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Old 02-06-2022, 07:02 PM
 
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What do you think "liberal education" means?

I've always considered that it refered to a broad education that encompassed things like fine arts and liberal arts, as opposed to a straight-and-narrow study of something like chemistry.

But here's what this Louis Menand thinks:


What’s So Great About Great-Books Courses?
The humanities are in danger, but humanists can’t agree on how—or why—they should be saved.

Virtually every course at an élite school like Columbia, from poetry to physics, is part of a liberal education. “Liberal” just means free and disinterested. It means that inquiry is pursued without fear or favor, regardless of the outcome and whatever the field of study. Universities exist to protect that freedom.
https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2...cuing-socrates
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Old 02-06-2022, 07:07 PM
 
Location: Rochester, WA
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Universities haven't protected that freedom in decades.
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Old 02-06-2022, 07:35 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cida View Post
What do you think "liberal education" means?

I've always considered that it refered to a broad education that encompassed things like fine arts and liberal arts, as opposed to a straight-and-narrow study of something like chemistry.
]
The flaw is in thinking a program like chemistry, or physics, or engineering is somehow "narrow" and a "liberal" education is broader.
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Old 02-06-2022, 08:52 PM
 
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Liberal education originally meant the education that free people (not slaves) received. In other words, the aristocrats of ancient Athens. "Liberal" didn't mean expansive or disinterested; those are modern retcons. It meant "not for a slave".

The liberal arts study subjects that most people would like to study, if they didn't need to worry about making a living. On this very forum, which is a volunteer effort (unpaid for all), which topics are most popular? It ain't the science and technology subforum. People just find discussing philosophy, politics, economics, literature, psychology et al more interesting than technical subjects.

That's probably because the "grading rubric", so to speak, is a lot more flexible for the liberal arts. The topics are also more relatable since almost everyone has pondered the questions.

I think the liberal arts can be taught with or without the great books. Great books curricula are situated more within the canon wars battlefield than they are within the liberal/applied arts dichotomy.
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Old 02-07-2022, 12:49 AM
 
Location: Orange County, CA
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Liberal arts includes chemistry. (And physics, biology, mathematics,...)
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Old 02-07-2022, 12:55 AM
 
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Originally Posted by DrPibbs View Post
Liberal arts includes chemistry. (And physics, biology, mathematics,...)
And language. Great books programs are really only for very intelligent people who intend to go on to MA or PHD programs. People who are not very intelligent benefit little, or about the same as any college program. Very intelligent and gifted people can gain a lot of depth from such programs, assuming those teaching the classes really know what they are doing.
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Old 02-07-2022, 01:51 AM
 
Location: midwest
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Liberal education is the propagation of obsolete culture.

The Laws of Physics do not care about culture.

The Tyranny of Words by Stuart Chase an MIT graduate

C P Snow put literary culture in its place but pseudo-intellectuals refuse to die.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Two_Cultures
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Old 02-07-2022, 09:33 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by psikeyhackr View Post
Liberal education is the propagation of obsolete culture.

The Laws of Physics do not care about culture.

The Tyranny of Words by Stuart Chase an MIT graduate

C P Snow put literary culture in its place but pseudo-intellectuals refuse to die.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Two_Cultures
I think this gets close to the main difference.

I for one do not lump the sciences in with the liberal arts. I know many do, but I think that is a leftover from a previous era.

Cognitively I see the liberal arts as requiring high verbal skills, while the sciences and technology require high quantitative and spatial skills. To clarify, the liberal arts are defined as being "verbal alone". Since psychometrically the distinction between these skill sets is pretty well established, I think it's a better foundation for dividing up the disciplines than the org chart of a university. The latter is often influenced by past precedent which may now be outdated, internal politics, status jockeying, and funding divisions.

In the trenches the differences between a degree in English and a degree in chemistry are vast. Meanwhile the differences between a degree in chemistry and a degree in chemical engineering are not so vast. I have also found there is more affinity and camaraderie between scientists and engineers, than there is between scientists and literary critics for example.
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Old 02-07-2022, 09:01 PM
 
Location: midwest
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Originally Posted by Avondalist View Post
Meanwhile the differences between a degree in chemistry and a degree in chemical engineering are not so vast.

Engineering is science but with loud noises.
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Old 02-07-2022, 09:10 PM
 
Location: midwest
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Originally Posted by DrPibbs View Post
Liberal arts includes chemistry. (And physics, biology, mathematics,...)
Rubbish! That might have been the case when people were making a big deal about Aristotle. Educated people had to know Latin. You can still find some who claim it is important.

When technologically advanced aliens show up to conquer the planet will they know Latin?
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