U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Education
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 09-12-2017, 01:30 AM
 
967 posts, read 230,784 times
Reputation: 985

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by Listener2307 View Post
Yew betcha! Stick up for that little slug of a kid, no matter what he does. If he's been drinking, by God, they better find that out the legal way! No way they're gonna pin the rap on your kid - the drunken sot.

And even if they catch him, let's make 'em pay. Later in life when the little drunken sot turns to drugs we can use high price attorneys and get him off then, too. After all, if he want to drink and smoke pot, who are we to tell him he can't or force him to be accountable?

Yeah! Hillary For President! America is just great the way it is!
How much have you had to drink tonight, sir or ma'am?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 09-12-2017, 06:43 AM
 
2,350 posts, read 3,545,849 times
Reputation: 1553
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alonso Gil View Post
4th Amendment violation? Sue them.
I don't think that's correct legally speaking. It's the same reason that states can revoke your Driver's License for refusing a blood test.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-12-2017, 07:17 AM
 
Location: Denver area
20,234 posts, read 20,006,478 times
Reputation: 31326
Quote:
Originally Posted by blazerj View Post
I don't think that's correct legally speaking. It's the same reason that states can revoke your Driver's License for refusing a blood test.
If you are refusing a blood test for DUI, you have presumably been pulled over or have other reason to believe you are intoxicated (by your own actions). I don't believe you are required to submit to a blood test because other people around you might be intoxicated. It's similar to DUI checkpoints (illegal in some states) - even then, I don't think they can demand a bloodtest without other suspicious behavior. And that's when driving is involved. A beer can being tossed in a football game - way over reaction by the principal.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-12-2017, 10:52 AM
 
3,818 posts, read 2,127,849 times
Reputation: 12178
When I sent my kids to school functions I expected the school to protect their safety. There's no way I'd want to send my kids to a school function with drunken teens around. At that age there's too much risk of poor decisions. Just what I'd want - a bunch of Senior males drunken and interested in my inexperienced little seventh grader. Or some surly, drunken upper classmen beating up on my ninth grade son for trying to protect her.


There's a time and place for young people to learn how to safely use alcohol and to deal with others who haven't and it's not in a school other than soberly and within a classroom.


I violated my kids "rights" all the time while they were growing up until I thought they were equipped to handle the responsibilities that go along with those rights. That's the job of a parent - gradually teaching and allowing more freedoms until you are no longer necessary. When I wasn't there I understood the school was to act in loco parentis.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old Yesterday, 04:45 AM
 
8,091 posts, read 1,795,560 times
Reputation: 2736
Quote:
Originally Posted by history nerd View Post
This is a clear violation of the 4th Amendment.
No it's not.When on school property you follow school rules and YES,even adults have to listen.Schools are no smoking zones adults must follow the rules as well as students and being it was the Principle and not just a teacher it's all legal.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old Yesterday, 05:43 PM
 
480 posts, read 192,549 times
Reputation: 910
Quote:
Originally Posted by G1.. View Post
No it's not.When on school property you follow school rules and YES,even adults have to listen.Schools are no smoking zones adults must follow the rules as well as students and being it was the Principle and not just a teacher it's all legal.
I guess we will see if/when this goes to court... but I doubt that the district will be able to prove reasonable suspicion sufficient for the forcible collection of bodily fluids. Schools actually do not have unlimited legal power and enforcing rules is actually not the same as search and seizure... Especially of bodily fluids that have repeatedly been found to require a higher legal standard.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old Yesterday, 07:58 PM
 
Location: North Beach, MD on the Chesapeake
27,906 posts, read 33,539,949 times
Reputation: 33737
Quote:
Originally Posted by history nerd View Post
I guess we will see if/when this goes to court... but I doubt that the district will be able to prove reasonable suspicion sufficient for the forcible collection of bodily fluids. Schools actually do not have unlimited legal power and enforcing rules is actually not the same as search and seizure... Especially of bodily fluids that have repeatedly been found to require a higher legal standard.
No one was held down and had blood forcibly taken. The parents were notified, the students had time certain to get tested. If not they would be suspended. That's pretty much SOP embodied in a lot of school discipline policies.

We had students not receive their diplomas at graduation, or walk in it, for papering the school as a Senior prank. We also had the Homecoming Dance cancelled one year because two girls got into a fight during first period the day before, a Friday. That day's pep rally was also cancelled.

Y'all wanted zero tolerance and no administrative discretion. Well you got it.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old Yesterday, 08:35 PM
 
Location: Denver area
20,234 posts, read 20,006,478 times
Reputation: 31326
Quote:
Originally Posted by North Beach Person View Post
No one was held down and had blood forcibly taken. The parents were notified, the students had time certain to get tested. If not they would be suspended. That's pretty much SOP embodied in a lot of school discipline policies.

We had students not receive their diplomas at graduation, or walk in it, for papering the school as a Senior prank. We also had the Homecoming Dance cancelled one year because two girls got into a fight during first period the day before, a Friday. That day's pep rally was also cancelled.

Y'all wanted zero tolerance and no administrative discretion. Well you got it.
Both of those examples you (presumably) knew the kids involved. The current example is entirely speculation - there was no reason to suspect a specific student so a blood test was requestec of everyone there. Being there is not enough of a reason to demand that test.

Last edited by maciesmom; Yesterday at 08:45 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old Yesterday, 09:12 PM
 
480 posts, read 192,549 times
Reputation: 910
Quote:
Originally Posted by North Beach Person View Post
No one was held down and had blood forcibly taken. The parents were notified, the students had time certain to get tested. If not they would be suspended. That's pretty much SOP embodied in a lot of school discipline policies.

We had students not receive their diplomas at graduation, or walk in it, for papering the school as a Senior prank. We also had the Homecoming Dance cancelled one year because two girls got into a fight during first period the day before, a Friday. That day's pep rally was also cancelled.

Y'all wanted zero tolerance and no administrative discretion. Well you got it.
None of the examples you are giving are 4th amendment issues. I don't know how you don't see that.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old Yesterday, 09:19 PM
 
174 posts, read 44,442 times
Reputation: 217
"Reasonable suspicion" would be breathalyzing students who smelled like beer, were seen in possession of beer, or who were acting drunk. Blood tests and accusing all 75 students goes way beyond "reasonable suspicion".
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Education

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2017, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32 - Top