comprehensive courses in these subjects? My kids had sex ed in school along with "health" classes but they were by no means "comprehensive". We took care of most of that. Same with financial planning, it's great to have an elective course in high school but shouldn't the parents teach this? Our high school has a required Economics class and they do touch on these things and introduce them but the rest should be up to the parents.

I agree. In my world, parents/politicians/teachers/everyone else cannot complain about "gubmint" telling them how to raise their kids on one hand, and then expect them to teach them life skills on the other.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-04-2010, 09:52 AM
 
4,382 posts, read 4,232,458 times
Reputation: 5859
Quote:
Originally Posted by toobusytoday View Post
I agree with golfgal. There are only so many hours in a day. A normal HS student is not going to have any money to save to put into mutual funds or a job with retirement benefits. Not that these aren't needed pieces of information for adults, but it won't be needed or remembered by HS students. Basic finance is taught in our schools and general savings information should be a life skill taught by parents.
Key phrase: normal HS student. When parents don't have financial skills, they can't teach them to their children. No one at home ever taught me anything about financial matters. My mother even ridiculed me for taking accounting at school my senior year. Unfortunately, it didn't teach me anything at all about insurance, investing, retirement, etc.

As wyolady says, middle-class parents don't always take the time to teach their children these life skills. And often, low-socioeconomic group children have never even heard of mutual funds, etc. My students' families tend not to trust banks.

A personal anecdote--Back in the mid-90's the trend of having gold teeth was surging. An assistant principal was trying to help me work with a bright kid who was on the wrong track. The topic came up about his gold teeth being an impediment to getting a good job. I'll always remember the boy's response--"Having gold in your mouth means that you can take care of your family."

What better place to keep your life savings from getting stolen than inside your own body? I don't think his parents were likely to teach him much about investing for retirement.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-04-2010, 10:21 AM
 
20,793 posts, read 61,290,510 times
Reputation: 10695
Quote:
Originally Posted by wyolady View Post
I teach a required senior-level class called Personal Finance. I cover checking/savings accounts, buying a car, renting an apt., insurance, credit, etc. While I think it should be the parents teaching this, even my students from middle- to upper-socioeconomic households say their parents just haven't had time to teach this. Those from lower socioeconomic households get their first exposure to all concepts in this class.

It's only a semester, so the it doesn't take away too much classroom time from other basics. Just this summer, I had 3 students contact me to tell me how they'd used the knowledge and skills learned in class. One student said she helped save her parents money on their car insurance. She said they'd never considered the deductible.....they raised their deductible from $250 to $500 and saved over $900 in premiums in a year! Simple stuff you'd think people consider, but don't.
We have this too in the Economics class, probably very similar to what you have but it is introductory information, not comprehensive. To me comprehensive would mean several years of this in high school.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-04-2010, 11:42 AM
 
Location: On a Slow-Sinking Granite Rock Up North
3,638 posts, read 6,166,537 times
Reputation: 2677
Quote:
Originally Posted by golfgal View Post
We have this too in the Economics class, probably very similar to what you have but it is introductory information, not comprehensive. To me comprehensive would mean several years of this in high school.

Back when I was in High School (almost, but not quite the days of the Crimean War ) that was taught when you opted for the Business Course (Verses College or General). I'm thankful for that course and the typing course that I took as well now.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Education

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top