Was Gravely Disturbed Today (schools, uniform, architecture, versus)

[The Villages Guy]

Originally Posted by BucFan

How any of this thread relates to Tampa/St Petersburg is beyond me.

That's what I was saying earlier. There is a mention of T.B. here and there, but overall it is just a bash America thread. It would be more local if it was just a bash T.B. thread, like most of them are.

[algia]

Originally Posted by roadtrip75

It's not anecdotal but it's misleading because it pretends that race is not a factor.

On the PISA tests black Americans do much better than Africans, White Americans do in line with the top European countries, and Asian Americans do in line with the top Asian countries. Our education system comes out just fine in the tests. And the net result of our education system - educated people - is also excellent. America leads the world in scientific research and technological innovation, as well as productivity and wealth creation.

The one thing that seems noticeably wrong with our education system is that it teaches its students to be ashamed of their country, their culture, and especially their ancestors, who laid the groundwork for these incredible achievements.

"White Americans" don't do the same as Europeans....matter of fact "White Americans" from Maryland don't do the same as "White Americans" from Mississippi! thanks to not having the same curriculum. When my brother brought his daughter to Atlanta back in mid 90's, she was in middle school, and he put her in the same grade, however, he soon realized that she was 2 grades above what they were studying here at the same age level, so he had to place her 2 grades above what she was in Europe to match or come close to what she was studying...I remember we were quite shocked to hear that.

OK! THIS IS where I have a big problem with the education system here.

First of all, RACE should NEVER/EVER/EVER play a role in someone's ability to get an education. In Europe (because that is where i have seen this first hand), Africans from Africa are VERY well educated, and nobody is playing a race card around them. I find it shameful that there is this disgusting culture here where they always have to be marginalized for one reason or another, and then those who "succeed" are seen as "exceptions"! ...and then here comes the sob stories....its pathetic guys really pathetic; we are in 2013. Human brains are all the same I hate to tell you with the exception of those damaged by accidents etc. In my 12 years here I found this to be one of the most outrageous things that can possibly happen in a society that calls itself: "free"! ever heard the expression: "Treat others the way you want to be treated"...well now its: "let's isolate in mansions away from cracktowns so we don't have to treat those we don't want to see the way we want to be treated"! and we peddle on this for generations after generations...

Then, it is not OK to marginalize kids in a PUBLIC SCHOOL setting. If they don't speak English, then introduce mandatory Spanish and Mandatory English for everyone...so not just those "English Speaking only" be asked to be bilingual! I think that is a bit Hypocritical.

A Public school's goal regardless of where it is located, should teach all students the same, and heavily discipline those who want to go sideways. Americans are falling behind academically mainly because they want to maintain social classes. If they were not looking to maintain that, everyone would be on par educationally with everyone else, or higher considering the resources we have available here. There is no uniformity here in a good sense, just dog eat dog mentality. THAT is dragging this nation down. Most are not looking to be well rounded, educated people, most spend many hours at work, on some sort of medication, away from their children, and children are left with after school which plays video games, and helps with homework some....not something I would call an "educational enriching " experience.

You can't complain that as a Nation we are perceived that way when children are allowed to drop out of high school! you can't be surprised that these kids know nothing...nobody is creating an interest with them, some teachers are into teaching for summer vacation purposes and not to actually EDUCATE. This has to change, and the mentality of mass complacency has to change too.

[BucFan]

Originally Posted by PriusH8r

That's what I was saying earlier. There is a mention of T.B. here and there, but overall it is just a bash America thread. It would be more local if it was just a bash T.B. thread, like most of them are.

I'm sure if this thread was in the Education Forum, someone w/ education expertise could rebut the negativity toward our younger generation and their education. Right now the comments are biased against them. Sure Jay Leno can find a few airheads that don't know much about current events - but I refuse to believe that all Americans are that stupid. I also refuse to believe that millions of foreign exchange students would come to our universities if the quality of the education being provided was inferior.

[tpajr]

Bright or dense why cant kids be what they want to be. Why do they have to be razor sharp jeopardy contestants ready to hit the buzzer when someone comes up with a topic? And why is some kid or group of kids being used as a proxy for all children? There are as many factors for why kids are smart or stupid as there are kids. Some are smart in spite of their teachers. Some get to be smart because of their teachers.

Then the racist clowns start chiming in...

So many stupid generalizations in one thread...

[DUNNDFRNT]

Originally Posted by tpajr

Bright or dense why cant kids be what they want to be. Why do they have to be razor sharp jeopardy contestants ready to hit the buzzer when someone comes up with a topic? And why is some kid or group of kids being used as a proxy for all children? There are as many factors for why kids are smart or stupid as there are kids. Some are smart in spite of their teachers. Some get to be smart because of their teachers.

Then the racist clowns start chiming in...

So many stupid generalizations in one thread...

Well that is the problem and that is how it relates to Tampa and our future job growth/employment rate. The high paying jobs, the jobs that are going to allow you to raise a family, the jobs that are going to improve this area going forward, are high tech, specialized jobs, that require education and training. Gone are the days that you can raise a family with the salary of a janitor or cafeteria worker, in the decades past you could have that type of job and do ok, but with the minimum wage not being a livable wage, the current anti-labor climate thats is just not the same going forward.

[DUNNDFRNT]

Originally Posted by EngGirl

Advanced degree here in the US is way off compare to advanced degrees in other countries.
Other countries have wider education that involves many different classes.

I have advanced degree from my home country and have one from here, so I can really compare 2 education systems.

Of course there are many gaps and it’s hard to compare apples to oranges, but I will just give you an example. For my first degree in my home country I had no option what classes I can take. There was a list with all general education classes and EACH student HAD to take all these classes. Period. When I moved here and went to college for another degree I saw a curriculum with the list of classes and each student could pick only 1-2 classes from each group of classes. So, I already took all classes listed in curriculum here. I think I have wider knowledge in general than average American student who took maybe 25% of these classes if not less.


I am not trying to be rude or offense anyone here. This is what it is. Unfortunately for my children. I see the advantage of taking many classes, not just two. I cannot change system here, but I can make sure my kids will be learning something on top of standard curriculum. And I will do my best at home to educate them. For some people here it’s not a big deal if their kids think Africa is the name of another country. For me personally it’s very insulting.

I am vert sorry if I offended anyone here… I truly didn’t mean to.

There are stark differences, when i was doing my engineering undergrad, as an American student, I had access to labs, hand-on practices, and internships, that people in other countries did not, sure may be a European student took 2 more advance math classes than I was required to, but that's hardly a fair trade-off.

[EngGirl]

Originally Posted by DUNNDFRNT

There are stark differences, when i was doing my engineering undergrad, as an American student, I had access to labs, hand-on practices, and internships, that people in other countries did not, sure may be a European student took 2 more advance math classes than I was required to, but that's hardly a fair trade-off.

You are missing the point and actually support my last post. Here in the US engineering students are good at sciences like math and physics, and have deeper and narrow knowledge based on these classes and little or no knowledge about other classes like world history, geography, psychology, ect...

I am talking in general because some students here took few of these classes and some decided to stick with “easy fly” classes … they had a choice. In my home country I had no choice - everyone had to take all general education classes no matter what. And I think it's good because in my home country I never came across anyone who didn't know where certain country is located, but here most people I interact with on daily basis making huge eyes when I answer their question where I came from. These people didn’t even know my country exists!!! Of course not all people that uneducated, but many and many are… and it’s sad.

US education system in colleges build base on narrow “directions”. If you are an engineering student, you don’t need to take music/history/biology class. And if you are a music department student, you don’t need to take math/physics/chemistry… Again, I am just trying to explain myself.

Since you were in engineering school here, you probably know about great turn out rate. Many students are dropping out and changing their majors from engineering to something else. Do you know why? My guess is these students have little or no background on science since they choose other classes at school and let say Statics looks like foreign language to them. (In my Statics class here less than 50% students made it till last week of classes).

[EngGirl]

Oh, and yes, I will give a big + for facilities here... labs and equipment.
but still... Go to USF engineering labs and you can count American instructors without using calculator

[roadtrip75]

Originally Posted by DUNNDFRNT

Did you happen to look at those results by income level, single parent families, any other kind of socio-economic indicators.

Socio-economic status is determined primarily by intelligence. These are not independent variables.

That said, the achievement gap between the races is virtually the same at any socioeconomic level.




Also, see the chart on the second page here: link

In 2008, black students from families with incomes more than $200,000 scored lower on the SAT than did white students from families earning between $20,000 to $40,000.

[roadtrip75]

Originally Posted by algia

Human brains are all the same I hate to tell you with the exception of those damaged by accidents etc.

A huge chunk of Americans don't believe in evolution at all. The American elite relentlessly mock those disbelievers. Simultaneously, the elite insist that evolution is a process that applies to every plant and animal on the planet ... except for humans. When any plant or animal species is isolated for tens of thousands of years, it evolves into a different species from its ancestors. A quick look around the world shows that humans are not exempt from this process.