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Old 04-12-2023, 05:49 PM
 
Location: Arizona
2,548 posts, read 2,183,625 times
Reputation: 3888

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Admittedly, my time in school was a long time ago, but a grade of zero was handed out if it was deserved. I see that things have really changed in the meantime:

"In an interview with local news outlet WPTV, Tirado explained that she had been hired during the 2018 summer break to teach eighth-grade social studies at the Florida school. She had spent 17 years as a teacher, with education experience in different grades and classrooms, both online and in-person.

Only in her first year at West Gate, Tirado said she had been fired for ignoring the school's "No Zero" policy, which is printed in the student and parent handbook as “no zeroes – lowest possible grade is 50%.”

Tirado was forced to learn about the policy after some of her students didn't complete an assignment that she had given them two weeks to do. As a result, the school chose to fire Tirado."


https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/8t...6d92790c&ei=10
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Old 04-12-2023, 06:17 PM
 
Location: On the Chesapeake
44,716 posts, read 59,606,344 times
Reputation: 60244
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slater View Post
Admittedly, my time in school was a long time ago, but a grade of zero was handed out if it was deserved. I see that things have really changed in the meantime:

"In an interview with local news outlet WPTV, Tirado explained that she had been hired during the 2018 summer break to teach eighth-grade social studies at the Florida school. She had spent 17 years as a teacher, with education experience in different grades and classrooms, both online and in-person.

Only in her first year at West Gate, Tirado said she had been fired for ignoring the school's "No Zero" policy, which is printed in the student and parent handbook as “no zeroes – lowest possible grade is 50%.”

Tirado was forced to learn about the policy after some of her students didn't complete an assignment that she had given them two weeks to do. As a result, the school chose to fire Tirado."


https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/8t...6d92790c&ei=10
The theory, and it's correct as far as it goes, is that the zeroes will get the kid so far behind that nothing he does will get him a passing grade. That now becomes a "Then what?", meaning that that kid who's already failed the quarter by the third week is still going to be in the class and, in a lot of cases, wreaking havoc because he's got nothing to lose.

Yeah, you can send him to the office. Twice. After that the kid gets kicked back to the class with a note from the Administrator that your job is provide the student with "meaningful and engaging lessons which allow him to succeed".

My (former) system was toying with the 50% minimum before I retired. They adopted it after I pulled the pin but at least a kid who turned in nothing still got a zero. Hand in anything and he got the 50%.

I might note that the high school I taught at for my last 26 years was a middle/upper middle class school and we had kids that entire time who would do absolutely nothing. Early on they eventually were eased out but that changed with subsequent Principals and policies.
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Old 04-12-2023, 07:19 PM
 
12,512 posts, read 8,731,743 times
Reputation: 34270
Quote:
Originally Posted by North Beach Person View Post
The theory, and it's correct as far as it goes, is that the zeroes will get the kid so far behind that nothing he does will get him a passing grade. That now becomes a "Then what?", meaning that that kid who's already failed the quarter by the third week is still going to be in the class and, in a lot of cases, wreaking havoc because he's got nothing to lose.

Yeah, you can send him to the office. Twice. After that the kid gets kicked back to the class with a note from the Administrator that your job is provide the student with "meaningful and engaging lessons which allow him to succeed".

My (former) system was toying with the 50% minimum before I retired. They adopted it after I pulled the pin but at least a kid who turned in nothing still got a zero. Hand in anything and he got the 50%.

I might note that the high school I taught at for my last 26 years was a middle/upper middle class school and we had kids that entire time who would do absolutely nothing. Early on they eventually were eased out but that changed with subsequent Principals and policies.
I'd say a kid who does that little to be failing by the third week, doesn't care enough to ever turn anything around. Probably been wreaking havoc all along. If the kid has a true psychological or mental issue, they need to be out of the class and into a proper setting to provide the help they need. If it's a case of "don't give a damn," then they need to be out of the school and out of the way of the other students who do care to learn.
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Old 04-12-2023, 07:40 PM
 
Location: On the Chesapeake
44,716 posts, read 59,606,344 times
Reputation: 60244
Quote:
Originally Posted by tnff View Post
I'd say a kid who does that little to be failing by the third week, doesn't care enough to ever turn anything around. Probably been wreaking havoc all along. If the kid has a true psychological or mental issue, they need to be out of the class and into a proper setting to provide the help they need. If it's a case of "don't give a damn," then they need to be out of the school and out of the way of the other students who do care to learn.
All correct. And? You know it doesn't happen, although it used to, and it doesn't look to change any time soon.
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Old 04-12-2023, 07:42 PM
 
Location: NMB, SC
41,107 posts, read 16,859,513 times
Reputation: 33884
Quote:
Originally Posted by tnff View Post
I'd say a kid who does that little to be failing by the third week, doesn't care enough to ever turn anything around. Probably been wreaking havoc all along. If the kid has a true psychological or mental issue, they need to be out of the class and into a proper setting to provide the help they need. If it's a case of "don't give a damn," then they need to be out of the school and out of the way of the other students who do care to learn.
Private schools can do that and they do but public schools....no such luck.
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Old 04-12-2023, 07:43 PM
 
Location: Knoxville, TN
10,483 posts, read 5,356,919 times
Reputation: 20691
Teachers are quitting in droves due to chaotic classrooms, discipline, and post-Covid issues. We are on a verge of a serious teacher shortage. But lets fire some more techers for doing their jobs.
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Old 04-12-2023, 07:54 PM
 
Location: EPWV
19,171 posts, read 9,328,650 times
Reputation: 20978
What’s she supposed to give out? Trophies?

I didn’t realize the 0 tolerance policy extended to grades. It used to mean stuff like no smoking,No fighting, no drugs. Ican understand those families that choose to home school.
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Old 04-12-2023, 09:51 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
49,887 posts, read 23,631,391 times
Reputation: 32384
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slater View Post
Admittedly, my time in school was a long time ago, but a grade of zero was handed out if it was deserved. I see that things have really changed in the meantime:

"In an interview with local news outlet WPTV, Tirado explained that she had been hired during the 2018 summer break to teach eighth-grade social studies at the Florida school. She had spent 17 years as a teacher, with education experience in different grades and classrooms, both online and in-person.

Only in her first year at West Gate, Tirado said she had been fired for ignoring the school's "No Zero" policy, which is printed in the student and parent handbook as “no zeroes – lowest possible grade is 50%.”

Tirado was forced to learn about the policy after some of her students didn't complete an assignment that she had given them two weeks to do. As a result, the school chose to fire Tirado."


https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/8t...6d92790c&ei=10
I'm not exactly sure what point you're making. But...

1. I agree in giving zeroes for work not completed. But I have known of schools decades ago that had the same policy described here. I never liked it, never believed in it, although I do understand the concept, that a student can get so far behind in a semester they can never catch up. I always let students do or re-do work up till the last week of the quarter, which, in my view, solved that problem. But keep in mind that a 50% is still an F.

2. 17 years doesn't tell us how good a teacher she was. I've worked with teachers who were lousy and taught longer than that. Maybe she was great. Or maybe she wasn't.

3. So let's see...she broke her contract by ignoring official school policy and got fired. I think that was an over-reaction, but she did fail to fulfill her agreement to fulfill school and district policies. I'll tell you what may have been going on here...or not...maybe that was the excuse to fire her, rather than the real reason(s).
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Old 04-12-2023, 09:53 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
49,887 posts, read 23,631,391 times
Reputation: 32384
Quote:
Originally Posted by tnff View Post
I'd say a kid who does that little to be failing by the third week, doesn't care enough to ever turn anything around. Probably been wreaking havoc all along. If the kid has a true psychological or mental issue, they need to be out of the class and into a proper setting to provide the help they need. If it's a case of "don't give a damn," then they need to be out of the school and out of the way of the other students who do care to learn.
But they are children.
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Old 04-12-2023, 09:54 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
49,887 posts, read 23,631,391 times
Reputation: 32384
Quote:
Originally Posted by cat1116 View Post
What’s she supposed to give out? Trophies?

I didn’t realize the 0 tolerance policy extended to grades. It used to mean stuff like no smoking,No fighting, no drugs. Ican understand those families that choose to home school.
This concept is nothing new. I saw it 40 years ago and more.
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