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Old 09-28-2017, 08:18 AM
 
Location: Fairfax County, VA
1,387 posts, read 1,060,527 times
Reputation: 2759

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thulsa View Post
I think the OP has a great idea, and I think all judges and officers of the court should accept unpaid appointments from anyone who has an interest to come in and spend an hour telling them better ways to do their job. And law schools should have courses on how judges/attorneys should learn to adopt the advice of random people.
As a society, we used to value the work of actual experts. Now we are told that experts are ivory tower elites who are out of touch with mainstream America. The dumb just keeps on coming.

 
Old 09-28-2017, 08:19 AM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,316 posts, read 120,147,178 times
Reputation: 35920
Quote:
Originally Posted by loves2read View Post
Yes--colleges DON'T want to listen to parents--
They are very happy to take their money but they want NOTHING from parents but just that
Funding...
Colleges have found a way to cut off helicopter parents at the knees with this law and use it as much as they can
Students are not encouraged to sign that form--and most students when they get to college are glad to discover they can block their parents out of their business
Many parents find out way too late that a child is flunking out of school after they have funded two semesters of do nothing but play time...
This is not about college students, but about education colleges.
 
Old 09-28-2017, 08:39 AM
 
254 posts, read 278,556 times
Reputation: 482
Quote:
Originally Posted by lkb0714 View Post
OP

Lets do some turn about with your premise

I have met, spoken with, "worked with", thousands of parents over the last 15 years. Based on YOUR reasoning I am therefore an expert on raising children. Based on that, I can tell who is a bad and good parent. So you are therefore ready for me to delivery a litany of what you are doing wrong with your children correct?
I don't know about the OP, but over the years, I have encountered a number of teachers that are very quick to blame symptoms of my child's learning disability as a product of poor parenting and have suggested that I take a parenting class as the solution to addressing it. That seems like a more logical solution to them than providing learning disability accommodations.

These teachers are sometimes young, they are always childless, and come across as the type that don't want to do one minute more work than their job requires. They don't want to spend time incorporating 504s, much less researching best practices on teaching a child with a LD. I suspect they are may have a reputation of doing less work than their job requires, but admin is very good at circling the wagons.

Suggesting that they incorporate communication methods or classroom management policies that the teachers that are always get recognized as being outstanding teachers use never goes over very well.

I suspect that the teachers on this board tend to go above and beyond, but please keep in mind that us parents have to deal with the slacker teachers also. It is frustrating to deal with when your child's education and self-esteem are on the line.
 
Old 09-28-2017, 08:47 AM
 
37,315 posts, read 59,474,655 times
Reputation: 25330
Quote:
Originally Posted by G1.. View Post
Great example of blaming the school,except you just made the point for the other side. If my kid is flunking out of college and I don't know about it,that is between the two of us ,not the schools fault.Maybe as a parent I didn't do enough to prepare my kid for college and the responsibility of being an adult student.
I said nothing about blaming the school for the student failing
Or blaming the school because parents and their kids don't have good communications
That has to start from Day 1 between parents and kids

My point was that colleges are not into coddling kids like lower education does mainly because they deal with young adults and many older adults who need to be self-sufficient===college is not a fail-safe zone--

But colleges are always ready to take anyone's money--
Whether it comes from student loans and overburdened students or parents who go into debt or not to fund students in college...
Or designing a schedule so that some certain percentage of students don't get into specific degree related courses in any given semester and either have to stay longer or go to summer school and pay additional tuition/fees
I have had kids and have friends with kids who have been in college and this is a persistant issue which is totally at the college's discression and design...and only benefits the colleges...not the students...
 
Old 09-28-2017, 09:35 AM
 
8,351 posts, read 7,545,669 times
Reputation: 10937
Quote:
Originally Posted by loves2read View Post
Yes--colleges DON'T want to listen to parents--
They are very happy to take their money but they want NOTHING from parents but just that
Funding...
Again, colleges don't have any choice about this. It's mandated by a Federal law (FERPA).

However, ALL college students are free to sign a FERPA waiver that will allow parents to access their college records.

All colleges make that waiver readily available, and most mention it at least once or twice during freshmen orientation.

So, if your child doesn't sign it, then actually, your child is the person who is stopping you from accessing your child's college records, not the college.

In our family, we asked our kids to sign the FERPA waivers at their respective colleges as a condition of Mom and Dad paying the bills. We wanted to be sure to have access to their records in an emergency.

Funny thing is we never once had to actually use the waiver; our kids were pretty good about managing their lives in college and kept us in the loop pretty well. So, we never felt the need to call their college or their professors to ask how they were doing.

That doesn't mean our kids didn't run into problems and make mistakes from time to time while they were in college. They did, but they managed to figure things out on their own without us having to call the college to fix it for them.

Sure, we had some nail biting moments when, as parents, we wondered how our kids were going to solve some of the messes they got themselves into, but frankly, we viewed that as part of the education process: learning how to fix mistakes for yourself.

Also, just a reminder: FERPA is not a new Federal law. It's been law since the 1970s.

Back in the 70s and 80s, of course, most parents assumed that once their children got to college they would be able to handle their own affairs and solve their own problems without parents butting in.

Times have changed, apparently.

Last edited by RosieSD; 09-28-2017 at 09:54 AM..
 
Old 09-28-2017, 10:05 AM
 
8,351 posts, read 7,545,669 times
Reputation: 10937
Slightly off topic, but one of the most important lessons I learned about being a parent I learned from my daughter's wonderful and wise second grade teacher.

At the start of second grade, for four days in a row my daughter forgot to put her lunch into her backpack in the morning.

Four days in a row, I ran her lunch down to the school and brought it to her classroom.

On the fourth day, Ms. Bauer smiled and then stepped outside and said to me, "tomorrow, don't bring A's lunch to her if she forgets to put it in her backpack. She won't starve. But, she will learn how to remember to plan better and make sure she has everything she needs for school on her own. As a parent, your real job is to teach her how to do things for herself, not to do things for her."

I almost had a heart attack at the idea of my poor baby not having her lunch for a day. But, sure enough, the next day, my daughter left her lunch at home again.

I took Mrs. Bauer's advice and didn't bring the lunch to school even though all day I pictured my daughter wilting away from hunger.

But, Mrs. Bauer was right: my daughter never forgot her lunch again. And every morning from then on she also made sure that her backpack had everything else she needed for school that day in it without me nagging her about it.

Mrs. Bauer taught ME many other important things about being a parent and helping my kids grow up to be responsible adults (my son had her as well). She was the best parenting teacher I ever had. I've thought of things she taught me about my kids and being a parent many times over the years when I was tempted to fix things for my kids that they could fix for themselves.

Mrs. Bauer has been retired for many years now, but both of my kids -- now in their late 20s -- also recall her fondly and talk about her and things that she taught them quite often.

Now, obviously, not every teacher is going to be a Mrs. Bauer. Both of my kids also had plenty of duds as teachers (as well as one or two truly horrible teachers).

But another lesson I learned from Mrs. Bauer: if every time you go into your child's classroom you're in battle mode thinking you always know what's best, it's a sure bet you'll probably miss learning important lessons yourself.

Last edited by RosieSD; 09-28-2017 at 10:17 AM..
 
Old 09-28-2017, 11:04 AM
 
6,922 posts, read 6,979,930 times
Reputation: 4335
Quote:
Originally Posted by loves2read View Post
But there were teachers that I taught with that IMO were bad teachers and drew almost no negative feedback from parents because they gave easy grades...never challenged students, let them get away with goofing off in class so had no discipline issues---
Parents never complained about those teachers...
As much as teachers try to argue that you should focus on learning rather than grades, the truth is that grades determine what college you get into, and what scholarships you get. So of course people are not going to complain when they get good grades, since that means more money. And, since parents are often the ones paying for college, good grades mean even more to parents than they do to the students. So of course parents are not going to complain about grades. Not saying this is how it should be, but it's how it is.
 
Old 09-28-2017, 11:11 AM
 
6,922 posts, read 6,979,930 times
Reputation: 4335
Quote:
Originally Posted by RosieSD View Post
Actually, since 1974, there's been a FEDERAL law called the Family Education Rights And Privacy Law (FERPA for short).

Under FERPA, any student attending a post-secondary institution (i.e. college, beyond high school) has the right to privacy of their post-secondary records, regardless of their age.

Students can opt to sign a form with their college giving their parents access to information about their records in college.

But unless a post-secondary student has signed that form, colleges MUST protect the privacy of all records for students, even if parents ask for them.

The age of a student is not an issue. It's the enrollment in a post-secondary institution that determines when FERPA applies.

FERPA states: "FERPA gives parents certain rights with respect to their children's education records. These rights transfer to the student when he or she reaches the age of 18 or attends a school beyond the high school level. "

So, even if your kid is 15 and enrolls in college, they are protected by FERPA and parents can't have access to their records, unless the student has signed the waiver granting their parents access.

I'm sure that's what the act says. But colleges don't always follow it that way, or at least they did not in the past. When I was a freshman in college (1997, quite a while after 1974), there was a student who was 17, and did not get along with his roommate. Since he was not yet 18, he was not allowed to switch to a different room unless his parents came to campus to sign a form. Since they lived out of state, several hours away, they were unable to do so. So, he was stuck with that roommate until his 18th birthday. The following year, there was a girl (not sure if she was 17 or 18, but you say it doesn't matter) whose parents got a call from the school, saying that she was using very few of her meal plan meals, and that they should switch her to a smaller meal plan. Her parents got the call since they were the ones paying for the meal plan. She was really upset, since she did not want her parents to know that she was skipping meals, and often eating off campus when she did eat.

Quote:
Granted, it is a crazy misnomer to call it the "Family" education rights act when it actually cuts parents off from access. And, yes, when a parent is paying the tuition, one would think you would continue to have control.

It's a balancing act, since an 18 year old is a legal adult, but it is often the parents paying the tuition.

Quote:
But, if you want to maintain access to your child's records once they enroll in a post-high school institution (i.e. college), you need to make sure that your child sign the FERPA waiver with the college. Usually, colleges make this available at freshmen orientation, but students can also ask for it at any time during their enrollment.

Never heard of that form. It was never mentioned when I was in college. Is the waiver a fairly new concept?

Quote:
Parents, however, cannot ask for the form themselves or force their kids to sign it. You can only suggest.

I wonder if any parents require their kids to sign the form as a condition for paying tuition.
 
Old 09-28-2017, 01:19 PM
 
8,351 posts, read 7,545,669 times
Reputation: 10937
Quote:
Originally Posted by mitsguy2001;49658577


[B
Never heard of that form. It was never mentioned when I was in college. Is the waiver a fairly new concept?
[/b]
Mitsguy2001, When did you go to college?

FERPA was made Federal law in 1974, so it's been around for 43 years.

You likely were given the waiver form, or told about it, in your freshman year of college, but perhaps didn't think it was necessary for your parents to have access to all of your college records, so you didn't sign it and thus don't remember it.

Now, there are some exceptions and ways that parents can have access to a college student's records, even if the student hasn't signed the waiver. For instance, if your child is subject to a disciplinary action by the college, FERPA gives parents the right to access all of the information related to the action up until your child turns 21. And, if you are still claiming your child on your Federal tax returns as a dependent (up until 21), you can also request your student's records under FERPA without the waiver in certain situations.

But, FERPA has other aspects that also apply to students in K-12.

For instance, for students who are in K-12, FERPA guarantees parents the right to access ALL records held by a school about a child. No waiver is required. So, if a school says you can't see a report that was written about your child, you can cite FERPA to get it.

FERPA also protects the privacy of your child's educational records. For instance, a teacher can't share your child's grades or disciplinary information with a third party under FERPA without your (the parent's) permission. That includes other parents.

Which brings me back to the original poster of this thread. I wonder if part of the reason the teachers she's suggested teaching methods to turned her off in part because of FERPA rules. In other words, there may be some related issues with telling a teacher that you know that X worked for a child that isn't your child so the teacher should do X for that child.
 
Old 09-28-2017, 01:32 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,119 posts, read 23,785,288 times
Reputation: 32519
Quote:
Originally Posted by 17thAndK View Post
As a society, we used to value the work of actual experts. Now we are told that experts are ivory tower elites who are out of touch with mainstream America. The dumb just keeps on coming.
I think one of the issues is that there is so much "knowledge" online that everyone feels they are more expert than they really area about many issues. Wanna fix your own dishwasher...go to YouTube. Wanna bone-up on the drugs and treatment your doctor is prescribing, do a Google seach. In many ways it's good, but the big issue is the danger of not even knowing what you don't know.
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