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Old 06-19-2019, 09:30 PM
 
6,643 posts, read 1,962,766 times
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Interesting piece. But, still, the first thing I thought of was the common concept of grading on the curve.



Why Canít Everyone Get Aís?
Excellence is not a zero sum game

By Alfie Kohn

Suppose that next year virtually every student passed the tests. What would the reaction be from politicians, businesspeople, the media? Would these people shake their heads in admiration and say, ďDamn, those teachers must be good!Ē?

Of course not. Such remarkable success would be cited as evidence that the tests were too easy

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/15/o...sultPosition=1

https://trendingpress.com/why-cant-everyone-get-as/

Opinion | Why Can
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Old 06-19-2019, 09:58 PM
 
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Well, if they were given A's by the same standardized tests as were earned in the years before, I think it would caused some raised eyebrows - but if these same kids passed again, it might be considered real advances in excellent teaching skills.

*shrugs*
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Old 06-20-2019, 06:20 AM
 
Location: Texas
35,208 posts, read 19,266,750 times
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Quote:
"Why Can’t Everyone Get A’s?"
Same reason everyone can't high jump 6 feet.

People have differing abilities.

Any "test" that measures them all the same would have no validity.

Next easy question, please.
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Old 06-20-2019, 08:36 AM
 
Location: Grosse Ile Michigan
26,513 posts, read 62,899,137 times
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The entire point of grades is to differentiate those who stand out from average, above average, below average and people who belong in some other pursuit. If everyone is going to get As, then just abolish grades entirely.
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Old 06-20-2019, 08:24 PM
 
1,043 posts, read 217,464 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coldjensens View Post
The entire point of grades is to differentiate those who stand out from average, above average, below average and people who belong in some other pursuit. If everyone is going to get As, then just abolish grades entirely.
As far as higher education has gone to coddle and create a "safe space" for the little darlings, I could actually see most schools going away from grades entirely. It is all a joke. It might sound insane, but think about how insane things have gotten over the last 5 years or so.....

Here are 10 schools that have already done away with traditional grading.....

Link
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Old 06-21-2019, 03:15 PM
 
Location: Grosse Ile Michigan
26,513 posts, read 62,899,137 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by heart84 View Post
As far as higher education has gone to coddle and create a "safe space" for the little darlings, I could actually see most schools going away from grades entirely. It is all a joke. It might sound insane, but think about how insane things have gotten over the last 5 years or so.....

Here are 10 schools that have already done away with traditional grading.....

Link
Of them only Brown has any name recognition. there are lots and lots of little flaky schools out there that will offer nay sort of program students with loan money want to have. Some students will do fine at those little flaky schools because they would do fine anywhere, or even nowhere (self educating). most will end up selling shoes.

Maybe more and more schools will go this route though. we seem to be moving to using test scores as a far more meaningful measurement of achievement/ability than grades.
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Old 06-21-2019, 03:32 PM
 
Location: Australia
889 posts, read 325,888 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by heart84 View Post
As far as higher education has gone to coddle and create a "safe space" for the little darlings, I could actually see most schools going away from grades entirely. It is all a joke. It might sound insane, but think about how insane things have gotten over the last 5 years or so.....

Here are 10 schools that have already done away with traditional grading.....

Link
Someone has just brought out a study here of why Asian students, especially Chinese, outperform everyone else in standardised tests and completely dominate selective high schools.

Wow, they found out they work harder, especially at home.

We needed a study to know that!!! Next some will decide we don't want to know this so let's stop the testing!
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Old 06-21-2019, 09:57 PM
 
Location: We_tside PNW (Columbia Gorge) / CO / SA TX / Thailand
22,527 posts, read 39,903,732 times
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Been to school lately?

About everyone who 'shows-up' gets an A (Including college).

Pretty sad (for hiring managers who who like to get someone who is 'educated'. (showed initiative)

Once you hire them. Oops... too late.
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Old 06-22-2019, 05:46 AM
 
Location: DFW - Coppell / Las Colinas
31,970 posts, read 36,594,800 times
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Why can't all those kids with "A's" get in to Med School, become heart Surgeons and do your open heart surgery?

Just think, we could then shop around for the cheapest bid.
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Old 06-22-2019, 07:29 AM
 
6,838 posts, read 3,708,603 times
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His final statement, his real thesis, is simply incorrect: " Everyone may not succeed, but at least in theory all of us could."
No, not everyone could succeed, even in theory. His whole thesis is simply demonstrably false.

The real problem with articles like this one, is that some parts of it are true. But taken out of context and misrepresented. For example, the implication "implication is that “high standards” really means “standards that all students will never be able to meet” is correct, but not for the reason he weaves into the storyline. Not because the standards are impossibly high, but because no matter how low you make the standards, there will still be some who simply cannot meet them.

The "standard" needs to be defined by "what are the knowledges and skills needed to be a functioning independent adult in modern society?" There was always be some who "meet standards." Some who "far exceed standards." And some who "failed to meet standards." No amount of wishful thinking and falsely stated "thought experiments" is going to change that reality.
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