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Old 12-17-2011, 03:57 PM
 
Location: Fairfield, CT
5,530 posts, read 8,186,609 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by khuntrevor View Post
I'll bet the kid is as bratty as the parent. There will be far more urgent times when the parents input and "help" are needed by the school. Pick your battles carefully and don't be a pain in the arse. No, it's not easy to get the kids "quite."

Will you be a loving parent by putting your kid on toxic drugs like Ritalin, after you don't allow the school to non-physically discipline her? That's the trend, and that's why ADHD diagnosis is up 2500% in 20 years. Yet, almost none of these kids have had their condition scientifically verified, just that the school is happy to have the aggressive kids all doped up, instead of instilling values and discipline.

It's better to discipline kids than to drug them.

In school, all punishment is public. Anybody could walk by and see who was sitting in detention in my school. Sometimes I had to do work details after school, and everybody knew the kids working after school were being punished for something.

I was never embarrassed by punishment at school past a certain age. I was more proud of it, pleased that the school had found it necessary to punish me. Most kids seem to feel the same, since we used to brag about it.

We shouldn't make our kids out to be hothouse flowers who can't survive stuff like this.
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Old 12-17-2011, 05:47 PM
 
15,824 posts, read 18,440,406 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wandering Mind View Post
in my last year of non-homeschool, 5th grade, i had to sit at a separate table for the entire year (starting early on, like sept-oct) because i went under the table to retrieve a fork, except i didnt have to face the wall. i liked it though, the teachers usually left a newspaper there and id look thru it while eating, and i like being by myself anyway...so i dunno how itd be for punishment. might not be entirely effective though
OMG...A whole year?? That's crazy, glad you got home schooled after a public school like that.
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Old 04-17-2013, 04:11 PM
 
1 posts, read 1,621 times
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There is no way I would allow a school to punish my tender 6 year old by having her or him face the wall when eating lunch. This could have future harmful affects on the child in later years and let us face facts we have some very good teachers and we do appreciate them. However, there are some mean ones also. To do this is out right mean and how would they respond if it were their child. I believe this is public humiliation and against the child's constitutional right of the 8th amendment of cruel and unusual punishment.
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Old 04-17-2013, 08:09 PM
 
Location: My beloved Bluegrass
14,059 posts, read 9,787,161 times
Reputation: 18877
Quote:
Originally Posted by irisvennie View Post
There is no way I would allow a school to punish my tender 6 year old by having her or him face the wall when eating lunch. This could have future harmful affects on the child in later years and let us face facts we have some very good teachers and we do appreciate them. However, there are some mean ones also. To do this is out right mean and how would they respond if it were their child. I believe this is public humiliation and against the child's constitutional right of the 8th amendment of cruel and unusual punishment.
It is developmentally appropriate, effective, and short term. What would you have them do? Keep in mind there are at least 20 other tender 6 year-olds to also deal with at the same time.
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Old 04-18-2013, 10:27 AM
 
Location: Middle America
35,817 posts, read 39,346,783 times
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Consequences for unwanted behavior are obviously necessary. However, consequences are most useful when they're applied in a timely manner, as immediately as possible, and in a way that helps the student make a connection that the unwanted behavior was the reason for the consequence. I'm not sure that a younger child is necessarily going to make the connection that talking out of turn in class the day before or that inappropriate contact with another student led to a consequence meted out in a whole other venue at a whole different time. And if they don't make the question between the behavior and the consequence, the consequence won't act as a catalyst to change the behavior, so what's the point?

I also feel that isolation is something that needs to be applied only in matters of safety, not as a behavioral consequence for something that's not unsafe behavior.
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Old 04-18-2013, 09:39 PM
 
780 posts, read 1,553,363 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldhag1 View Post
It is developmentally appropriate, effective, and short term. What would you have them do? Keep in mind there are at least 20 other tender 6 year-olds to also deal with at the same time.
When you say this is developmentally appropriate, I wonder from who? Would it be okay to make you do the same if you hit someone's backpack? Would you feel slightly humiliated if YOU were treated as such? Kids and even babies are actual people. They are NOT wild animals that need to be tamed. What this person describes is negative, humiliating and punishing. Consequences should not be punitive to a child's character and should relate to the offense. What I would do is take the child aside and talk and LISTEN to them to find out WHY the behavior happens. And talking 3 times when you're supposed to be quiet for a 6 year old? Completely NORMAL. I hope you have no contact with children as you don't seem to know much about development or how to navigate perfectly normal behavior.

If anyone did this to my child they would be gone and never to return again. Public Schools are nothing but daycare, formed to mold children into complacent robots who will not question anything. Those who can't maintain these rigid, inhuman guidelines are labeled as 'bad' when alot of what is happening is normal. A 6 year old should be PLAYING, not sitting quiet like an old person.

Ps. Schools love to label kids as ADD because then they receive MORE MONEY from the state. The parents of ADD kids also get 'disability' checks (ummm why?), so there are many parents who sign up for pushing ADD onto their kids, even though they are perfectly normal.

Child abuse at its finest...that's how we operate here in the good old US of A.
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Old 04-19-2013, 01:47 AM
 
Location: Tennessee
33,949 posts, read 32,379,274 times
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I think the school should put the unruly kids in the principal's office and call the parents at work to pick them up. When the parent gets tired of this, the parent will teach the kid how to behave at school.
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Old 04-19-2013, 12:48 PM
 
Location: Middle America
35,817 posts, read 39,346,783 times
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You do realize that there are (many) administrators who actively discourage teachers from sending students to the principal's office for disciplinary purposes, and who will ding teachers at evaluation time if they have students with frequent trips to the office.

I imagine you also realize that in the case of students with chronic behavioral issues, the parents are more likely to become angry with the school for repeated behaviorally-related suspension and less likely to "teach the kid how to behave at school."
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Old 04-19-2013, 07:50 PM
 
Location: My beloved Bluegrass
14,059 posts, read 9,787,161 times
Reputation: 18877
Quote:
Originally Posted by tjay View Post
When you say this is developmentally appropriate, I wonder from who? Would it be okay to make you do the same if you hit someone's backpack? Would you feel slightly humiliated if YOU were treated as such? Kids and even babies are actual people. They are NOT wild animals that need to be tamed. What this person describes is negative, humiliating and punishing. Consequences should not be punitive to a child's character and should relate to the offense. What I would do is take the child aside and talk and LISTEN to them to find out WHY the behavior happens. And talking 3 times when you're supposed to be quiet for a 6 year old? Completely NORMAL. I hope you have no contact with children as you don't seem to know much about development or how to navigate perfectly normal behavior.
I taught well over 20 years and was good enough to even receive a couple of national awards for it. I taught methods classes to future teachers. So I do tend to think I know at least a tiny bit about child development. Chances are talking to the child had already been tried on multiple occasions and it was ineffective. Some kids really struggle to fit in a group setting, this little guy may have be one of them. Yes, sadly, some of them need to be "tamed". Really, I wish schools were allowed to do what is suggested below, then we wouldn't have to worry being negative, humiliating, or punishing in order to get a child to keep his hands off his classmates. By the way, how do you think the child/children who were subjected to this child's actions felt?

Quote:
Originally Posted by LauraC View Post
I think the school should put the unruly kids in the principal's office and call the parents at work to pick them up. When the parent gets tired of this, the parent will teach the kid how to behave at school.
In my dreams!
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Old 04-20-2013, 04:45 AM
 
Location: Tennessee
33,949 posts, read 32,379,274 times
Reputation: 49901
Quote:
Originally Posted by TabulaRasa View Post
You do realize that there are (many) administrators who actively discourage teachers from sending students to the principal's office for disciplinary purposes, and who will ding teachers at evaluation time if they have students with frequent trips to the office.

I imagine you also realize that in the case of students with chronic behavioral issues, the parents are more likely to become angry with the school for repeated behaviorally-related suspension and less likely to "teach the kid how to behave at school."
Too bad. At least the other kids that want to learn don't have to put up with it.
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