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Old 09-16-2011, 08:33 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
I said they did assessments. It's not a written test per se. Assessments can be done on very young kids. Pediatricians do it on infants and toddlers.
I understood that. My son's school has definitely been doing assessments since the beginning of the year.

But a standardized test like Cogat, which justnice insists her daughter took just a couple of weeks after K started? Those tests involve a teacher reading instructions and questions out loud; they end up telling you exactly where your kid stacks up.

I am not sure this is appropriate or useful for K.
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Old 09-16-2011, 11:49 PM
 
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But a standardized test like Cogat, which justnice insists her daughter took just a couple of weeks after K started?

I said each kid is individually tested in reading, math and vocabulary. It is done by the classroom teacher and other specialists within the school. They want to know how advanced the kids are academically, and to find ways to challange them. No one, not the teacher nor the parents, want a child in the classroom to be bored. The state testing done on the computer does not start until second grade. My child came into K already knowing how to read well, and so did another classmate. There were also kids, for verious reasons, that barely new the alphabet. Should she have stayed in her class listening to the teacher repeat the alphabet over and over to the other kids and be bored to death, or should she be moved to a spinout advanced class where the reading specialist will challenge her by having her read books more to her level?
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Old 09-17-2011, 01:16 AM
 
Location: 60630
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In the end all these advanced kids and thee less advanced once ends up on the samee levelvel
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Old 09-17-2011, 07:26 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glass_of_merlot View Post
In the end all these advanced kids and thee less advanced once ends up on the same levell
No, they don't. The kids who are gifted, not coached, who are given the opportunity to study at their own level stay advanced.

The kids who are advanced because parents work with them may level out. Truly gifted kids, however, don't. Example, Evanston high school when my son went their had kids who were taking high school math (geometry) in 7th grade. Those kids were the ones who set the curve on the final exam. The 10th graders who took honors geometry were always behind them even though they did reasonably well.
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Old 09-17-2011, 09:19 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glass_of_merlot View Post
In the end all these advanced kids and thee less advanced once ends up on the samee levelvel
Tell that to my friends who are parents of children who grew up to become a theoretical physicist, a molecular biologist, and a Microsoft software developer. They all had to put their children in private school due to the teachers insisting on your point that they would end up on the same level as everyone else.

The physicist was not allowed to study his algebra in the fifth grade until after he had finished his grade-level math. As the deep but slow type, this caused a major problem. After winning the national Calculus prize and representing the US internationally, he graduated from Columbia with degrees in math and theoretical physics. He is now 22 years old and has just been accepted to work at Cambridge with Stephen Hawking, although he had already accepted another position, so that will have to wait a year.

The Microsoft engineer made a perfect score on the ACT at 13, but his parents wanted him to spend another year at home before college, so he waited until 14 to begin his Ph. D. studies at Carnegie Mellon. He is now 25 or 26 years old. His little brother, the molecular biologist, is doing post-grad work at Yale at the age of 20.

I don't see where they have leveled out with others their age.

Last edited by lhpartridge; 09-17-2011 at 09:25 AM.. Reason: correction
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Old 09-17-2011, 08:00 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lhpartridge View Post
Tell that to my friends who are parents of children who grew up to become a theoretical physicist, a molecular biologist, and a Microsoft software developer. They all had to put their children in private school due to the teachers insisting on your point that they would end up on the same level as everyone else.

The physicist was not allowed to study his algebra in the fifth grade until after he had finished his grade-level math. As the deep but slow type, this caused a major problem. After winning the national Calculus prize and representing the US internationally, he graduated from Columbia with degrees in math and theoretical physics. He is now 22 years old and has just been accepted to work at Cambridge with Stephen Hawking, although he had already accepted another position, so that will have to wait a year.

The Microsoft engineer made a perfect score on the ACT at 13, but his parents wanted him to spend another year at home before college, so he waited until 14 to begin his Ph. D. studies at Carnegie Mellon. He is now 25 or 26 years old. His little brother, the molecular biologist, is doing post-grad work at Yale at the age of 20.

I don't see where they have leveled out with others their age.
Thing is the examples you are giving are extremely rare and I was not even talking about such intellectually restless giants.

In the elementary school my son is going to one third of children are in the GT program. You cannot tell me that all of these kids are gifted at the level you are describing your friends' children to be.
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Old 09-17-2011, 09:39 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by syracusa View Post
Thing is the examples you are giving are extremely rare and I was not even talking about such intellectually restless giants.

In the elementary school my son is going to one third of children are in the GT program. You cannot tell me that all of these kids are gifted at the level you are describing your friends' children to be.
Not at all. Most of the kids in the program were more like our daughter--very bright and highly motivated. It was interesting that in the same small town there were three prodigies, but they were very unusual.

I was responding to another poster who said that gifted children all even out in the long run. My point is that is absolutely not true. Even the "ordinary" gifted kids that our daughter graduated with are mostly still outdoing their non-gifted peers.

As far as the decision that you are making, we had to go through the same thing. We decided to accelerate our daughter at age 4 based on who she was then and the choices that we had available. If there had been other options to choose from, we may have done things differently. As it is, everyone is happy with how things are right now. She is 22, a married homeowner and a first-year medical student with a year of published research experience. Some people would say that we pushed her, but we were trying to avoid holding her back.

Every child is different. If those three prodigies had been relegated to our public school system, they would definitely not be where they are. They had more choices because they were allowed to study at their own pace and not the district's pacing guide. I would look very carefully at how the school where you are frames its academic indicators. The more emphasis they put on being Advanced and Proficient, the more wary I would be.

For a five-year-old, I would want a balanced experience that included lots of literature, arts and music, and games. As you know, it doesn't really take very long to teach reading to children who already have a rich vocabulary and broad experience. See if your district has a Montessori program. Its waiting list may fill up fast. A year early is not too soon.
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Old 09-17-2011, 11:00 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lhpartridge View Post
The more emphasis they put on being Advanced and Proficient, the more wary I would be.
What exactly do you mean?...
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Old 09-17-2011, 11:17 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lhpartridge View Post
Tell that to my friends who are parents of children who grew up to become a theoretical physicist, a molecular biologist, and a Microsoft software developer. They all had to put their children in private school due to the teachers insisting on your point that they would end up on the same level as everyone else.

The physicist was not allowed to study his algebra in the fifth grade until after he had finished his grade-level math. As the deep but slow type, this caused a major problem. After winning the national Calculus prize and representing the US internationally, he graduated from Columbia with degrees in math and theoretical physics. He is now 22 years old and has just been accepted to work at Cambridge with Stephen Hawking, although he had already accepted another position, so that will have to wait a year.

The Microsoft engineer made a perfect score on the ACT at 13, but his parents wanted him to spend another year at home before college, so he waited until 14 to begin his Ph. D. studies at Carnegie Mellon. He is now 25 or 26 years old. His little brother, the molecular biologist, is doing post-grad work at Yale at the age of 20.

I don't see where they have leveled out with others their age.
My daughter is dating a guy whose parents "had" to put their kids in private school for the same reasons. These people as young adults are not doing anything spectacular. They are employed and two of the three have PhDs, and the other (DD's bf) a master's, but so do many people who go to public schools.
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Old 09-18-2011, 10:06 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by syracusa View Post
What exactly do you mean?...
Schools are rated not just on whether or not their students pass the mandated exams, but at what level. A lot of pressure is put on students and teachers at some schools to have the highest scores possible, which sometimes means that the students spend the vast majority of their class time in test prep activities.

I teach in a high school where students have to pass four state exams for graduation. All that is required of them is a passing score. But the school is rated on the percent of students who receive scores in the Advanced and Proficient categories, so the students are enrolled in classes that don't count for college credit in order to double-dose the required classes. In other words, they take 90 minutes of English everyday rather than every other day. This is to raise their scores, not just to a passing level but to achieve the scores that the school needs in order to show AYP. As a result, some students find it difficult to include advanced courses that they do need for college in their schedules as juniors and seniors.

In elementary schools where students are expected as a matter of course to do well on these assessments, they tend not to take time away from non-tested subjects such as art, music, science, and social studies in order to boost their scores to the highest levels. Their students still receive a well-rounded education. I would beware of any school that focuses on their students' high scores until I found out the basis for them. You have consistently indicated that you want your children to have a broad, as well as deep, education. Your school may be fine, but I would want to know from other parents as to how much time is spent on drilling for state tests.
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