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It's like college. They have to learn to budget their time and have some discipline, or they won't make it through their first year of college. Starman made the best post of the thread, IMO. He cares about his students, so he assignes homework. Plus, for science, math, and language classes, there's no way around it. The students need an opportunity to test their skills and find out if they really learned the concepts or not. That's what homework is for--to test their ability to absorb the material of the day, and to reinforce their skills before moving on to a more difficult concept.
Except it's really not like college at all. When I was in college, I had a handful of classes sprinkled throughout the day. Plenty of time in between to do any homework that was assigned, or studying that was required. I could have worked a part time job in the evenings if I wanted to (I didn't have to in my situation, though). Grade school and high school are nothing like it for most people.
The trouble is that English teachers do not want to admit that science is far more important than English Lit even though SF is literature technically speaking. LOL
Those books are better than the ones I was given. Ray Bradbury was not really a "science" fiction writer but you just have to read Fahrenheit 451 because it is such great propaganda for literature.
Second of all, I don't know where you read that, but he has taught. I don't know how many years, but I know that he taught high school.
Between 1979 - 1985 he taught one or two isolated courses per year, such as existentialism and psychology, at elite private schools. He did this on a part-time basis while he was working on his MA in Social Sciences, after receiving a BA in Interdisiplinary Studies from Brown, and towards the end while working in another undisclosed field.
You'll have to excuse me if I don't count that as experience when discussing education in the public schools.
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I disagree. Homework requires more concentration than classwork due to the need to refer to text or notes and compose new material. Inculcates discipline and critical thinking so one knows how to weigh material for later use.
First of all, this is a logical fallacy called poisoning the well. You are attempting to discredit his message (which you have not experienced) before it was even given a chance, by calling out his credentials.
Second of all, I don't know where you read that, but he has taught. I don't know how many years, but I know that he taught high school.
Researchers in the field of educational psychology (such as Alfie Kohn) do have real-world experience. Their research is based on real things that actually happen, how people respond to certain things, and how people experience, reflect, and report on those things. He is not reporting his own experience, but putting forth ideas that sum up thousands of years of combined educator and social experience.
Speaking of thousands of years experience, would you believe that there are actually an abundance of teachers and parents out there who support Alfie Kohn's position(s)? It's true, once again, he is not speaking alone. Don't assume that all teachers take your position, because they don't. And many teachers will change their mind after reading what Alfie has compiled, and trying it in their own practice.
So, not only are you making this argument on a false premise (that Alfie has no teaching experience), but you are lumping him in with all these other people who have completely different views. Another way to write off the message that you haven't considered yet.
See above and above. Even teachers with 2 decades of teaching can improve their ideas and practice.
See above, and above, and above. Then maybe try reading the book and considering a different viewpoint than what you are used to and have been doing for 20 years, if you are so interested in doing the right thing.
Starman actually brings up a very valid point. I've read Kohn's work and have seen him speak, and while I can buy much of what he says, I'd prefer another voice pushing this message. I have found him to be the exemplar of the pointy-headed, ivory tower academic who fails to make a distinction between what is practiced by skilled educators vs. less skilled educators, and instead lumps all practice into the same blob. His snarkiness about it doesn't particularly help either, as he seems dismissive of the input of people in the field, relying instead on his certainty of the research. The problem he (and many others) makes is that research operates on a macro level, while teachers live in a micro-world. What's true as a whole is not necessarily true in every situation. Starman can likely point out a number of instances in which well-designed homework can be beneficial, and he* and others have plenty of real-world experience to support it. Findings in a research study do not negate this experience of people who have worked in a particular setting and have found success with practices that the research does not support.
* I'm assuming he though the username may be a Bowie reference
As a parent I love homework but don't see much coming home. I read up on what the home school parents are using and bought the necessary books, workbooks to make up the difference. My children like school much more now because they are so well prepared for class. The usually homework assignment (5th grade) is about 1 hour and (3rd grade) about 40 minutes. We knock that out and then get down to work with 2-4 hours of serious homework. My children talk about fellow students that can't master the times table (5 th grade), or can barely read and write (3rd grade). I feel sorry for those children but it's how the current education system wants to run schools.
As a parent I love homework but don't see much coming home. I read up on what the home school parents are using and bought the necessary books, workbooks to make up the difference. My children like school much more now because they are so well prepared for class. The usually homework assignment (5th grade) is about 1 hour and (3rd grade) about 40 minutes. We knock that out and then get down to work with 2-4 hours of serious homework. My children talk about fellow students that can't master the times table (5 th grade), or can barely read and write (3rd grade). I feel sorry for those children but it's how the current education system wants to run schools.
I think an hour is a lot. Up to 5 hours of homework seems like an insane amount to me. That's between a total of 11 and 12 structured hours a day based on a typical school schedule. Are they involved in any extra-curricular activities outside of school? Sports or music classes? Do they play and socialize outside of school?
Football drills, shooting free throws and batting practice are all busywork, but need to be done in order to be any good at those sports. Much homework is indeed busywork, but busywork can be good practice.
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