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From the thread starter citation: "When students are rated with letter or number grades, research shows they’re apt to think in a shallower fashion — and to lose interest in what they’re learning — as compared with students who aren’t graded at all."
A perfect example of making a ridiculous statement and pretending it is supported by scientific research. Unfortunately, we no longer expect writers to provide a citation to the "research" they are supposedly summarizing.
There is a lot of research on this subject. The case was made many decades ago actually.
Grading like this is associated with an increased level of cheating. There is an entire book on this.
You can get it in the journal if the pdf doesn't work.
Pulfrey, C., Buch, C., & Butera, F. (2011). Why grades engender performance-avoidance goals: The mediating role of autonomous motivation. Journal of Educational Psychology, 103, 683-700.
You can get it in the journal if the pdf doesn't work.
Pulfrey, C., Buch, C., & Butera, F. (2011). Why grades engender performance-avoidance goals: The mediating role of autonomous motivation. Journal of Educational Psychology, 103, 683-700.
Thanks for the links. Cheating is HUGE in my school. I would much rather have a pass/fail system than a graded system for this reason although I don't think students will be more motivated to learn. IME students have little interest in learning what is taught in school. They'd rather be doing just about anything else.
Thanks for the links. Cheating is HUGE in my school. I would much rather have a pass/fail system than a graded system for this reason although I don't think students will be more motivated to learn. IME students have little interest in learning what is taught in school. They'd rather be doing just about anything else.
Is it possible that maybe your teaching style is the problem?
Is it possible that maybe your teaching style is the problem?
I didn't say "In my class". I said "In my school". My teaching style is not the issue. Just a few weeks back I had the parent of a student come back to tell me that I am the one teacher who her son felt prepared him for college. Cheating is an issue in my school because the students have been taught to chase grades. It's not about learning it's about grades. I force my students to learn but that doesn't stop them from cheating to get grades as that is what they have been conditioned to do when the going gets tough.
I caught a student cheating just before break. He turned in work that wasn't his. I was going to give him zeros on all of the assignments. The VP had other ideas so I ended up giving him alternate assignments that he will get full credit for. The kids know that even if they are caught there is no real penalty so why not tray cheating? They know that if they cry and their parents come in they will be treated with kid gloves and given a second chance because the big bad system MADE them cheat when reality is they chose to cheat instead of do the work.
The problem is in my SCHOOL not just in my class and it's not just in my school. I hear the same thing from other teachers. The only schools I know of where it's not a huge problem are the ones that have actual consequences for cheating and they are usually private schools.
I didn't say "In my class". I said "In my school". My teaching style is not the issue. Just a few weeks back I had the parent of a student come back to tell me that I am the one teacher who her son felt prepared him for college. Cheating is an issue in my school because the students have been taught to chase grades. It's not about learning it's about grades. I force my students to learn but that doesn't stop them from cheating to get grades as that is what they have been conditioned to do when the going gets tough.
Like it or not, grades determine who gets into which colleges, and who gets scholarships to which colleges. And, like it or not, grades are how parents are judging their students, and many parents consider anything less than A to be failing. Do you realize that teacher like you do nothing but put your students at a disadvantage, and make them feel justified in cheating in order to get the grade that they deserve, not what you want to give to them.
By what other mechanism do you suggests that potentially identifies the people in society that are mentally capable of creating innovation? The people that are dedicated and determined should be given more resources to create positive change than those who are unwilling to cooperate.
By what other mechanism do you suggests that potentially identifies the people in society that are mentally capable of creating innovation? The people that are dedicated and determined should be given more resources to create positive change than those who are unwilling to cooperate.
I agree BUT....
I don't think ranking at the top helps anything but I do think we need to group so we know who the potential high fliers are. I don't think we need ranking within a group though. My thinkers are often my risk takers so they have lower GPA's. It amazes me that colleges want the top students when the top students are followers who work the system to their advantage. My thinkers often won't do what they perceive as busy work just to get a grade. They often confuse themselves by thinking beyond the class and cost themselves points on tests. When that is the obvious cause of getting something incorrect I will give credit but my thinkers often don't write enough information for me to determine that that is the case.
Rarely are my A students my thinkers and risk takers. When they are they are exceptional. I have one right now. It's been 3 years since I had my last one. Thinking, risk taking, A students are rare IMO and when they come along they challenge me.
I don't think ranking at the top helps anything but I do think we need to group so we know who the potential high fliers are. I don't think we need ranking within a group though. My thinkers are often my risk takers so they have lower GPA's. It amazes me that colleges want the top students when the top students are followers who work the system to their advantage. My thinkers often won't do what they perceive as busy work just to get a grade. They often confuse themselves by thinking beyond the class and cost themselves points on tests. When that is the obvious cause of getting something incorrect I will give credit but my thinkers often don't write enough information for me to determine that that is the case.
Rarely are my A students my thinkers and risk takers. When they are they are exceptional. I have one right now. It's been 3 years since I had my last one. Thinking, risk taking, A students are rare IMO and when they come along they challenge me.
Do you realize that your grading system disadvantages the risk takers?
I don't think ranking at the top helps anything but I do think we need to group so we know who the potential high fliers are. I don't think we need ranking within a group though. My thinkers are often my risk takers so they have lower GPA's. It amazes me that colleges want the top students when the top students are followers who work the system to their advantage. My thinkers often won't do what they perceive as busy work just to get a grade. They often confuse themselves by thinking beyond the class and cost themselves points on tests. When that is the obvious cause of getting something incorrect I will give credit but my thinkers often don't write enough information for me to determine that that is the case.
Rarely are my A students my thinkers and risk takers. When they are they are exceptional. I have one right now. It's been 3 years since I had my last one. Thinking, risk taking, A students are rare IMO and when they come along they challenge me.
I do agree that formalized education can actually stifle innovation by promoting ideas that are widely accepted; however, wrong.
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