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They are pretty immature. I doubt they would give me good answers. I have asked some of the better classes. It really boiled down to, "be more assertive," "give clear directions," and "don't let things escalate before you do something." Most of the kids in the better classes commented about how I looked "uptight," or "needed a little more confidence."
Sounds like the students gave you pretty good advice - pretty much what people on your threads on city-data have been saying.
What have you done to try to address some of these issues?
What kinds of books were these? If they were just paper back books for literature, you could have made a game out of it saying: "I know we all love throwing books at each other, so whomever is not listening will have books thrown at them by the rest of the class." Then, just make sure they clean everything up before they leave. If they do, then that means they're mature and you can have fun with them. If they don't, then if they start again later, say, "Well I tried to be fun with you before, but you didn't clean up, so maybe another day." If they were textbooks, absolutely not though because someone could get hurt.
This is excellent advice if your goal is to get fired or even blacklisted. I hope you are just being facetious.
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When I was fresh out of college, I had no prior experience dealing with unruly kids, except briefly during student teaching, but I think they were acting out mainly out of confusion or boredom. The ones I ran into as a sub were just plain mean. They actually tried to hurt me. I remember my first day as a sub at a certain middle school. The kids started the day by throwing books at each other! Of course, I had had enough and called the office. The person they sent just stood there and told them to stop. I was hoping they would calm down afterwards, but they started right back again after he left. I called them back and chose a student who wasn't following directions and had him sent out. I was hoping the rest of the class would calm down, but they slowly got bolder and bolder until I had pretty much the same issues: talking loudly, acting out, play fighting, bullying, and generally being obnoxious. The day left me feeling totally defeated.
Looking back on that now, there were things I possibly could have done to improve things a little. For one thing, I should have listened to my cooperating teacher who said that at that school, the one where I was subbing that day, the kids pay a lot of attention to how you look and act. I didn't ignore her advice, but I didn't ask for clarification, either. During pre-student teaching, she even offered to give me some of her old clothes. I was embarrassed, so I told her no and bought my own stuff. She was pretty hard on me; she put my teaching ability, or lack thereof, on display for her students. I got really nervous and felt like I couldn't really do anything productive there, so I requested to change rooms and reported her to my supervisor and the principal of the school. She wasn't exactly thrilled about that, but at the time I felt like I was being bullied. She wasn't setting me up for success; that's for sure, but, I found out from subbing that I could have used some tough love, a lot of it actually. Had I stayed with her and suffered the humiliation and mockery I was finding myself having to endure, maybe I would have come out with a much thicker skin. As it was, though, the kids pounced on me and ate me alive. I was too shy to really deal with them properly; I guess I still am, but not to the extent I was when I first started out.
When you should have been acting like a controlling adult, you looked like a child yourself by calling the office to fight your battles for you. Then the kids knew you were an amateur, and could walk all over you.
Then when your co-teacher tried to help you, you reported her, too, and thought you were being bullied?!
You are doing this to yourself, OP. It's not the fault of the kids. Why can't you see that?
Teaching is not for you. And frankly, it's not fair to the kids who wind up having you as a sub. If anybody needs to be reported, it's you, for not being able to do your job.
This is excellent advice if your goal is to get fired or even blacklisted. I hope you are just being facetious.
Paperback books are soft cover. Even if you wound up and threw as hard as you can, you couldn't hurt someone with a paperback book and if the students are seated, there's no way you could throw that hard.
That approach forces the students to take responsibility for their own actions. If they cannot clean up afterward, they can only blame themselves. If a teacher tells them they cannot do something, they have the ability to pretend to themselves they can handle it, but the mean teacher won't let them.
You are trying to make the students take the responsibility for themselves with that approach with you guiding them along the way.
When you should have been acting like a controlling adult, you looked like a child yourself by calling the office to fight your battles for you. Then the kids knew you were an amateur, and could walk all over you.
Then when your co-teacher tried to help you, you reported her, too, and thought you were being bullied?!
You are doing this to yourself, OP. It's not the fault of the kids. Why can't you see that?
Teaching is not for you. And frankly, it's not fair to the kids who wind up having you as a sub. If anybody needs to be reported, it's you, for not being able to do your job.
I don't totally agree with this. Why have an office at all if it it's wrong to call them?
But I do agree that kmb should not have called the office for someone being rude.
Paperback books are soft cover. Even if you wound up and threw as hard as you can, you couldn't hurt someone with a paperback book and if the students are seated, there's no way you could throw that hard.
That approach forces the students to take responsibility for their own actions. If they cannot clean up afterward, they can only blame themselves. If a teacher tells them they cannot do something, they have the ability to pretend to themselves they can handle it, but the mean teacher won't let them.
You are trying to make the students take the responsibility for themselves with that approach with you guiding them along the way.
Uhm, books cost money. Subs are also responsible for safeguarding the school's property.
Seriously, if a sub did this in a school where I was an administrator, I would not be able to get them out of my building soon enough, I might even send them home early. You better believe I would be calling central office to get them put on the "do not call" list.
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When I post in bold red that is moderator action and, per the TOS, can only be discussed through Direct Message.
Seriously, if a sub did this in a school where I was an administrator, I would not be able to get them out of my building soon enough, I might even send them home early. You better believe I would be calling central office to get them put on the "do not call" list.
The book isn't damaged by being tossed 10 feet. You could throw books for 5 minutes and have no damage and the books be just as usable as they were before.
When you should have been acting like a controlling adult, you looked like a child yourself by calling the office to fight your battles for you. Then the kids knew you were an amateur, and could walk all over you.
Then when your co-teacher tried to help you, you reported her, too, and thought you were being bullied?!
You are doing this to yourself, OP. It's not the fault of the kids. Why can't you see that?
Teaching is not for you. And frankly, it's not fair to the kids who wind up having you as a sub. If anybody needs to be reported, it's you, for not being able to do your job.
I should have had a thicker skin, but I wasn't used to the way my cooperating teacher was running things; it lacked the self-esteem building atmosphere I had grown used to in my other college classes. I requested help from an administrator, because I thought that I was doing something wrong and so not benefitting from being in her classroom. I mentioned everything to my supervisor, because I felt very uncomfortable in her classroom. She was getting a lot of stress from her own students and didn't have time to deal with me too, but from my perspective, the constant criticism and doubt she was displaying towards me looked like bullying. After I graduated and started subbing at her school, though, I realized she had a few good points about the kids.
Paperback books are soft cover. Even if you wound up and threw as hard as you can, you couldn't hurt someone with a paperback book and if the students are seated, there's no way you could throw that hard.
That approach forces the students to take responsibility for their own actions. If they cannot clean up afterward, they can only blame themselves. If a teacher tells them they cannot do something, they have the ability to pretend to themselves they can handle it, but the mean teacher won't let them.
You are trying to make the students take the responsibility for themselves with that approach with you guiding them along the way.
No! If you give them an inch, they'll take miles. Plus, don't be silly. These weren't soft cover; they were hardcover textbooks, and the kids weren't playing nicely. They were trying to run me away. Why? If you can answer that maybe we will both know. Had I allowed them to continue destroying school property, I probably would have been banned. You have to establish and keep control before you can trust them with anything fun.
Perhaps there is something about me that doesn't come off as friendly to the students. I do have slight appearance issues (clothes that are a little too small, slightly visible facial hair, slight acne, and a constant bad hair day) that I've discussed in other threads. it's nothing too bad, except maybe it identifies me as being from a certain socioeconomic background. Another issue is that I don't have a lot of charisma. When I'm in a room, I sometimes fade into the background. I feel more secure when I have a script or a set way of acting in a new situation. I treat new situations like plays and may say the same line over and over in response to certain behaviors if I'm not comfortable. One kid asked me if I was a robot! I guess I do need to work on actually making myself a person to the kids.
I know what you mean with the charisma. That's something I'm improving on. Being more visible and audible to the class. And I'm working on just being more comfortable. One student even mentioned that I looked nervous!
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Originally Posted by inged
If you're male and have a booming voice, being the overly strict sub will work. By the time the kids call your bluff, you won't be in the class anymore, so it won't matter.
The reason for your differing expectations is because every incident is the end of the world for a middle schooler, so nearly any piece of news can create controversey, whereas it takes a lot more to excite or devastate a college student, so even in a class of 200 students, maybe 2 are truly excited about something.
Yea I definitely have the stature, especially with the middle schoolers. Male and 5'11". Only thing is I'm 22 so they know I'm not an experienced sub. Voice projection in class is something I need to work on. I have a deep voice but it's not much on the booming end. I just need to be a little louder and more vocal.
Yea I've gotten used to it over the past week with 4 days at middle schools. A lot of students I can just look at when they're talking and they act like I'm gonna call their parents and send them to the front office! It was just that initial reintroduction to middle school that took some adjusting.
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