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Old 09-08-2011, 07:29 AM
 
Location: New Mexico
8,179 posts, read 4,564,143 times
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Default Who is responsible to motivate american children to study?

It's a 3 way partnership.

Parents should take the lead in holding a certain level of expectation for their children. Most people will work to the level of expectation that's made clear to them.

Teachers need to lead in the classroom. Set the bar, make sure students understand how to clear the bar, and monitor their performance in trying to reach it.

Students are ultimately responsible for themselves, though. I've been teaching long enough to be familiar with cases where the teacher and parents were holding up their end of the bargain, but the student simply had decided to fail.

Everyone reading this needs to understand that it's difficult to fail any HS course. The level of apathy required is appalling. But some kids decide to fail and nothing can keep them from achieving that "goal." Part of teenage rebellion, I suppose.
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Old 09-08-2011, 06:37 PM
 
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About the Asian stereotypical student being more studious and better at math & science: That is mainly true for educated Asian families, especially Chinese/Indian families who came to the US on H1 visas. It's also true for traditional Asian families who immigrated to the US and brought with them a desire to achieve success through education and hard work.

But what I'm seeing now is that there's a generation of Asians who were born in the US 35 years ago, gave birth to children in the US, and whose children have become Americanized, is that younger generations of Asian-Americans are as lazy and dim-witted as anyone.
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Old 09-08-2011, 06:57 PM
Status: "Humming "Suicide is painless"" (set 12 days ago)
 
Location: Whoville....
21,239 posts, read 15,037,369 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by josh u View Post
About the Asian stereotypical student being more studious and better at math & science: That is mainly true for educated Asian families, especially Chinese/Indian families who came to the US on H1 visas. It's also true for traditional Asian families who immigrated to the US and brought with them a desire to achieve success through education and hard work.

But what I'm seeing now is that there's a generation of Asians who were born in the US 35 years ago, gave birth to children in the US, and whose children have become Americanized, is that younger generations of Asian-Americans are as lazy and dim-witted as anyone.
We seem to have a bad influence on everyone. We are doing something very wrong yet we keep thinking that we can do it our way. We are so past time to start emmulating the countries that teach well. You know, places where they actually, gasp, RESPECT teachers....and students take responsibility for their own learning.
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Old 09-08-2011, 07:00 PM
Status: "Humming "Suicide is painless"" (set 12 days ago)
 
Location: Whoville....
21,239 posts, read 15,037,369 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skoro View Post
It's a 3 way partnership.

Parents should take the lead in holding a certain level of expectation for their children. Most people will work to the level of expectation that's made clear to them.

Teachers need to lead in the classroom. Set the bar, make sure students understand how to clear the bar, and monitor their performance in trying to reach it.

Students are ultimately responsible for themselves, though. I've been teaching long enough to be familiar with cases where the teacher and parents were holding up their end of the bargain, but the student simply had decided to fail.

Everyone reading this needs to understand that it's difficult to fail any HS course. The level of apathy required is appalling. But some kids decide to fail and nothing can keep them from achieving that "goal." Part of teenage rebellion, I suppose.
This is what blows my mind about complaints about not offering a different curriculum for the non college bound. It's so EASY to pass. It, really, only takes minimal effort. Yet, it's everyone elses fault when a student fails.

I had a hand full of kids last year who did nothing. My administrators were asking me what my intervention plan was . How do you plan interventions for a student who doesn't try? Who sleeps in class? Who reads books while you lecture? Who texts friends during class and then accuses you of putting things on the test you never taught?
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Old 09-08-2011, 09:10 PM
 
Location: El Dorado Hills, CA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zthatzmanz28 View Post
It takes a WHOLE village...
It's funny you should say that. We recently received a letter from a dear friend commending us on raising our daughter who just got married. His view is "it takes a village" is that is complete and total horse crap. It takes PARENTS to raise a child. The time, effort, discipline, love, attention, and sacrifice that parents give their children is what raises them and shapes their world. Depending on teachers or "the village" to motivate their children to become educated is shirking the responsibility of being a parent, and trying to move blame onto someone else.
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Old 09-08-2011, 09:58 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NinaN View Post
Depending on teachers or "the village" to motivate their children to become educated is shirking the responsibility of being a parent, and trying to move blame onto someone else.
Too bad you and everyone else singing this song severely misunderstand the meaning of this proverb. In fact this saying originated in a culture that actually had villages. America never had that.

When those people say "it takes a village" they don't mean that they expect the parents to pass their parental responsibilities onto someone else like a hot potato. This is what Americans read into it within the context of their historically exceptional culture.
Except that this is not IT. Nice try but - not it.

The saying implies that the children will have other influences in their lives IN ADDITION to that of the parents. As long as people live in "villages" - and not in "little houses on the prairie", then yes, the village will be around, whether the parents like it or not. Then it is up to the "village" to complement what the parents do and to contribute in positive ways to the raising of good "villagers". This is what true, organic community means.
The alternative would be exposing children to bad village influences - so you want to make sure your village is good and supportive and in sync with your values, so it will not mess up all your good parental work.

"It takes a village" means that people belong to a community. Community for a child starts with parents - but it will NOT stop there (unless, again, you move to the prairie).
Now...I know many Americans still have the "little house on the prairie" syndrome in their blood, but life has changed quite a lot here since those "little houses" too - and like it or not, there's hardly any place left to isolate yourself in. As such, you want to make sure the village that WILL affect the trajectory of your child's life - with or without your will - is the right kind of village.

That's what "it takes a village" means in the context of what we deal with today.
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Old 09-09-2011, 05:52 AM
 
Location: New Mexico
8,179 posts, read 4,564,143 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorytickler View Post
This is what blows my mind about complaints about not offering a different curriculum for the non college bound. It's so EASY to pass. It, really, only takes minimal effort. Yet, it's everyone elses fault when a student fails.
Nuts, isn't it?

Quote:
I had a hand full of kids last year who did nothing.
I think we all do, every year. As we used to say way back in my USMC days, "You've always got that 10%..."

It's as true in education as it was in the military.

Quote:
My administrators were asking me what my intervention plan was . How do you plan interventions for a student who doesn't try? Who sleeps in class? Who reads books while you lecture? Who texts friends during class and then accuses you of putting things on the test you never taught?
Administrators have by and large become intimidated and emasculated. They spend too much time in CYA activities and too little in managing.
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Old 09-09-2011, 06:16 AM
 
Location: Nebraska
4,179 posts, read 5,244,934 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by formercalifornian View Post
The creative impulse, which requires work to fulfill, is inherent to human experience; however, we humans often disagree about what kind of work should be rewarded. When I hear a parent or teacher complain about a child being lazy, it's most likely a mismatch of priorities, not a lack of motivation.

As an example, I have a very good friend whose daughter failed Algebra last year, which was obviously very disappointing to her parents. Her mother expressed her frustration about the daughter's "laziness" shortly after sharing a story about the child, who is a very talented singer, spending several days carefully preparing to audition for a prestigious youth choir. Clearly, this child is not unmotivated; she and her parents simply have different priorities.

So, whose job is it to motivate children? I don't think there's a simple answer to that question, but ultimately I believe motivation comes from the child himself. When they want it, they'll do it.
LOL I failed Algebra in HS, too. Math was my failing. I went on to become a speechwriter, campaign manager, newspaper reporter and political columnist. As a volunteer firefighter, I learned algebra by application; i.e., water pressure loss. As a community developer, I learned the applicable algebraic equations for number of taxpayers x $X = infrastructure costs, and could tell if a development project was good or bad based on those equations. I could always get the word problems right, but when faced with a pure formula to solve, I simply - went blank.

Some people can memorize scads of formulae but not apply them in real-world situations; others can only learn by doing. Ultimately it is the parent who motivates the child; a parent who insists that their child must follow a pre-determined path and who are disappointed when they 'fail' are parents who set that child up for failure. My dad wasn't happy when I failed algebra, "You're going to need that someday" he said. Then he went on to encourage me to develop my writing and cognitive thinking skills. He taught me to ignore those teachers who said, "But you have such a high IQ, you could do anything, you're just lazy!" and follow my own path. Dad was right and they were wrong. Sadly, most parents don't/won't/can't do this.
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Old 09-09-2011, 06:45 AM
 
3,378 posts, read 4,104,785 times
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As a parent I am responsible for motivating my children. In so doing, I am responsible to ensure that their education in and out of the classroom meets my expectations - that includes holding educators accountable. However, at some point - and gradually - these children need to self motivate and I need to course correct if I don't see it happening. My children know I am pretty lax and flexible in all areas - except one - education. Period.
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Old 09-09-2011, 09:52 AM
 
Location: Middle America
16,358 posts, read 12,962,901 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mightyqueen801 View Post
My newspaper is delivered by an elderly couple in a car. The paper is always late, and they walk a few steps up the sidewalk and then just wing it, often beheading my flowers.

I won't complain because there is no way these people are doing this except that they desperately needed the money. But I wish kids had paper routes again.
When I worked for a newspaper, as the economy worsened, the traditionally "kid" jobs, including newspaper delivery became increasingly the domain of adults who had lost their previous jobs. In the small towns I was in at the time, it was difficult for teens to get jobs that had previously been available to them (newspaper delivery, cashiering, fast food), because those jobs were instead going to adults who had been laid off elsewhere.
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