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Old 08-16-2010, 06:40 PM
 
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1960: All the boys at the school are planning to out to the playground as soon as the last bell rings to see the school bully "whoop" that new negro kid who has been in the school since it was integrated last September. The school principal never interferes with fights even though at least two boys have had broken noses and one boy suffered a concussion He just figures "boys will be boys". Nor, does he think the racial implications of what is happening are a reason to get involved either.

2007: The school principal hears that some of the boys are bullying a new child. He summons the boys and their parents to his office and explains the school's "zero tolerance" policy towards fighting. In short, the boys will be expelled if they harm another student. The parents tell their children to mind their own business and leave the new kid alone. A proper atmosphere is restored and the children go back to learning which is what they are in school to do.

1960: Sally is sick with pneumonia because she had to stand outside in the winter waiting for the school bus to come. The school dress code requires girls to wear dresses and dresses don't keep Sally very warm while she shivers in the cold for twenty minutes waiting for that bus. She misses a whole week of school.

2007: The principal is smiling this morning. He's just gone over attendance statistics with the secretary. Not many kids seem to be getting sick this fall. It probably has alot to do with the immunization program and the support he gets from the school nurse in seeing that the vast majority of students are fully vaccinated.

1960: Cindy Smith comes home from school in tears. She asks her mother "Why can't I play basketball like the boys do? Why do they get all the fun". Cindy's mother patiently tries to explain to her that sports like football, basketball, and baseball are for boys. She reminds her though that Cindy can try out next year for cheerleading and pep club. Late that night in bed, Cindy dreams a dream of one day becoming an olympic athlete.

2007: An awards ceremony is taking place in the high school, Julianne is being presented with an award for winning the regional Javelin throwing competition. Back in the audience, a proud grandmother--named Cindy--sits with tears running down her cheeks. She says over and over "I never thought this day would come".

1960: Johnny just can't read. The last three years of school have been frustrating for everyone. They've tried everything. He's been forced to repeat a year of school. His parents have been regularly notified he's not learning. The principal has even paddled Johnny, but nothing seems to work. When asked what is wrong, Johnny says things like "all the letters on the page look funny to me". Johnny drops out of school in tenth grade and works in construction until one day his back gives out and he ends up on disability.

2007: Early testing in elementary school showed that Johnny had problems reading. The diagnosis made is "Dyslexia". Based on this diagnosis, the district brings in a reading specialist. An IEP is created. Johnny spends some time in resource. Because of the early intervention taken Johnny struggles, but is able to read. He proves to be a very hard worker and ends up graduating high school with a B average. He later attends a community college and goes to work in the computer science field.

1960: Sam shows up for school with a broken arm. No one at school thinks much of it and when he is asked how it happened, he tells everyone "I fell out of a tree". The truth is much worse. Sam's father has explosive moods. Sam left his bicycle in the driveway and when his father saw it there. He screamed and grabbed Sam so hard he broke his arm. When they took Sam to the doctor, he was suspicious about the injury. But, the doctor was old school and he believed that "families need to work things out for themselves". Sam experiences an entire childhood with a physically and emotionally abusive father.

2007: Sam's teacher is very suspicious of his broken arm. Somehow his comment that he got it falling out of a tree just doesn't make sense. The teacher realizes that under state law he is a "mandatory reporter of suspected child abuse". The teacher contacts CPS in their state. CPS investigates the situation and forces Sam's Dad to attend anger management classes and obtain counseling by a therapist. He is told if he does not that CPS wll remove Sam from the home. The father gets the treatment he needs, recognizes the error of his ways, and reforms. The rest of Sam's childhood goes pretty well.

The moral of this story is that the "Good Old Days" were filled with racism, sexism, ignorance in dealing with dyslexia and learning disabilities, and unreported child abuse.

Would you really choose to go back to that?
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Old 08-16-2010, 07:04 PM
 
Location: Fairfield, CT
5,846 posts, read 8,607,880 times
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This is a little distorted. I lived back then. Things weren't the way they are portrayed here. Of course, they weren't perfect either. The reality is, things always get better in some ways, and worse in others.
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Old 08-16-2010, 08:29 PM
 
8,240 posts, read 15,249,606 times
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Wow, amazing we all survived and thrived to make the US the #1 superpower. Amazing.
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Old 08-20-2010, 04:12 PM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,663 posts, read 74,269,803 times
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1960's: Johnny has Aspergers. Nobody has ever heard of it, they just think he is a little bit tiresome at times. He is thrown into the class to sink or swim, and he swims, and when he graduates with a C average and a 130 IQ, he doesn't know he is any different from anybody else. He goes to college, drops out, gets married, has gentle but intelligent kids, and lives happily ever after.

2010: Johnny has Aspergers. He is heavily medicated to try to get him to smile and say please, is constantly reminded that he is "different", and placed in special education. He is made to wear a protective helmet, and is not allowed in team events because he is annoyingly perseverative. When he is 40, he still lives with his mother, and phones bomb threats to schools, and then commits suicide.
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Old 08-20-2010, 07:00 PM
Status: "Summer!" (set 20 days ago)
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
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I know someone with Asperger's who scored a perfect 1600 on his SATs (old test), went to and graduated from Cal Tech this year, and is now in grad school at Stanford. I don't think that would have happened in the 60s. He probably would have been ridiculed, and "counseled out" of college prep courses.
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Old 08-20-2010, 08:49 PM
 
Location: Pennsylvania
5,539 posts, read 9,942,730 times
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Why would a kid with Asperger's wear a protective helmet?
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Old 08-20-2010, 11:01 PM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,663 posts, read 74,269,803 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
I know someone with Asperger's who scored a perfect 1600 on his SATs (old test), went to and graduated from Cal Tech this year, and is now in grad school at Stanford. I don't think that would have happened in the 60s. He probably would have been ridiculed, and "counseled out" of college prep courses.
I thought, at the very least, in the Education Forum, we would not have people citing as objective general evidence "I knew someone who . . ." That is called anecdotal evidence.

Aspergers does not obstruct a person with genius IQ from scoring 1600 on the SAT, nor does it obstruct that person from getting a PhD. Those who have been drugged into submission may very well have glittering academic careers, but will not necessarily progress seamlessly through the emotional conflicts.

Having been an Aspergers child in school in the 1950s, I know something about how such students were socialized and "counselled" then.
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Old 08-21-2010, 10:45 AM
Status: "Summer!" (set 20 days ago)
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
87,006 posts, read 102,606,536 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88 View Post
I thought, at the very least, in the Education Forum, we would not have people citing as objective general evidence "I knew someone who . . ." That is called anecdotal evidence.
Right! You are referring to posts like this as anecdotal, yes?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88 View Post
Right on. My stepdaughter actually dropped out of school in her Junior year, because she felt that she had already learned as much as school could teach her about gaming the system, and by then, school was just holding her back. She missed her friends and went back and graduated with them, but by the time she could legally drink, she already ran a successful business and was investing in real estate.

She started out doing environmentally sensitive house-cleaning for Volvo Liberals in the mid-90s, and soon had some corporate accounts eating out of her hand and a staff working for her.
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Old 08-21-2010, 12:42 PM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,663 posts, read 74,269,803 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
Right! You are referring to posts like this as anecdotal, yes?
The general principle had already been made in a previous post (#212), and I offered a personal example that I thought would illustrate it. That point being that almost ANYBODY can fit into the pattern that was described.

But you chose an example from the furthest extreme margins of human capability (perfect SAT), and used it so show that it illustrates the contrast between the effectiveness of two different eras of pedagogy. You don't see the difference?

So you took the trouble to scour through all my postings, determined to find one in which I cited an anecdotal example. Good sleuth work.

Last edited by jtur88; 08-21-2010 at 01:06 PM..
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Old 08-21-2010, 02:27 PM
Status: "Summer!" (set 20 days ago)
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
87,006 posts, read 102,606,536 times
Reputation: 33064
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88 View Post
The general principle had already been made in a previous post (#212), and I offered a personal example that I thought would illustrate it. That point being that almost ANYBODY can fit into the pattern that was described.

But you chose an example from the furthest extreme margins of human capability (perfect SAT), and used it so show that it illustrates the contrast between the effectiveness of two different eras of pedagogy. You don't see the difference?

So you took the trouble to scour through all my postings, determined to find one in which I cited an anecdotal example. Good sleuth work.
LOL! Pot, meet kettle. I remembered your post from the other thread. It was a piece of cake to find it.
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