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This is the problem with homeschooling that is not supervised by the State. It gives parents the opportunity to deny their children access to education (if the children are not required to meet certain academic achievement goals on a regular basis), and to even deny them access to the world. School is where a child can tell someone that they are being abused in the home.
That is an example of an abusive household (albeit less severe than many), which those in the business know can just as easily be done on a public school kid (or any other kind of kid) as a homeschool kid; there are legions of abuse cases where children go to school all day and are abused during the time they are at home much more severely than the kids in that article. Public school didn't help them at all, and if there have been any cases of a child being saved by virtue of going to public school they are extraordinarily rare, and likely are canceled out by the numbers of children abused at public school that would not have been at home. This doesn't even consider how the vast majority of children in non-abusive households would be adversely impacted by the sort of restrictions you want on the kind of education they can choose.
Also, you treating state supervision of children as some cost-free proposition, which the family of Justina Pelletier would not find amusing; if this state supervision you crave didn't exist her and others like her would still be healthy children peaceably going about their lives. It's quite curious how you don't post or consider that kind of child abuse that occurs at the hands of the state, but rather treat the state as if it is and deserves to be the supreme parent of every child in its jurisdiction. The children whose entire lives are run the way you believe is best for education are under the state's foster care system where they are under state supervision; there, abuse is the norm rather than the exception as it is among normal parents. Statistically, state supervision is the worst kind of supervision possible for a child, yet when we make laws and impose mandates on children and parents we are asked to presume the opposite, almost to the level of presuming the state does no wrong. One would think considering the abuse the state inflicts upon children that the state wouldn't be allowed to come anywhere near children unless there is a near-certainty that children are being abused and will continue to be abused, the only situation where a child would have a better chance under state supervision as it exists today than where they were beforehand. This all makes a very good case that there should be a strong presumption in favor of parents being left alone by the state, rather than the status quo where parents are always under suspicion.
Back to the article at hand, I wish the best for those poor children that had to live under such conditions; perhaps they will be able to get on a good footing going forward. Using a clear case of an abusive household to smear all homeschoolers as if it's just a more extreme version of what homeschool is all about is a despicable prejudice if you ask me, when you consider that we never hear the media and those against homeschooling link public school educations to abusive households as if one leads to the other. Almost the inverse of the OP's case occurred in Oregon just last year, where an abusive classroom was being run in an elementary school where kids had to pay to go to the bathroom or else the teacher would just let them wet their pants and sit there until the end of class; it took parents poking around to find out about it since the public-schooled kids were too used to the public school environment to speak up about something that was wrong. Did we see any thread (much less by the OP) opening with words to this effect that were all but implied in an article from the New York Times?:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hypothetical Inverse OP
This is the problem with public schooling that is not supervised by the parents. It gives teachers the opportunity to deny children [...]
We certainly didn't. This tells volumes about the premises that are being applied by different people to judge differing forms of education and parenting in general; this in turn implies a difference, whether conscious or unconscious, of ideology driven by the fascinating intersection of political and pedagogical philosophy. I leave the decision of whether to go down that rabbit hole to the reader.
One thing you must keep in mind when looking at any data comparing home schooling to traditional schooling is the only people who homeschool are people for whom homeschooling works for them. If homeschooling turns out not to work for a family they return their kids to the public schools. Homeschooled children also have parents who value education and are involved in their education and can afford for one parent to stay home and homeschool. Public schools take all kids not just the ones who have involved parents who value education, two parent households, enough income and who want to learn. Uninvolved parents don't homeschool and parent's are unlikely to fight reluctant learners very long as it's frustrating.
So you are really comparing a small subset for whom homeschooling works to everyone else. It's really not a fair comparison NOR is it a fair assessment of the results of homeschooling. If all students were homeschooled I think you'd see quite different numbers. It works for some families and doesn't for others. Those for whom it doesn't work quit doing it. I have a neighbor who homeschooled her dd for 2 years and then returned her to the public school WAY BEHIND her peers (and blames the schools of course). Homeschooling did not work for them for whatever reason.
Comparing homeschooling to traditional schooling is comparing apples to oranges. You just can't compare one system that is only done by those for whom it works to everyone else and expect the comparison to be fair. Given that homeschooled kids have involved parents (and usually come from two parent households with enough income for one parent to stay home) and only families for whom it works homeschool, I would expect homeschooling results to be FANTASTIC. I can tell you that kids with involved parents do MUCH MUCH better in public schools as do kids for whom public schooling works. However, public schools deal with everyone. Kids who have parents who don't care, who have home environments that result in them struggling, who go to bed hungry,etc, etc, etc.... Yes, homeschooling should look FANTASTIC by comparison but that does not mean that it's great for everyone. Just that it works for those who do it.
To be fair, you'd have to compare home schooling to kids in public schools from two parent, middle class households, with parents who value education and who are involved in their child's education and for whom public schools work. Comparing homeschooled children to everyone else just isn't a fair assessment of homeschooling or everyone else.
Last edited by Ivorytickler; 01-25-2015 at 08:39 AM..
One thing you must keep in mind when looking at any data comparing home schooling to traditional schooling is the only people who homeschool are people for whom homeschooling works for them. If homeschooling turns out not to work for a family they return their kids to the public schools. Homeschooled children also have parents who value education and are involved in their education and can afford for one parent to stay home and homeschool. Public schools take all kids not just the ones who have involved parents who value education, two parent households, enough income and who want to learn. Uninvolved parents don't homeschool and parent's are unlikely to fight reluctant learners very long as it's frustrating.
So you are really comparing a small subset for whom homeschooling works to everyone else. It's really not a fair comparison NOR is it a fair assessment of the results of homeschooling. If all students were homeschooled I think you'd see quite different numbers. It works for some families and doesn't for others. Those for whom it doesn't work quit doing it. I have a neighbor who homeschooled her dd for 2 years and then returned her child to the public school WAY BEHIND her peers (and blames the schools of course). Homeschooling did not work for them for whatever reason.
Comparing homeschooling to traditional schooling is comparing apples to oranges. You just can't compare one system that is only done by those for whom it works to everyone else and expect the comparison to be fair. Given that homeschooled kids have involved parents (and usually come from two parent households with enough income for one parent to stay home) and only families for whom it works homeschool, I would expect homeschooling results to be FANTASTIC. I can tell you that kids with involved parents do MUCH MUCH better in public schools as do kids for whom public schooling works. However, public schools deal with everyone. Kids who have parents who don't care, who have home environments that result in them struggling, who go to bed hungry,etc, etc, etc.... Yes, homeschooling should look FANTASTIC by comparison but that does not mean that it's great for everyone. Just that it works for those who do it.
To be fair, you'd have to compare home schooling to kids in public schools from two parent, middle class households, with parents who value education and who are involved in their child's education and for whom public schools work. Comparing homeschooled children to everyone else just isn't a fair assessment of homeschooling or everyone else.
This is simply rationalizing why homeschooling WORKS for those involved in it. I quoted where the OP said there's a problem with home schooling. I don't see a problem based on the data.
I would venture to guess that if more parents could put themselves in the position/copy what other homeschooling parents are able to do - more kids would get a better education.
Who, why, how, it works is irrelevant until we see an actual problem.
BTW - I think the last chart is pretty telling if the data is correct. Regardless of income, certification, or money spent - on average homeschooling gets excellent results.
BTW - I think the last chart is pretty telling if the data is correct. Regardless of income, certification, or money spent - on average homeschooling gets excellent results.
That's a great student:teacher ratio. I'm sure that helps, but some will say class size doesn't matter.
This is a story about child abuse; not homeschooling.
To paint homeschoolers, in general, with this brush is extremely irresponsible and exposes, not the horrors of homeschooling, but your bias against it.
This is simply rationalizing why homeschooling WORKS for those involved in it. I quoted where the OP said there's a problem with home schooling. I don't see a problem based on the data.
I would venture to guess that if more parents could put themselves in the position/copy what other homeschooling parents are able to do - more kids would get a better education.
Who, why, how, it works is irrelevant until we see an actual problem.
But, there IS a problem with parents who withdrawl their kids from school to "homeschool" them after a report of child abuse has been made by someone, usually a teacher, in the school. Homeschooling hasn't worked too well for these kids:
The point is, children who are homeschooled lose a level of oversight and protection against parents who are abusive. Of course, MOST homeschooling parents don't need that oversight and most homeschooled children are well loved and well cared for. But for those who aren't, they have lost what little protection they could have had. The number one catagory of substantiated child abuse reporters are teachers and daycare providers. This problem is not about academics.
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