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I can understand that you see it that way because of your childhood experiences. We all are shaped by our experiences. But your experience is not typical.
I think in most families there is an expectation that the kids will "go" at each stop, whether they feel like it or not. (If a parent has five children, and each wants his own restroom stop, . . . .) There is that same expectation at school. If kids use the restroom at recess, whether or not they need to, they rarely need to go again ten minutes later. Again, as others have said, if a child has a medical reason, the teacher will let her go as needed. If my child needed to use the restroom that frequently, or if she was unable to go (at recess), then urgently needed to go (ten minutes later), I'd definitely get her to the doctor.
If thirty students each want to be excused from class once a day for an average of four minutes, that's already two hours! Kinda cuts into teaching time.
Have you ever served on a jury? Would the judge cheerfully excuse a juror who has a "need" ten minutes after a recess?
Excellent post. I think there's sometimes confusion from people who have never tried to run a classroom themselves, or never had a large family to take places (loved your example) and accomplish objectives that things can run the same way whether you're talking about 2 kids or 30.
They can't.
If it was just the teacher and the one child, it would be simple to stop for breaks whenever the child wanted to, push forward when they didn't need them... but the same techniques that work when you have one child in your charge are ineffective when you're responsible for making sure 30 children meet academic objectives by the end of the year.
As others have wisely pointed out, part of growing up is that we all have to learn about our bodies and how to work around physical needs in a structured environment. My boss expects me to be conscious of my bladder, to utilize the scheduled breaks I am provided rather than leaving a classroom of kids unattended while I wander out to the bathroom and back for 5-10 minutes. The car trip was an excellent example. Barring a documented medical condition, if you fully empty your bladder 10 minutes before, you should be perfectly capable of making it to the next scheduled "stop."
Unless you are a teacher, and you've had a classroom full of kids with all different learning styles and levels, it's very, very difficult to second guess. Like any job, second guessing is tricky. I prefer not to, unless it's something obviously illegal. I mean, look where we come from. Our ancestors were educated in one room log cabin schoolhouses with bathrooms outside in the heat, rain, snow,etc. We survived- and thrived. Let's stop babying our kids.
Excellent post. I think there's sometimes confusion from people who have never tried to run a classroom themselves, or never had a large family to take places (loved your example) and accomplish objectives that things can run the same way whether you're talking about 2 kids or 30.
They can't.
If it was just the teacher and the one child, it would be simple to stop for breaks whenever the child wanted to, push forward when they didn't need them... but the same techniques that work when you have one child in your charge are ineffective when you're responsible for making sure 30 children meet academic objectives by the end of the year.
As others have wisely pointed out, part of growing up is that we all have to learn about our bodies and how to work around physical needs in a structured environment. My boss expects me to be conscious of my bladder, to utilize the scheduled breaks I am provided rather than leaving a classroom of kids unattended while I wander out to the bathroom and back for 5-10 minutes. The car trip was an excellent example. Barring a documented medical condition, if you fully empty your bladder 10 minutes before, you should be perfectly capable of making it to the next scheduled "stop."
I always thought that this was accomplished in preschool. That's one of the points--children need to learn to adapt to the rhythms of the world around them. Infants and toddlers need to be in a world that is sensitive to their rhythms. Preschoolers need to learn how to get along with other people and get used to a schedule imposed on them that respects their rhythms.
While a 2-year-old may need to eat or nap whenever, a 3- or 4-year-old can learn to wait for snack time, story time, play time, lunch time, nap time, and even potty time. By the time a child reaches grade school, he should be able to empty his bladder at will and then wait for the next scheduled break.
Parents can help their children develop bladder control and teach them that their bladder will continue to expand up to a point. Some children also have to be taught to make sure their bladder is completely empty by bearing down three times before "finishing". Many children, especially boys, don't really pay attention to their own body signals. Adults can help them learn how to regulate themselves by having them wait longer while at home. Like so many other things, it takes practice.
I can understand that you see it that way because of your childhood experiences. We all are shaped by our experiences. But your experience is not typical.
I think in most families there is an expectation that the kids will "go" at each stop, whether they feel like it or not. (If a parent has five children, and each wants his own restroom stop, . . . .) There is that same expectation at school. If kids use the restroom at recess, whether or not they need to, they rarely need to go again ten minutes later. Again, as others have said, if a child has a medical reason, the teacher will let her go as needed. If my child needed to use the restroom that frequently, or if she was unable to go (at recess), then urgently needed to go (ten minutes later), I'd definitely get her to the doctor.
If thirty students each want to be excused from class once a day for an average of four minutes, that's already two hours! Kinda cuts into teaching time.
Have you ever served on a jury? Would the judge cheerfully excuse a juror who has a "need" ten minutes after a recess?
Once again, we are comparing elementary school kids to adults...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Georgianbelle
I am not a teacher, but I have family members that are. I know that if a parent yelled or "raised their voice" at any of them they would refuse to speak with them. If this behavior continued, they would call the police and have them escorted from the school. Teachers are professionals and deserve to be treated as such. Children do abuse privileges, and it is hard to let every child leave the room every time they ask. It doesn't matter if your children are perfect angels. A teacher needs to be fair. If her policy is that the child needs to wait, then all children should wait. Imagine trying to teach a class with 25 children when one or more is constantly out of the room. It can't be done. If every parent would substitute for at least a week, I think attitudes toward teachers would change.
This wasn't about bathroom breaks (my original post), but my daughter being denied medical attention when getting sick at school. I'm not going to apologize when this had already been brought to the teacher's attention. I was quick and to the point and did not threaten her in anyway other than to go to the school board.
Do you know how many times I've had patients threaten to go to my boss? I always tell them to make sure they spell my name right and offer to write it down for them because I know I am doing my job and have never been written up in the last seven years.
Quote:
Originally Posted by h886
Excellent post. I think there's sometimes confusion from people who have never tried to run a classroom themselves, or never had a large family to take places (loved your example) and accomplish objectives that things can run the same way whether you're talking about 2 kids or 30.
They can't.
If it was just the teacher and the one child, it would be simple to stop for breaks whenever the child wanted to, push forward when they didn't need them... but the same techniques that work when you have one child in your charge are ineffective when you're responsible for making sure 30 children meet academic objectives by the end of the year.
As others have wisely pointed out, part of growing up is that we all have to learn about our bodies and how to work around physical needs in a structured environment. My boss expects me to be conscious of my bladder, to utilize the scheduled breaks I am provided rather than leaving a classroom of kids unattended while I wander out to the bathroom and back for 5-10 minutes. The car trip was an excellent example. Barring a documented medical condition, if you fully empty your bladder 10 minutes before, you should be perfectly capable of making it to the next scheduled "stop."
Except that sometimes children drink alot, esp. after recess or gym class and that urge might not hit until the middle of class. I don't think we are teaching them anything by making them squirm in their seats for half an hour.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lhpartridge
I always thought that this was accomplished in preschool. That's one of the points--children need to learn to adapt to the rhythms of the world around them. Infants and toddlers need to be in a world that is sensitive to their rhythms. Preschoolers need to learn how to get along with other people and get used to a schedule imposed on them that respects their rhythms.
While a 2-year-old may need to eat or nap whenever, a 3- or 4-year-old can learn to wait for snack time, story time, play time, lunch time, nap time, and even potty time. By the time a child reaches grade school, he should be able to empty his bladder at will and then wait for the next scheduled break.
Parents can help their children develop bladder control and teach them that their bladder will continue to expand up to a point. Some children also have to be taught to make sure their bladder is completely empty by bearing down three times before "finishing". Many children, especially boys, don't really pay attention to their own body signals. Adults can help them learn how to regulate themselves by having them wait longer while at home. Like so many other things, it takes practice.
up to a point. You can cause permanent bladder damage by frequently over extending it. Your body will learn to shut off those stretch receptors if you ignore them too frequently, not to mention "holding it" can cause UTI's.
I was quick and to the point and did not threaten her in anyway other than to go to the school board.
You did say in your OP that you yelled at the teacher; you even seemed to be bragging about the fact. Going to school and raising your voice to the teacher is not the way to behave. Instead of getting her to listen, you probably made an enemy. Also, you are lucky that you were not asked to leave the school premises or even escorted from the school grounds. I am amazed that the teacher or the admistrator did not tell you that such childish behavior is not tolerated. How do you expect your child to respect his teacher, when you obviously don't?
Once again, we are comparing elementary school kids to adults...
This wasn't about bathroom breaks (my original post), but my daughter being denied medical attention when getting sick at school. I'm not going to apologize when this had already been brought to the teacher's attention. I was quick and to the point and did not threaten her in anyway other than to go to the school board.
Do you know how many times I've had patients threaten to go to my boss? I always tell them to make sure they spell my name right and offer to write it down for them because I know I am doing my job and have never been written up in the last seven years.
Except that sometimes children drink alot, esp. after recess or gym class and that urge might not hit until the middle of class. I don't think we are teaching them anything by making them squirm in their seats for half an hour.
up to a point. You can cause permanent bladder damage by frequently over extending it. Your body will learn to shut off those stretch receptors if you ignore them too frequently, not to mention "holding it" can cause UTI's.
Of course I'm not advocating holding it all day or even all morning. I'm simply saying that it is not inappropriate to explicitly teach children how to make sure that their bladder is completely empty and that it is not always necessary to go at the first urge. Children should be expected to go before school, mid-morning, after lunch, and mid-afternoon.
I have a problem with the many teachers at our high school that don't allow the students to go after lunch. That is the only class where I allow students to go freely, one at a time, after lunch. The other classes have been told that they are expected to have room for 94 minutes worth. The only exceptions are the students who are on the medical list.
I was quick and to the point and did not threaten her in anyway other than to go to the school board.
You did say in your OP that you yelled at the teacher; you even seemed to be bragging about the fact. Going to school and raising your voice to the teacher is not the way to behave. Instead of getting her to listen, you probably made an enemy. Also, you are lucky that you were not asked to leave the school premises or even escorted from the school grounds. I am amazed that the teacher or the admistrator did not tell you that such childish behavior is not tolerated. How do you expect your child to respect his teacher, when you obviously don't?
I did raise my voice at her because she was already instructed in writing (and we got a reply), that my daughter to be allowed to go to the nurse if she wasn't feeling well. This was not the first incident with this teacher. I'm not going to apologize for protecting my children and if the teacher thinks she can no longer teach my child because I raised my voice at her, then please transfer my child to another class. She came home with a temp of over 102, TWICE, and once more with diarrhea.
Sorry, I've never seen someone "escorted" off of school property for 30 seconds of raising their voice.
And for everyone else:
My wife has interstitial cystitis. That is a very painful bladder disease. The cause of which is unknown, but there is no cure and no data as to if it is hereditary. We are very careful with our kids bathroom breaks because of this.
I can't imagine any teacher would hesitate to send a kid to the nurse or office. Why would they want a sick kid in the classroom? I would think a teacher would be perfectly pleased to call home and have parents pick them up. One less?
I can't imagine any teacher would hesitate to send a kid to the nurse or office. Why would they want a sick kid in the classroom? I would think a teacher would be perfectly pleased to call home and have parents pick them up. One less?
I think in most schools it is the health room personnel's job to call the parents, after they have assessed the child.
I can't imagine any teacher would hesitate to send a kid to the nurse or office. Why would they want a sick kid in the classroom? I would think a teacher would be perfectly pleased to call home and have parents pick them up. One less?
The point is, many of the requests are not because the kid is sick, but rather they just want to get out of the classroom.
There are tons of "likes" that have been created on Facebook about this very thing. Here are a few:
Teachers call it the bathroom, we call it I'm bored, I'm leaving
Teachers call it the nurse, we call it I want to go home
Teachers call it the bathroom, we call it a ticket to freedom
Teachers call it the bathroom, we call it an excuse to leave
Teachers call it the bathroom, we call it the texting room
Teachers call it the bathroom, we call it a break from class
Teachers call it the nurse, we call it our way out
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