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Old 05-05-2018, 06:41 AM
 
9,952 posts, read 6,668,342 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SSeligman View Post
While I get that homeschooling may allow more abuse and uneducated parents "teaching" their kids nutty things/agendas, I just fail to see how public schools are any better than the homeschooling thing. To be frankly honest, I dont see this being an easy solution, but perhaps stopping the endless spending of money for public education with lack of real results could stop?
There are plenty of public schools that are excellent and there are plenty of public schools that are awful. One main difference I see in the US compared to places like Japan is that Japan does not let teachers stay in the same school indefinitely. They get transferred from school to school, typically on a 6-year rotation. If a school really fights for a teacher, he or she can stay ten years. If the teacher is a poor fit, he or she may go after three. However, the teachers really don’t have a choice of where they go and they are chosen based on their fit for the school. The competition to become a teacher is fierce as well. Depending on the subject, only 2-10% pass each year.

Meanwhile, in the U.S., the best teachers tend to go to the easy/wealthy schools, leaving kids in lower income areas typically with few teachers who stick around and really know the population. With the performance-based standards, it’s also not appealing for any teacher to stay there since they’re more likely to be fired if they are in a school where kids come from more challenging backgrounds 2-3 years behind.

 
Old 05-05-2018, 06:53 AM
 
Location: Pennsylvania
5,725 posts, read 11,711,762 times
Reputation: 9829
Quote:
Originally Posted by Radical_Thinker View Post
With my universal stipend, at least it'd be fair - every child gets the same dollar amount, regardless of where they live. But then again, I suppose society is meant to be unfair - especially for children.
And regardless of need or disability. It's not that society is unfair, but life is inherently unequal. Some kids are born into situations that set them up well for success, and others aren't. Public schools help bridge the gap. It's delusional to think that kids who are unruly at school or aren't succeeding are going to magically turn things around by not going to school.

'Different' is one term for your viewpoint, but not the most accurate one.
 
Old 05-05-2018, 08:07 AM
 
Location: Denver 'burbs
24,012 posts, read 28,448,855 times
Reputation: 41122
Betsy is that you?
 
Old 05-05-2018, 09:24 AM
 
Location: Atlanta, GA
995 posts, read 509,550 times
Reputation: 2170
Quote:
Originally Posted by maf763 View Post
And regardless of need or disability. It's not that society is unfair, but life is inherently unequal. Some kids are born into situations that set them up well for success, and others aren't. Public schools help bridge the gap. It's delusional to think that kids who are unruly at school or aren't succeeding are going to magically turn things around by not going to school.

'Different' is one term for your viewpoint, but not the most accurate one.
I think it's delusional that keeping these kids - who simply do not want to learn - in school, cramming down the times tables they forget that very afternoon - is the right thing to do. Is this a good use of scarce resources? How about we send these kids to sports and music camp, where they can be fed and taught to get along with others, and maybe learn a thing or two along the way? Forget trying to teach algebra to a student who's hating every second of it. They're going to forget what they've been forced to endure in the classroom, every single time.

I'm not saying get rid of schools, quite the opposite. I'm saying get rid of the system which places control with non-educators (those overpaid bureaucrats working at the local School Board Complex). Let teachers teach the best way they know how. Let kids pick what they want to learn. Let parents have control with how their kids are taught - and disciplined. If they don't want to learn it, trust me, they're not going to learn it.

Someday, we'll have a reckoning with how we teach children when the money runs out (and it will - just a matter of time.) Better to think about these things now then freaking out when local school boards shut down public schools in March of each year due to lack of funds.
 
Old 05-05-2018, 09:37 AM
 
Location: State of Transition
102,193 posts, read 107,823,938 times
Reputation: 116097
The OP is assuming that every family can afford to have one parent at home, schooling the kids. This is not the case. Most couples need two incomes to provide for the family adequately. The OP is also assuming that all households would have two parents. These are fantasy or wishful thinking. Not a good thing to base public policy on.

Last edited by Ruth4Truth; 05-05-2018 at 09:57 AM..
 
Old 05-05-2018, 09:40 AM
 
Location: State of Transition
102,193 posts, read 107,823,938 times
Reputation: 116097
Quote:
Originally Posted by Radical_Thinker View Post
I think it's delusional that keeping these kids - who simply do not want to learn - in school, cramming down the times tables they forget that very afternoon - is the right thing to do. .
Who would school them? If you take them out of public school, where would they find a teacher? In most of those cases, the parent is working, sometimes two jobs, at that, to provide for the kids. Before there were public schools, there was child labor. Kids worked, sometimes in factories with the parents. That's no longer lawful. Society decided it's much more important to have an educated populace across the board. This is why the public school system was created.
 
Old 05-05-2018, 10:42 AM
 
Location: Florida
7,195 posts, read 5,723,533 times
Reputation: 12342
Okay, I see what the OP is saying. He’s advocating for more Sudbury-style schools. Which I thoroughly support, for families who want them.
 
Old 05-05-2018, 11:04 AM
 
21,382 posts, read 7,938,426 times
Reputation: 18149
Quote:
Originally Posted by SSeligman View Post
While I get that homeschooling may allow more abuse and uneducated parents "teaching" their kids nutty things/agendas, I just fail to see how public schools are any better than the homeschooling thing. To be frankly honest, I dont see this being an easy solution, but perhaps stopping the endless spending of money for public education with lack of real results could stop?

More nutty than teaching kids that walking out of school is OK? That boys can be girls and girls can be boys? Sex education at 12 y old?

Where is the actual EDUCATION of these kids? Why aren't they able to read, write and do math once they get their diploma???
 
Old 05-05-2018, 11:08 AM
 
21,382 posts, read 7,938,426 times
Reputation: 18149
Quote:
Originally Posted by WRM20 View Post
No homework? Match and reading are like any other skill, if you don't practice, you will suck at them.



Better educated at home? That's laughable. unless you think well educated means being able to read the Bible and do simple arithmetic.

There have been public schools for centuries.
You haven't met any homeschoolers. Get out more, look around. There is an entire secular homeschooling movement.

Did you know colleges are actively recruiting homeschoolers because they tend to be better at critical thinking? They have passions and businesses? Some even have AA degrees by the time they are 18.

Mandatory public schooling is a modern concept. And it was at that point that kids started learning less. Although they are taught how to vote in kindergarten and how to be activists by 5th grade.

Critical thinking, math, reading and writing ... not so much.
 
Old 05-05-2018, 11:10 AM
 
Location: Denver 'burbs
24,012 posts, read 28,448,855 times
Reputation: 41122
Quote:
Originally Posted by newtovenice View Post
More nutty than teaching kids that walking out of school is OK? That boys can be girls and girls can be boys? Sex education at 12 y old?

Where is the actual EDUCATION of these kids? Why aren't they able to read, write and do math once they get their diploma???
Kids who aren't able to do that were failed by their parents first and foremost.

What's your answer to that?
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