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Old 12-22-2018, 11:22 PM
 
Location: Las Vegas
13,552 posts, read 24,490,521 times
Reputation: 25151

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I would encourage the trades too. One can become a journeyman electrician in about 3 years. Then you can hang out your own shingle if you want, or work for someone else. I think you would probably do OK just putting ads on craigslist.

Then you can go to college. Study what you want to study and pay for it up front. Learn for the joy of learning. Get a degree or don't. It doesn't matter.

If you want, go work in that new field you studied. If you don't like it, quit. You would always have a real skill to fall back one that would never fail to support you.
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Old 12-22-2018, 11:40 PM
 
Location: Colorado Springs
19,605 posts, read 9,232,411 times
Reputation: 18843
Quote:
Originally Posted by yellowsnow View Post
I would encourage the trades too. One can become a journeyman electrician in about 3 years. Then you can hang out your own shingle if you want, or work for someone else. I think you would probably do OK just putting ads on craigslist.

Then you can go to college. Study what you want to study and pay for it up front. Learn for the joy of learning. Get a degree or don't. It doesn't matter.

If you want, go work in that new field you studied. If you don't like it, quit. You would always have a real skill to fall back one that would never fail to support you.
I can see logic to that.
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Old Yesterday, 12:05 AM
 
Location: Sierra Nevada Land, CA
8,090 posts, read 8,660,502 times
Reputation: 12211
Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post

I showed data, you apparently have none.
You didn’t show me data. You showed a link from an article in USA Today. Perhaps the most vapid and shallow print newspaper. USA Today is what they pass out at motels. If you don’t think people should go into the trades don’t complain when you can’t find a plumber or skilled auto mechanic.

I’ve never read of trained plumbers or mechanics still living with their parents at age 30

Last edited by Mr5150; Yesterday at 12:17 AM..
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Old Yesterday, 12:54 AM
 
Location: Colorado Springs
19,605 posts, read 9,232,411 times
Reputation: 18843
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post
You didnít show me data. You showed a link from an article in USA Today. Perhaps the most vapid and shallow print newspaper. USA Today is what they pass out at motels. If you donít think people should go into the trades donít complain when you canít find a plumber or skilled auto mechanic.

Iíve never read of trained plumbers or mechanics still living with their parents at age 30
The article had data. You have none. Period.

https://www.bls.gov/opub/ted/2017/hi...nd-quarter.htm
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Old Yesterday, 04:08 AM
 
Location: Honolulu, HI
5,145 posts, read 1,343,979 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post
about a career path I would say, well you can either go to college rack up a boatload of student debt and maybe not find a job in your chosen field or worse yet find yourself working at Starbucks.

Or consider the trades.
So in your world only a college degree with debt or a trade school with debt are the only options?

There's this thing called military service, and they will pay for your undergrad AND graduate degree 100%.

I understand some people are too lazy to put in the elbow grease to get a free degree (military service), but no one said success was easy.

I would never go to a trade school. Spend all that wasted time and money only for the employer to ask if you have a bachelors degree, or that you need to get one in order to make management one day.

No thanks, I'll do things the "boring old-fashion" way with my free college degree hanging on my wall and easy military service.

Last edited by toobusytoday; Yesterday at 09:00 AM.. Reason: removed the word, "simple".
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Old Yesterday, 07:49 AM
 
Location: Sandpoint, Idaho
2,889 posts, read 5,128,641 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post
about a career path I would say, well you can either go to college rack up a boatload of student debt and maybe not find a job in your chosen field or worse yet find yourself working at Starbucks.

Or consider the trades. Minimal student debt, one to two years of education (and in certain programs, they pay you after the first year) and you can live anywhere and make good money, plus you can easily find a job. In my area electricians and plumbers make $80,000 to $100,000 a year. My auto mechanic owns four houses and he is his own boss working 40 hours a week.


I even saw an article about painters and maintenance workers in urban areas making close to $150K a year.


For the record I am a college grad. But 30 years ago having a degree was a ticket to making a good living. Not so much today. I think high school counselors are doing kids a disservice buy say you gotta go to college to make it.
What I have discovered is that regardless of path, hard working, diligent and ambitious people do extremely well. Those who go through the motions, think they are entitled, or who approach life as a checklist do mediocre a bet. Those who struggle and cannot face reality do poorly.

I know many multimillionaires who were high school grads in the trades. And I know many with masters and doctoral degrees working retail.

On those pushing "college is a necessity" should be charged with a crime against humanity.

So says the old fart with a couple of grad degrees.
S.
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Old Yesterday, 08:59 AM
 
5,959 posts, read 3,188,932 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocko20 View Post
So in your simple world only a college degree with debt or a trade school with debt are the only options?

There's this thing called military service, and they will pay for your undergrad AND graduate degree 100%.
...
We do need to point out that in many, perhaps most states, trade school is free or very low cost. And as a vet myself, I don't recommend military service to everyone. I have to ask myself would I want this person to have my back and if I can't answer "yes" for myself, then I can't do that to the current troops.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sandpointian View Post
...On those pushing "college is a necessity" should be charged with a crime against humanity.

...
I don't know if I'd go that far, but I do get the sentiment. They see the numbers, but don't understand what they mean. Or as I see often, someone get's pushed into a STEM field like engineering, but doesn't have the mind for it. They may graduate with the degree, but they don't really think like an engineer for example. And so eventually wind up in a different field "underemployed" when the reality is they never should have gotten that degree to start with.
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Old Yesterday, 09:06 AM
 
12,484 posts, read 27,325,514 times
Reputation: 7001
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post
about a career path I would say, well you can either go to college rack up a boatload of student debt and maybe not find a job in your chosen field or worse yet find yourself working at Starbucks.

Or consider the trades. Minimal student debt, one to two years of education (and in certain programs, they pay you after the first year) and you can live anywhere and make good money, plus you can easily find a job. In my area electricians and plumbers make $80,000 to $100,000 a year. My auto mechanic owns four houses and he is his own boss working 40 hours a week.

I even saw an article about painters and maintenance workers in urban areas making close to $150K a year.

For the record I am a college grad. But 30 years ago having a degree was a ticket to making a good living. Not so much today. I think high school counselors are doing kids a disservice buy say you gotta go to college to make it.
I think you are making a common mistake and assuming that all High Schools around the country are still just pushing the college only path for HS students. In my own school district, which is pretty affluent, there has been more acceptance of trade schools among students, parents and the guidance counselors. We have an excellent technical school that serves two counties and students graduate with the promise of jobs in hand or the opportunity to go for more education, including four year colleges.

It's hard to figure out a career path as a teenager no matter if you are thinking of a skilled trade or a specific major for college. The most important thing to do is to help your own student navigate the path.
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Old Yesterday, 09:54 AM
 
9,759 posts, read 7,590,530 times
Reputation: 23885
Hasn't this been discussed ad nauseum? Heck, we can't even get people to acknowledge that student loans are optional.
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Old Yesterday, 10:01 AM
 
Location: Saint John, IN
10,736 posts, read 3,467,452 times
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There are ways of going to college for free and not getting in debt. One can earn scholarships and there are now several states where as long as you live there you can go for free. Many countries offer this too. Working in a trade is a good option, but that's not good for all either!
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