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Old 01-12-2019, 11:19 PM
 
5 posts, read 308 times
Reputation: 15

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Hi,

I was hoping some people that have more experience with administrative stuff could help me with this. I think it's completely bogus, and wholly unfair. Let me try to explain the issue without being too long-winded.

My school has an excellent Health Sciences program (as far a job placement goes, at least) and I have been keen on becoming a Radiologic Technologist for a year or so now. For this semester--Spring 2019--I had issues with transportation, so I couldn't attend the pre-req class I needed in order to apply, Basic Anatomy and Physiology. The transportation issue is going to be fixed in a few weeks (My wife and I share a single car.)

No worries, I thought, I'll take the classes during the summer (I'll be taking two other classes that aren't needed to apply), now that Pell is year-round. The literature states that as long as you are enrolled in the class you need, or have it completed, you can apply for the program. What isn't so obvious, is that the deadline to apply is April 30th. It used to be March 31st. They changed it for some reason, I don't know why. Summer classes start May 20th. Fall classes start August 15th. Summer classes end July 31st.

20 days. That's the difference between me having a shot at acceptance (I have 54 credit hours, 4.0GPA), and starting in Fall of this year, versus having to wait and hope I get accepted for the Fall of 2020.

20 days, is robbing me of--according to BLS--between $40,000 to $56,800. That's the low end, and the median salary for RT's. I say this with great certainty, as the college website statistics have a 99% ARRT certification success rate over the past 5 years. Meaning if I got in, I'd almost certainly become licensed. Having to wait a whole year robs me of not just the money, but momentum, hopes, dreams, etc. 20 days!!!!

The Spring 2019 students get to apply. They haven't finished their classes yet. How on earth is it fair that Summer students, who have to do the same amount of work in 6 less weeks, are robbed of the chance to apply while they haven't completed their classes yet, either?

I hope I'm making sense here. I'm very frustrated. I've written the dean, but it being the weekend, I don't expect to hear from her until Monday or Tuesday. In the mean time, I was hoping to get some other perspectives, whether you agree with me or not, that this is BS. I feel like I'm being cheated after all the hard-work I've put in to get where I am today.

What if I don't get anywhere with the Dean of Health Sciences? Should I appeal to the very top? What are your opinions?
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Old 01-13-2019, 10:26 AM
 
Location: Colorado Springs
19,814 posts, read 9,353,517 times
Reputation: 18963
I don't understand why you think you get to personally decide the policies of the institution.
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Old 01-13-2019, 01:40 PM
 
6,071 posts, read 3,251,608 times
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Pre-reqs are normal for a lot of programs and have been for decades. Engineering and science degrees for example has long had prescribed sequences where if you missed one, you had to wait a year for it to come around again. It isn't about summer students or any other group, but getting the pre-req.

Maybe the school is willing to waive it or maybe not. What happens if they give you a slot in the program and then you don't complete the class this summer?

This is also why I advise anyone looking to CC as a way to skip the first two years to take a real close look at the pre-reqs. They can finish up two years at the CC and still have three years to go.
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Old 01-13-2019, 01:46 PM
 
10 posts, read 2,491 times
Reputation: 15
I don't get to decide. I do get to question them though. Have you ever questioned anything you thought was unfair? If not, why not? Do you think things just change on their own?
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Old 01-13-2019, 01:55 PM
 
Location: Aurora Denveralis
4,615 posts, read 1,530,574 times
Reputation: 6616
A petition for a waiver is your only option; with luck, the dean will understand and have the power to grant it.
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Old 01-13-2019, 02:02 PM
 
10 posts, read 2,491 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tnff View Post
Pre-reqs are normal for a lot of programs and have been for decades. Engineering and science degrees for example has long had prescribed sequences where if you missed one, you had to wait a year for it to come around again. It isn't about summer students or any other group, but getting the pre-req.

Maybe the school is willing to waive it or maybe not. What happens if they give you a slot in the program and then you don't complete the class this summer?

This is also why I advise anyone looking to CC as a way to skip the first two years to take a real close look at the pre-reqs. They can finish up two years at the CC and still have three years to go.
Thanks for the reply. I understand where you are coming from if I don't complete the class. It appears they have the same issue with Spring students, but they say that it is rare. I don't have the exact quote with me, so I'll paraphrase, "In the rare event a student who is accepted does not complete the requirements (CPR, First Aid, Prereqs) etc, we will notify any student(s) who fell just outside the points list of their acceptance." Would be easy enough to include summer applicants in that camp as well I would think. Hopefully I can get a waiver as you mentioned.

Initially, I was a transfer student. I was going to the CC because their classes are so much cheaper than the university in the same town, and the classes transfer over to any school in the country, no problem. North Carolina schools especially, though. I can't remember the name, but it's an agreement all the CCs have with the state schools. Not sure if it's like that in other states.
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Old 01-13-2019, 03:03 PM
 
Location: Colorado Springs
19,814 posts, read 9,353,517 times
Reputation: 18963
Quote:
Originally Posted by wavewrangler View Post
I don't get to decide. I do get to question them though. Have you ever questioned anything you thought was unfair? If not, why not? Do you think things just change on their own?

I think you're trying to paint yourself as the victim here. I assume their policies are published in advance. I assume that other students are working within the system.

I think you assume that classes just happen. Colleges plan course calendars sometimes two years in advance since professors have to be assigned classes, and in some cases professors even need to be hired. In addition, course loads have to be restricted in some classes.

Usually there are good reasons for deadlines. As a principal of a school, I eliminated a few glaring examples of problems when the whole reason certain rules were maintained seemed to be well that's the way we do it. But for the most part, there were good reasons for deadlines and policies.

In your case, I don't see what the big "unfairness" is. My goodness, I managed to make my way through 4 college degrees and survived deadlines and policies...and sometimes it wasn't convenient.
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Old 01-13-2019, 03:15 PM
 
Location: Aurora Denveralis
4,615 posts, read 1,530,574 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
My goodness, I managed to make my way through 4 college degrees and survived deadlines and policies...and sometimes it wasn't convenient.
My oldest took 7 years to get through Cal Poly because he flunked one critical math course and then had to play wait-a-semester for over three years. It can be a bear.

But I think the OP has a reasonable case for a waiver; he will have completed the prereq by fall.
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Old 01-13-2019, 03:40 PM
 
5 posts, read 308 times
Reputation: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
As a principal of a school, I eliminated a few glaring examples of problems when the whole reason certain rules were maintained seemed to be well that's the way we do it. But for the most part, there were good reasons for deadlines and policies.
I know that this is sometimes the case, which is why I initiated a discussion with the dean. The goal of the letter was to open a discussion on whether or not the reasons for this particular deadline outweigh the potential positives.

One thing I do know for sure, is if you sit back, and don't question things, you are doing yourself a disservice. However, there is certainly a proper way to go about it, and an improper way. Sometimes that line is fine, sometimes there is a gray area. It depends. I am petitioning it the best and most proper way that I know how, and that's all I can do.

Also, when one policy changes, it sometimes leads to other policies associated with that policy to begin with, to fall between the cracks and not be updated to reflect the initial policy change, and sometimes this needs to be brought to the attention of those who determine what said policies are. That's what I'm doing.

The policy I am referring to, is year-round Pell. That was not an option before Summer of last year. Now that schools are essentially year-round schools, as a majority of the students rely on Pell to attend their classes (at my school--I work-studied in the Financial Aid department so I'm very familiar with the stats.) So now, one of my main questions, is due to that change, should the deadline be updated to include summer students as well? Enrollment is sure to go up. Is it in the student's best interest that the policy be changed? I think so, but I may be bias on the matter. Heck, I am biased on the matter, but I am trying to look at it objectively as well. After all, the school is there to serve the students, and vice-versa, if you're a model student, at least.

That's what I hope to find out from the Dean. If anyone is interested, I will keep the thread updated.
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Old 01-13-2019, 07:53 PM
 
Location: Southern New Hampshire
6,851 posts, read 12,031,420 times
Reputation: 20043
OP, I work at a college and actually am chair of my department this year. If you asked me for an exception due to your circumstances, I would be very likely to grant it -- so I wish you luck.

=====

One quick thing, though -- in this thread you appear to be writing under 2 different names (you started out "wind3d" but became "wavewrangler" in post #4, then stayed that for a couple of posts, then went back to "wind3d"). Just a heads-up that that can be confusing when people are trying to understand the posts in a thread; C-D also frowns on this (i.e. one person having more than 1 account). So for clarity's sake, please use only 1 name in a particular thread!
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