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View Poll Results: Given two choices, which would you rather choose?
Option 1: The school year should begin in late September and end in early May 28 49.12%
Option 2: The school year should begin in the second week of August and last until the last week of June 29 50.88%
Voters: 57. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 08-16-2011, 02:16 PM
 
9,856 posts, read 13,028,982 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nana053 View Post
My ds had multivariable calc, ap chemistry, ap physics (combined into chem/phys), ap biology all in his high school in the late 1980s. He has no problem keeping up with foreign workers and he is a chemical engineer with a masters degree. In college he did a double major in chem E and systems science with a minor in economics and got out in 4 years not 5. I don't think he is average with respect to any coworkers either American or foreign, but that's because his passion is for science and math.

When I was growing up, we did not have full day K. I managed to get a masters in mathematics and I did not even take Calc until college.

We are in too much of a rush to push academics on kids who are not ready for them. Early is not the same as good.

Almost every school in countries that beat us out does LESS in actual topics, but goes into more depth. That is what we should be doing. Also almost every country that beats us has a national curriculum. We should be doing this as well. A course in Algebra I should not vary from district to district or from state to state. A course in physics should cover the same topics in each school that offers it. As it is now, our mobile population gets short-changed because this is not true.

I agree that we need to raise our kids to actually value learning and to get the esteem that comes from doing difficult subjects well. Part of the problem is the fact that we never allow our kids to do even the physical things they should be doing on their own without hovering to make sure they don't fall. If we keep them in schools, teachers will have to hover because the lawsuits that happen when kids do get hurt are ridiculous. Kids need to learn to be risk takers and more is learned out of school than in school about this.
With all due respect, I disagree. We are an information based society today. The average Amercan needs to be able to keep up academically. We are a society of office workers, all of whom must be educated beyond what was acceptable back when American society was based on manufacturing. Times have changed. This is not 1985 any more. Foreign countries are much more rigorous today than they were 25 years ago. The amount of material needed to be adequate is much more today than it was 25 years ago. We need to adjust our schedules for the changing nature of American society. What was considered an 'academic' job 25 years ago (such as computer programming) is something any given person must be able to do today, if we have any hope of keeping up with the rest of the world.
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Old 08-16-2011, 02:50 PM
 
Location: Brooklyn New York
15,237 posts, read 23,800,738 times
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It is a pain in the butt that school has to start the second after labor day, couldnt it be a week later....it is tough on us parents as well.
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Old 08-16-2011, 03:11 PM
 
15,308 posts, read 16,874,788 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by North Beach Person View Post
Any state that has accepted Race To The Top money from the feds (and almost all have) has had to agree to to create and follow a common curriculum called Common Core State Standards that will be interchangable betwen the states. Essentially a national curriculum.
Cool. I am glad that finally came through. One of my biggest complaints for kids was those who transferred during a school year or even at the end of one year were getting different courses in different places.
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Old 08-16-2011, 03:23 PM
 
20,793 posts, read 52,443,863 times
Reputation: 10476
Quote:
Originally Posted by nana053 View Post
My ds had multivariable calc, ap chemistry, ap physics (combined into chem/phys), ap biology all in his high school in the late 1980s. He has no problem keeping up with foreign workers and he is a chemical engineer with a masters degree. In college he did a double major in chem E and systems science with a minor in economics and got out in 4 years not 5. I don't think he is average with respect to any coworkers either American or foreign, but that's because his passion is for science and math.

When I was growing up, we did not have full day K. I managed to get a masters in mathematics and I did not even take Calc until college.

We are in too much of a rush to push academics on kids who are not ready for them. Early is not the same as good.

Almost every school in countries that beat us out does LESS in actual topics, but goes into more depth. That is what we should be doing. Also almost every country that beats us has a national curriculum. We should be doing this as well. A course in Algebra I should not vary from district to district or from state to state. A course in physics should cover the same topics in each school that offers it. As it is now, our mobile population gets short-changed because this is not true.

I agree that we need to raise our kids to actually value learning and to get the esteem that comes from doing difficult subjects well. Part of the problem is the fact that we never allow our kids to do even the physical things they should be doing on their own without hovering to make sure they don't fall. If we keep them in schools, teachers will have to hover because the lawsuits that happen when kids do get hurt are ridiculous. Kids need to learn to be risk takers and more is learned out of school than in school about this.
Now, ask your son to ask his co-workers how many kids they had in their classes that were developmentally disabled along the way and what their schools did with kids that didn't want to be there.....
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Old 08-16-2011, 03:56 PM
 
Location: North Beach, MD on the Chesapeake
32,175 posts, read 39,280,307 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nana053 View Post
Cool. I am glad that finally came through. One of my biggest complaints for kids was those who transferred during a school year or even at the end of one year were getting different courses in different places.

In MD there will eventually be exit exams, that's a requirement of Race To The Top. What will be interesting will be when the school systems offer the various courses, school systems will still supposedly be able to determine the order of courses. That will have the most impact in Science and Social Studies.

In MD 50% of a teacher's evaluation will be based on those test scores. That's going to be implemented next year and the infighting to get all Honors and AP classes has already started.

I'm interested to see how that will impact me, and no one can answer it, since I teach electives that aren't part of the Core.

Before everyone gets too excited most of it is just a name/terminology/vocabulary change and not really a curriculum change.
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Old 08-16-2011, 05:13 PM
 
5,210 posts, read 8,819,762 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sherrenee View Post
I started school at 7 am. I don't require a lot of sleep on average I get between 5-6 hours now and that has been pretty consistent since I was a teenager. My parents expected a lot from me, and I was able to function just fine with those high expectations. Falling asleep or getting in trouble in school (for any reason) were not options in my parents’ house. Getting less than A's and B's (I did get a C in geometry even after tutoring...I just never got it) was not an option. The only reason getting a C in that class was accepted was due to the fact that they could see how hard I was working even with tutoring and still not comprehending it (apparently you need to be somewhat of a visual person to get geometry).

I was in SADD, DECA, Choir, FBLA and still managed to fit a social life in there too. It can be done.

I am very thankful that I had parents with tough expectations; it helped prepare me for the real world. Soon after I graduated (at 18) I moved out, got a job worked my rear off in banking rose to become a branch manager at 25, got married at 20.
It sounds as though you've done o.k. for yourself.

During the school year, you were able to go to school full time, participate in activities, earn a high GPA, work 20 hrs/wk, help out with chores and have a social life too.

Then during the summer months you were able to double your work hours as well as your income.

You could not have earned that additional income if you had been in school year round.
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Old 08-16-2011, 07:04 PM
 
Location: Virginia
7,895 posts, read 12,165,165 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nightcrawler View Post
It is a pain in the butt that school has to start the second after labor day, couldnt it be a week later....it is tough on us parents as well.
How so?
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Old 08-16-2011, 10:47 PM
 
2,920 posts, read 2,913,231 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorytickler View Post
While I like this, it will never float. It will play havoc on sports schedules and day care and you'd never get the breaks to align with major holidays that parents want their kids off for.

Anyone who thinks the school schedule is planned the way it is because it's good for education is a fool. It's planned so people have vacation time and major holidays off. I'd settle just for increasing to a 200 day school year. An increase of 20 days per year is the equivalent of two extra years of school by the time a student graduates!!!
I don't get this math.

13 years x 20 days/year = 260 days.

1 current school year = 180 days.
180 days/year x 2 extra years = 360 days.

360 =/= 260.

Let me know if I'm wrong. But it seems that if we added 20 days per year for 13 years, that would be the equivalent of adding 1.38 years by graduation. It's a significant increase, but not very near an extra two years.

It's late, and I'm tired, so I may have come at this all wrong. If you're just being hyperbolic, then I'm just too tired to catch it. Can't help it--I'm a math nerd. If I didn't post, I'd be doing the problems in my sleep!
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Old 08-16-2011, 11:44 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles, Ca
2,884 posts, read 5,044,357 times
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To the person that left a comment, I've known the system isn't logical. The agrarian calendar isn't logical. It doesn't particularly benefit smart students or the slowest.

-I think you need to make a *Major* dividing line in the 5th, 6th, 7th grades. Like Moses parting the Red sea (just a figure of speech, nothing religous meant from it).

You need smart/advanced students - Over here.

You need average, slow, remedial students - Over here. They should be as seperate as train tracks that split from each other.

Like math. Average students can be overwhelmed with it. Slow it down. Don't turn a B student in math in the 5th grade, into a D by the 7th or 8th grade. Maybe a year round schedule here.

Some kids can probably do the work in 4 months, instead of 6. Others need 8 or 9. The school year should be longer or shorter based on ability. Let the smart kids do something else. Let them work on career skills. Public speaking would be better for 2 months, than sitting in a math class you've already passed. Letting the smart kids sit in class doesn't serve anybody.

Let teachers focus on the 20 out of 30 kids in a class who need help, the other 10 are doing something else.

-I also would start it later in the day than 7 or 8. 7 am is crazy. Why isn't there any logic to the schedule? The work day starts at 9 or 10. Start school at 9. Why should you have a bunch of sleepy kids all year?

How about starting the slowest kids at 10? Why are slow/remedial students asked to go to school so early?

-I would base a school year around logic. I remember in highschool, the classes that started at 8. No one was awake. What's the point? 9 or 9:30 is a good starting time. Math esp I wouldn't start early.

The schedule should be much more dynamic than everything starting on the hour. That's not the way peoples biological/internal clocks tick.
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Old 08-17-2011, 02:50 AM
 
Location: We_tside PNW (Columbia Gorge) / CO / SA TX / Thailand
20,842 posts, read 37,540,192 times
Reputation: 20908
Yeah, length of school year has very little to NOTHING to do with Educational content / results. Kids / programs / teachers / administrators are all different and unique situations / circumstances can dramatically skew results.

Dairy Farm Boarding School is a good alternative. 4AM - 10 pm 7 days a week. My grandfather took 3 days vacation between age 14 and 95. Worked well for me too.

Very little time to get into trouble. When 7:30 AM finally rolls around (after working since 4 AM), you are more than ready to go to school, even if you do stink! No worries about afterschool sports or programs... not till AFTER the cows are milked and chores done... maybe time to do homework between 9-10pm (If you don't mind going without supper and a shower)
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