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Old 01-08-2013, 03:27 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtab4994 View Post
Sounds like a good thing for young teachers to be able to get an entry-level job right out of school without having the political connections or luck required to score a public school teaching job.
Charter schools *are* public schools.
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Old 01-08-2013, 03:28 PM
 
Location: St Louis, MO
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtab4994 View Post
Wow, when did that happen?! The Wisconsin controversy was all over the news last year, now it's Michigan. Missouri somehow quietly slipped by me.
Somewhere around 80-100 years ago. Existing unions were grandfathered in (there were only two at the time, SLPS and KCMD). So, other than those two districts, no other districts can unionize. And if either of those two districts are dissolved (something the legislature has considered result for both districts), the newly formed districts cannot unionize.
Missouri is odd in that collective bargaining is still allowed even though unionization is not (so contracts are collective, but there are no dues to pay). The districts have the option of whether or not to require teachers to join the bargaining unit, and nearly all of them require it. Most states without unions also do not allow collective bargaining by teachers.
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Old 01-08-2013, 04:08 PM
 
Location: Shawnee-on-Delaware, PA
3,690 posts, read 3,286,276 times
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Originally Posted by nana053 View Post
Charter schools *are* public schools.
OMG I was talking about "regular" public schools! Tough grader you are, Nana.
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Old 01-08-2013, 04:11 PM
 
Location: Shawnee-on-Delaware, PA
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Originally Posted by marigolds6 View Post
(so contracts are collective, but there are no dues to pay).
Interesting.
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Old 01-08-2013, 05:24 PM
 
15,358 posts, read 16,945,345 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtab4994 View Post
OMG I was talking about "regular" public schools! Tough grader you are, Nana.
You said this:

"Sounds like a good thing for young teachers to be able to get an entry-level job right out of school without having the political connections or luck required to score a public school teaching job."

So I assumed you were talking about young teachers getting jobs in charter schools. Btw, you do not need to have political connections to get a job in most public schools though I suppose the *choicest* position may go to people who are connected. Young teachers get jobs in the public schools all the time, but they often are placed in difficult positions that older teachers really do not want to teach in. In fact, of course, administration often wants young new teachers because they are paid less and they can be let go since they do not have tenure.
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Old 01-08-2013, 05:33 PM
 
20,793 posts, read 52,569,279 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nana053 View Post
Charter schools *are* public schools.
Well, yes and no...most charter schools have their charter through the public school system, however they are a separate entity and can allow differing entrance criteria, meaning they don't have to take everyone like a true public school has to.
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Old 01-08-2013, 10:14 PM
 
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Originally Posted by golfgal View Post
Well, yes and no...most charter schools have their charter through the public school system, however they are a separate entity and can allow differing entrance criteria, meaning they don't have to take everyone like a true public school has to.
There are other issues at play, too, such as being able to shield their financial records from public scrutiny. Charter school supporters are often quick to clarify that charter schools are "public schools," but because of the way many of them operate, I think that's a bit of a stretch.
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Old 01-09-2013, 07:35 AM
 
Location: St Louis, MO
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clevelander17 View Post
There are other issues at play, too, such as being able to shield their financial records from public scrutiny.
That's another reason the charter schools in St Louis were being used at real estate trusts. Not only could they use public land purchasing powers, but they could shield their real estate holdings from the public (they bought private land as well). It can make an interesting system... Buy up land around an abandoned public school property. Take control of the school property and then announce a new development project there (or even convert it into a charter school). Let the land values increase slightly, then sell then the surrounding area at a decent profit, whether or not you actually develop the school property that you obtained for essentially free.


Oh, and I completely forget the biggest reason charters make huge money off real estate.

All the transactions and holdings are sales, use, and property tax free. Normally the charter company holds the land and leases it back to the schools too, so that they obtained continuing rent from the school district even if their management fees are cut.
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Old 01-09-2013, 09:21 AM
 
Location: Shawnee-on-Delaware, PA
3,690 posts, read 3,286,276 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nana053 View Post
You said this:

"Sounds like a good thing for young teachers to be able to get an entry-level job right out of school without having the political connections or luck required to score a public school teaching job."

So I assumed you were talking about young teachers getting jobs in charter schools.
Yep, that's what I said. Like most people who are not education professionals I just say "charter school" for public charter school and "public school" for non-charter public school.
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Old 01-12-2013, 01:35 AM
 
563 posts, read 658,559 times
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Originally Posted by golfgal View Post
The charter schools around here are HORRIBLE. There are a few exceptions but mainly they are full of kids who's parents can't say NO, test scores are worse then the inner city schools. I would never in a million years send my kids to a charter school. Now, our public schools rank in the top 3 nationally so that may be why.
We must live in different parts of the country, as the charter schools here in my town (San Jose) are much better not only in academics, but in enviroment as well.
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