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Parents: The parents (even the generally involved ones) don't like having their role as the #1 most important factor in the children's educational experience pointed out to them... they would prefer to be able to blame the schools and teachers and community at large when Johnny doesn't do well rather than cut back on their work (or play!) schedules to actually be the involved parents they like to portray themselves as.
Teachers: Beyond the salary issues that most are reconciled to anyway, being expected to absorb the classroom materials expenses that the system and/or parents should be providing is an every day in their face reminder that most consider them overpaid babysitters rather than qualified professionals... teachers don't like being forced into the role of social worker and substitute parent that too many systems put on them.
Community: The community at large doesn't want to take on the responsibility nor the expense of doing education right or face the truths about the poorly performing role of parents that the system insists the teachers make up for by the social work and pseudo parenting built into their schedule and mandates.
On top of that you get the Charter School advocates.
A relatively few motivated parents and abundance of frustrated teachers pushing for something that will remove the glue that holds what passes for a school system from falling apart altogether.
Not to be argumentative but I see many parents involved, and classrooms given all the supplies they need.
After reading your response it would appear the parents/guardians are getting the blame. Personally, *gulp...I think the first three paragraphs are myths that keep getting perpetuated for some reason.
You said: Parents: The parents (even the generally involved ones) don't like having their role as the #1 most important factor in the children's educational experience pointed out to them... they would prefer to be able to blame the schools and teachers and community at large when Johnny doesn't do well rather than cut back on their work (or play!) schedules to actually be the involved parents they like to portray themselves as.
Many parents are working two jobs just to stay afloat and many of those I've talked to, (and I'm aware it certainly cannot be a representative sample) realize they are the #1 important factor in the child's education. I'm not hearing blame from the parents I speak to, (and I'm not trying to blame). What I hear is concern about what is going on in the school system itself. I hear parents expect the children to receive an education while in school. They are there to learn. Schools were meant to teach. Correct?
You said: Teachers: Beyond the salary issues that most are reconciled to anyway, being expected to absorb the classroom materials expenses that the system and/or parents should be providing is an every day in their face reminder that most consider them overpaid babysitters rather than qualified professionals... teachers don't like being forced into the role of social worker and substitute parent that too many systems put on them.
Again, I can only speak to what I see. I see materials are not an issue. Also, I'm not sure exactly what they are doing to feel like social workers or substitute parents. Maybe you could expound on that. I suppose they are feeling like overpaid babysitters? If that is true why aren't they teaching? What are they doing to be babysitters? What is consigning them to that role?
You said: Community: The community at large doesn't want to take on the responsibility nor the expense of doing education right or face the truths about the poorly performing role of parents that the system insists the teachers make up for by the social work and pseudo parenting built into their schedule and mandates.
Last time I checked we still were paying taxes. I would need to hear what you mean about "doing education right".
What I get from your post is it's the parents fault and I don't completely believe that. What is it the school system expects? Do they expect perfect little children before they can teach?
It's been a loong time since I've been in the education system and perhaps things have changed that much but there are always "issues" in regards to children. I don't think that has changed. Perhaps I need to be enlightened as to how "bad" it is now and what exactly are these derelict parents doing that is ruining the child's education experience in school.
I can't speak to the charter school issue. I do think before things change everyone will have to stop blaming. Personally, parents take the heat. When the heat is on the system, the system doesn't want to take responsibility if you ask me. But I could be wrong. I'm going to try and keep an open mind.
Let's leave out the parents who obviously don't care about their child's education. For the parents who try communicating with the school/teacher, have to work two jobs and are involved, it is a low blow to keep hitting a brick wall. We are fortunate to live in a small town and that the community is very involved in our school as is our school is involved with our community.
When it comes right down to education and why kids are not succeeding, I feel it's all due to no communication between teacher and parents. I'm in our school enough to know what these teachers have to put up with. I also know what parents have to put up with. Teachers are with our children eight hours a day. Most parents are not "in" the school to see what is going on. I know for a fact that out of my four boys, I have one that I would fully trust to be on his best behavior at school. The other three will take any opportunity to goof off they can get. If parents could just break down and admit that every kid is not perfect, every parent is not perfect and that every teacher is not perfect, we might have a great educational system.
Parents want control. They want schools to cater to their special little snowflake. The problem is the entire school is full of special little snowflakes. The idea that kids should take responsibility and be the ones to adapt is unacceptable. It is, clearly, the teacher's responsibility to make a student learn. After all, there's nothing to individualizing the educations of 30+ kids in one classroom.
Parenting has become a competitive sport. The proof you're a good parents is seen in grades and how advanced your child is. Parents are threatened by anyone who doesn't acknowledge that their child is superior or otherwise special. If the child is not advanced, there must be an explanation or someone to blame. Hence the 4 fold increase in diagnoses of ADD/ADHD and autism. They cannot accept that our kids are who they are and that parents are not perfect.
20/20 hind sight, there are things I would have done differently with my kids but I don't get the chance to raise them in hind sight. I make the best decision I can at the time and then clean up the mess if I'm wrong. Parenting is a learn as you go game. For some reason, parents can't accept that today. My parents didn't stress over our grades or over our accomplishments beyond making sure we met the minimum acceptable level if we could. They didn't drive around in cars with bumper stickers that said "My child is an honor student at ________________school".
If I had a dollar for every time I've heard "my child needs something different", I could go out to a really nice restaurant for dinner. Of course said parent can't actually define different. It's just not what I'm doing.
Seriously, one of the best things kids can learn in school is how to adapt. How to figure out how to get what they need to suceed. How to not sit there like a vegetable waiting for someone to show you exactly what to do. Kids can't think today and they can't think because they've been molly coddled from birth by helicopter moms who are micromanaging every second of their days because they might be seen as a bad mom.
I'm a really bad mom. I let my kids fall down, I let them fail and I tell them to fix their own problems. They are not on this earth to stroke my mommy ego, rather, I'm here to make sure they grow up to be functional adults and that takes some knee scrapes and dealing with unfairness in life. Sometimes life is just unfair, so deal with it.
Parents, today, don't know how to be parents. They don't seem to realize that putting kids first does not mean catering to their whims and micromanaging their lives. When I was a kid, my mom kicked us out of the house in the morning and told us to come home when the street lights were on. We did not run home with every little issue. We learned how to deal with things on our own.
When I was a kid, I was expected to make good decisions, I was expected to clean up my messes, I was expected to respect my elders, I was expected to do what I had to to succeed in school....my parents didn't blame the teacher or the system or the author of the book if I failed, they blamed ME as they should have. I failed to do what I needed to do to succeed. I am so glad they raised me that way.
Call me a bad mom if you will but my kids will be able to run circles around your honor student. My 13 year old can think better than 80% of my 11th grade students!!! She can do that because I don't fix things for her. I really don't care what you think about how I raise her. I didn't have kids to earn your acceptance so you can stuff your opinon of how I raise mine.
Oh, come on Ivory, you're always talking about that special snowflake kid, but there are just as many people out there just like you and we're not teachers. My kids fall down, screw up and figure it out too.
I personally get along very well with the teachers and administrators at my son's school and I work for a local library.
Parents want control. They want schools to cater to their special little snowflake. The problem is the entire school is full of special little snowflakes. The idea that kids should take responsibility and be the ones to adapt is unacceptable. It is, clearly, the teacher's responsibility to make a student learn. After all, there's nothing to individualizing the educations of 30+ kids in one classroom.
Parenting has become a competitive sport. The proof you're a good parents is seen in grades and how advanced your child is. Parents are threatened by anyone who doesn't acknowledge that their child is superior or otherwise special. If the child is not advanced, there must be an explanation or someone to blame. Hence the 4 fold increase in diagnoses of ADD/ADHD and autism. They cannot accept that our kids are who they are and that parents are not perfect.
20/20 hind sight, there are things I would have done differently with my kids but I don't get the chance to raise them in hind sight. I make the best decision I can at the time and then clean up the mess if I'm wrong. Parenting is a learn as you go game. For some reason, parents can't accept that today. My parents didn't stress over our grades or over our accomplishments beyond making sure we met the minimum acceptable level if we could. They didn't drive around in cars with bumper stickers that said "My child is an honor student at ________________school".
If I had a dollar for every time I've heard "my child needs something different", I could go out to a really nice restaurant for dinner. Of course said parent can't actually define different. It's just not what I'm doing.
Seriously, one of the best things kids can learn in school is how to adapt. How to figure out how to get what they need to suceed. How to not sit there like a vegetable waiting for someone to show you exactly what to do. Kids can't think today and they can't think because they've been molly coddled from birth by helicopter moms who are micromanaging every second of their days because they might be seen as a bad mom.
I'm a really bad mom. I let my kids fall down, I let them fail and I tell them to fix their own problems. They are not on this earth to stroke my mommy ego, rather, I'm here to make sure they grow up to be functional adults and that takes some knee scrapes and dealing with unfairness in life. Sometimes life is just unfair, so deal with it.
Parents, today, don't know how to be parents. They don't seem to realize that putting kids first does not mean catering to their whims and micromanaging their lives. When I was a kid, my mom kicked us out of the house in the morning and told us to come home when the street lights were on. We did not run home with every little issue. We learned how to deal with things on our own.
When I was a kid, I was expected to make good decisions, I was expected to clean up my messes, I was expected to respect my elders, I was expected to do what I had to to succeed in school....my parents didn't blame the teacher or the system or the author of the book if I failed, they blamed ME as they should have. I failed to do what I needed to do to succeed. I am so glad they raised me that way.
Call me a bad mom if you will but my kids will be able to run circles around your honor student. My 13 year old can think better than 80% of my 11th grade students!!! She can do that because I don't fix things for her. I really don't care what you think about how I raise her. I didn't have kids to earn your acceptance so you can stuff your opinon of how I raise mine.
Teachers teach, parents parent. That would be fantastic if that could really happen.
Many parents are working two jobs just to stay afloat and many of those I've talked to, (and I'm aware it certainly cannot be a representative sample) realize they are the #1 important factor in the child's education. I'm not hearing blame from the parents I speak to, (and I'm not trying to blame). What I hear is concern about what is going on in the school system itself. I hear parents expect the children to receive an education while in school. They are there to learn. Schools were meant to teach. Correct?
It's a complex problem. (Btw, I live in the same city as you do.) The kids I work with who have highly involved parents? They succeed regardless of income level, background, lack of English upon entering school. The who don't? It's much more hit or miss. I really don't *blame* anyone for this problem, parents, teachers, school or otherwise. It's an impossible situation at times. Some families do have 2 parents (if they're lucky) working 3 minimum wage jobs between them and they are working harder than anyone else in town just to keep minimally afloat. No one can accuse them of not trying hard enough, because they are. But when the school can only do so much and the parent can only do so much? A wayward child who doesn't want to be there and doesn't want to do anything can find a way through the cracks. Not every child wants to be in school and wants to learn.
We can get their butt in the seat. We can offer them language services, extra help, mentors... we can hold them in during lunch to finish homework, try to keep them after school and bus them home. But after the bell rings at the end of the day, there is little more the school can do. It's not uncommon that this kid goes home and there's not an adult there to make them study, or make them get to bed on time, or make them get up and go to school on time the next day. It's tough. I don't blame the parent because they're probably out scrubbing toilets until 2 AM on their second job. But nor can I blame the school for this either. It's a complex situation without an obvious solution.
Again, I can only speak to what I see. I see materials are not an issue. Also, I'm not sure exactly what they are doing to feel like social workers or substitute parents. Maybe you could expound on that. I suppose they are feeling like overpaid babysitters? If that is true why aren't they teaching? What are they doing to be babysitters? What is consigning them to that role?
Administrators who refuse to do anything about behavior problems (in some schools) is a big one. Classes that are too large with too many children who need extra help to really be successful is another one. Teachers can and do work to provide that extra help, but the larger the class, the less they can do that and still get through the material. If you stick a teacher in a room with 30+ kids, 5 of whom don't speak English, 10 of whom are in Special Ed or have other accommodations that need extra attention, and 5 who are just plain hard to handle, it's going to be hard for anyone to teach that class effectively. All the little stuff slows you down. Materials are not usually the issue, but staffing is and it's all tied to money. Money for staffing gets class size down. I am a good teacher, but I am only human. If you put me in a room with 35 kids and a high number that need extra assistance (like in the poor parts of town, special ed, English language learners), I will try my best, but when it's one of me versus 35 of them, there is only so much I can do. If we want extra help for these kids, we have to pay for it and get aides into the room, or get fewer kids per class.
Unfortunately, none of us want our taxes any higher. All of us can look at the school system and say this or that seems wasteful. The teachers often seem to get blamed first, but really, they have the least amount of control in the equation. Parents far outnumber teachers and carry a much louder voice. Wasteful spending needs to be cut, class sizes reduced and those who oppose voted out of office. Yet, a pathetically low percentage of the public comes out to vote for the "small" elections like school board, even for the state reps and senators that make many of the decisions.
Last time I checked we still were paying taxes. I would need to hear what you mean about "doing education right". What I get from your post is it's the parents fault and I don't completely believe that. What is it the school system expects? Do they expect perfect little children before they can teach?
No, perfect children will never happen any more than perfect parents or perfect teachers. We are all flawed, no matter what role we play in this. At the same time, it is becoming a societal shift for some to abdicate responsibility for their behavior and that's bleeding into how some parent. I'm not blaming parents by any means. There are problems on all sides of this equation, but I think some are too quick to point fingers instead of accepting that they have some ability to work on their piece.
I think the "us vs them" ultimately stems from all the "reports" that students aren't learning in American schools. Once the public started to believe that, it made it easy for the govt to enact "reform" (NCLB, for example). Oh, the touchy feelie "everyone's a winner" and "everyone is entitled" attitude that permeates society these days doesn't help.
My just turned 5 year old isn't reading yet. Her pre-k teacher could assume I must not be reading to her at home. I could assume her teacher isn't teaching or that daughter has a disability. The reality is that everyone is doing what they are supposed to be doing, and my daughter just isn't yet ready to learn. But now we have politicians telling us that she must be reading by next year. Or Else. So the pressure of that pits parents and teachers against each other, when they really should be coming together to work through an impossible situation.
I don't think many people fall into the "us" versus "them" camp. The parents out there who consider schools and teachers enemies as the default option are obviously furthering problems, as are, I think, teachers like Ivory who often engages in parent-bashing (on this forum, at least) and seems to feel that she is a special snowflake among parents. Overall, though, I agree with Eresh that political pressures and all these sky-is-falling reports have convinced many people that today's schools are terrible and that (a) teachers, or (b) parents should be blamed, with no middle ground. (and little to no finger pointing at any other players, including the politicians themselves.)
At a specific school level, the issues are far more unique, as the needs, issues, policies, and overall culture of individual schools varies so much. Schools in this country vary so drastically by state and district, and even within each district, so there is no one-size-fits-all experience.
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