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Old 05-18-2015, 03:14 PM
 
4,586 posts, read 4,418,428 times
Reputation: 4337

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Paolella View Post
1) Preposterous, we are teaching people to think, not programming robots.

2) There is no government. You are taking money from people who earned it and own it. It is not yours to give.

3) NO UNIFORMS! Everyone is not the same, and clothes are a part of personal expression.
You're the reason America has failed at education!
"Clothing" is the WORST way to "express yourself!" Thats an open invitation to disrespect towards faculty & bullying!
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Old 05-18-2015, 04:12 PM
 
Location: Oceania
8,623 posts, read 5,902,276 times
Reputation: 8318
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhotoProIP View Post
1. Everyone will learn the same things regardless of location, income and demographics.
2. I'll have the Gov pay for everything these kids need & stop wasting tax dollars on their salaries and overseas wars!
3. Every kid enrolled will wear the same uniform in every state.


It's called "The "United" States, but at street level were anything but "United".

The federal government is the #1 problem with education at present. Federal government has no business in education as it is a state's responsibility - doesn't every state have a Dept of Education? You already eluded to kids wearing the same uniforms in every state. Would that be an overpaid federal position or that of a faculty member at the school in question?
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Old 05-18-2015, 04:40 PM
 
5,775 posts, read 3,050,430 times
Reputation: 15139
Quote:
Originally Posted by nana053 View Post
The problem with tracking for students in the lower tracks is that their achievement becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. The kids think they can't learn because they know they are being given lower work. The teachers and parents think the kids can't learn because after all, the kids are getting lower grades on lower material.

While the study focused on positive results, it stands to reason that negative results could also be biased by the way we place students into classrooms and tracks.

It is true that kids have different talents and different abilities, but the key is that often we have no basis on which to judge these and if we wall off kids who we *think* cannot learn, then they probably will not learn because that is what we expect.

Well based on the evidence before us, in the overall school performance, it seems that the current concept isn't working. In fact it would tell us we're bringing our top performers down to make the bottom performers feel better. The alternative to the assumption that "they think they can't learn because they are given lower work" is they are given lower work because they can't learn. I know it's unpopular. I know it hurts emotionally. But it better fits the results we are seeing than the current feel good method.

Not everyone is cut out for calc or physics. Rather than putting everyone on the college bound track, put them on the right track and teach them what is appropriate for them. Then they can learn.
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Old 05-18-2015, 05:22 PM
 
52 posts, read 36,804 times
Reputation: 42
I personally would make everything just like college. I loved college and I've done so well in college compared to high school. It may be due to the fact that I'm older now, but the autonomy and freedom that college provides really opened up my view to learning and actually made me want to go. I feel like we should provide that in some of our education systems, like the last few years of high school or both middle and high school. We should also be integrating some type of secondary language learning in our elementary schools. Additionally, research has shown that instead of boasting performance levels or whether or not a child did a good job, you will see much more improvement if you boast their effort. So instead of saying "You're the smartest, Jimmy!", we should definitely begin a more effort-based approach to encouragement in our classrooms.
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Old 05-18-2015, 05:40 PM
 
Location: Northern NJ
7,410 posts, read 7,372,780 times
Reputation: 10612
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhotoProIP View Post
You're the reason America has failed at education!
"Clothing" is the WORST way to "express yourself!" Thats an open invitation to disrespect towards faculty & bullying!
Nonsense. Students should be free to wear whatever they want, as long as everything is covered up, no underwear, no boobs, no stomachs. But beyond that, leave them alone. Clothes are a WONDERFUL way to express oneself. Students should be free to explore different styles. And bullys don't give a rat's ass about clothes. They will pick on whatever is available. They can simply be kicked out if they act out. As far as respect for faculty, that has nothing to do with clothes, that has to do with behavior. If a child fails to show the proper respect he can be disciplined appropriately, including expulsion if the behavior is too extreme or disruptive.

Parents should understand that if they have a disruptive little urchin that bullies or interrupts the learning of others, he will be kicked out and they will be facing the expense of homeschooling the little devil.

Consequences, ladies and gentlemen. Consequences.
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Old 05-18-2015, 05:44 PM
 
Location: Northern NJ
7,410 posts, read 7,372,780 times
Reputation: 10612
Quote:
Originally Posted by savannahgx3 View Post
I personally would make everything just like college. I loved college and I've done so well in college compared to high school. It may be due to the fact that I'm older now, but the autonomy and freedom that college provides really opened up my view to learning and actually made me want to go. I feel like we should provide that in some of our education systems, like the last few years of high school or both middle and high school. We should also be integrating some type of secondary language learning in our elementary schools. Additionally, research has shown that instead of boasting performance levels or whether or not a child did a good job, you will see much more improvement if you boast their effort. So instead of saying "You're the smartest, Jimmy!", we should definitely begin a more effort-based approach to encouragement in our classrooms.
The research is biased and incorrect. Achievement matters, and should be recognized and rewarded. Our job is to educate the kids, not make them feel "equal", because they are not. Competition should be encouraged. Excellence should be rewarded. That means grades and scores and measurement. We don't want to raise a bunch of weenies who wilt whenever they are looked up.
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Old 05-18-2015, 05:50 PM
 
Location: midwest
1,349 posts, read 953,902 times
Reputation: 800
Quote:
Originally Posted by savannahgx3 View Post
I personally would make everything just like college. I loved college and I've done so well in college compared to high school. It may be due to the fact that I'm older now, but the autonomy and freedom that college provides really opened up my view to learning and actually made me want to go.
I am inclined to agree with this if grade school had been run differently. But it is more like their intent was to keep us silly little kids. It wasn't the teachers that kept me interested in learning it was the sci-fi books.

School made me memorize how to spell ANTIDISESTABLISHMENTARIANISM.

SF books talked about Nuclear FUSION.

If this had begun in *1959* would school be a problem today?

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/1...30106/abstract

psik
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Old 05-18-2015, 05:59 PM
 
Location: The analog world
15,688 posts, read 8,782,580 times
Reputation: 21073
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Paolella View Post
The research is biased and incorrect. Achievement matters, and should be recognized and rewarded. Our job is to educate the kids, not make them feel "equal", because they are not. Competition should be encouraged. Excellence should be rewarded. That means grades and scores and measurement. We don't want to raise a bunch of weenies who wilt whenever they are looked up.
I think you've misunderstood the research reference the previous poster made. She's citing work by Carol Dweck, which found that the type of praise given makes a tremendous difference in how much effort a person puts into a difficult task. Look up her book Mindset for an in-depth explanation.
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Old 05-18-2015, 06:32 PM
 
11,904 posts, read 14,382,431 times
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Obviously the challenges are different in a suburban school district where over 90% go to college from a rural district where many go into the military or the farm. Even in a large city schools do not have the same clientele. They should be allowed to split. Maybe more charters. How about public-private partnerships, with corporations sponsoring certain schools and even hiring graduates? Students would be more willing to learn if they believe it leads to a job.
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Old 05-18-2015, 06:36 PM
 
Location: Houston, TX
13,206 posts, read 7,423,414 times
Reputation: 27318
I would have every parent be a teacher for a day. (This includes all the grading of tests and papers after school). They would teach an entire classroom full of kids the curriculum the school requires and learn exactly what the job entails. That way they would quit complaining about how the teacher didn't teach little Johnny and Sally X, Y, and Z like they were supposed to, and how teachers have sucah an easy job, etc, etc. (I'm not a teacher, BTW). Teaching should be a collaborative process. Sure, teachers have responsibilities to teach, and not all of them are good, but I think most of them do try very hard to do their jobs well. I also believe parents need to take an active role in teaching their kids as well, and many times they don't.
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